00:05 <cloudowind> most the packages ive compiled for my own little linux distro belongs to gnu

00:06 <cloudowind> i do see gnu as other part of linux , it completes linux am i wrong?

00:08 <heat> two categories of GNU packages: 1) maintained and worked on by unpaid voluntary contributors

00:08 <heat> 2) maintained and worked on by big corporate backing (gcc, glibc, etc)

01:27 <cloudowind> those volunteers i do admire

01:28 <cloudowind> uhm hes gone

01:29 <kof673> heat reads logs or similar, so you can badmouth him while he's "gone" and he will be fine with it, you are not talking behind his back

01:32 <kof673> fsf stuff i never had a problem with, but it is all assuming their are courts and "law" in place, that they are followed, that the normal person has access to them, etc.

01:32 <kof673> *there

01:36 <kof673> and AFAIK because they let an organization/company/corporation/group be an "individual" ....they are presumably just following "the law"....one can argue for or against that, but i am unaware of any license that does not allow that

01:40 <kof673> so an "individual" can "share" amongst itself and this is not "distribution" -- is this the intended behavior, or just a quirk of "the law" allowing various group entities to be "individuals" ? "you are individuals!" -- <chanting> we are all individuals! </chanting> </monty python>

02:18 <cloudowind> hmm

02:23 <cloudowind> yes , even our names are pointers they point to us:)

02:24 <cloudowind> geist probably pssed of with our offtopic chat:) i need to finish this installer script anyway , wishing you the best one today

04:35 <geist> wat?

04:35 <geist> nah i'm not an angry person

05:07 <Ermine> volunteers are more oppressed by gnu/fsf than supported; and big corporate employees obviously don't need support from fsf

06:57 <childlikempress> some stuff at usenix

07:11 <fedaykin> https://x.com/AviSchiffmann/status/1876591457324400701

07:11 <bslsk05> ​twitter: <AviSchiffmann> Microsoft has never made a good product. Windows is absolutely dogshit - its only use case is to play video games but even then just get a playstation. ␤ ␤ Github is kinda cool but they didn't make that. HoloLens sucked. At one point, Microsoft did sponsor me and sent me their best [https://twitter.com/luishxyz/status/1876590985385554400 <luishxyz> @AviSchiffmann

07:11 <bslsk05> ​Only B2B company is Microsoft. Nvidia has too little focus on sales and too much product edge. Not typical for B2B ]

07:14 <fedaykin> and don't get me started on bill gates and what he has become with his vax mandates, get a jab or get fired =) those who got the jab later got fired anyway, because "economy was weak" and interest rates, and now, nothing really changed but "economy is strong" all of a suden, and they are hiring, clown world

07:29 <ring0_starr> did somebody say Vax???

07:30 <fedaykin> =)

08:01 <geist> but also lets not gripe about companies and whatnot

08:29 <ring0_starr> Being an anti-VAXxer is RISCy business.

08:54 <fedaykin> touche

08:55 <Ermine> Thought of installing linux on my granddad's laptop and found out there's no suitable DE or WM for that

09:00 <GeDaMo> How are you defining "suitable"?

09:03 <Ermine> for starters, it should run smoothly (conditions are rather spartan there) and properly support hi-dpi

09:04 <GeDaMo> Ah

09:07 <Ermine> and be at least somewhat accessible to non-nerds

09:39 <nikolar> geist: it's well known that you are a dictator with an iron fist around these parts :P

09:40 <nikolar> Ermine: why wouldn't DEs run smoothly on your granddad's laptop

09:40 <nikolar> can't say i've seen them run particularly non-smoothly even on shittiest hardware

09:41 <nortti> Ermine: does gnome not fit the bill? I was under the impreasion that, any personal gripes aside, they do prioritize non-nerd use case and should support hidpi

09:57 <Ermine> nortti: the last time i've tried it, their hidpi support is poor (the fractional one)

09:59 <Ermine> and, even if we cast aside the fact that gnome's ui is an insult to ergonomics, i also want ui to be windows-y to simplify moving from windows (we're talking about old man after all)

09:59 <Ermine> nikolar: plasma somewhat is lagging on my gemini lake laptop, and it's more powerful than my granddad's laptop

10:00 <nikolar> To be fair, it's been a while since I've ran plasma

10:01 <Ermine> (ftgj it's absolute cheapass potato laptop and I wouldn't approve bying that)

10:04 <Ermine> I'm inclined towards IceWM (which I can configure to suit granddad's needs and adjust as needed), but hi-dpi in x11 world works fine only on plasma

10:05 <Ermine> and maybe gnome, but that's not an option anyway

10:06 <nortti> there was an article about getting hidpi going on openbox + x11 recently on lobsters, lemme see if I can find it

10:08 <nortti> https://horstmann.com/unblog/2023-01-07/index.html

10:08 <bslsk05> ​horstmann.com: Cay Horstmann's Unblog

10:09 <Ermine> I think it involves setting Xft.dpi, then going to gtk config, then something else

10:13 <Ermine> Oh gosh, that's a lot

10:13 <Ermine> thank you nortti !

10:15 <Ermine> The thing I like about wayland is that all of this is now a single line in a compositor configuration

10:17 <Ermine> It took several years and one Kenny Levinsen to make a protocol for that, but now it's done

15:27 <heat> cloudowind, sure, but the point is that even shit like coreutils is ran by *volunteers*

15:27 <heat> afaik the fsf money doesn't hit the people actually running the projects, just the fsf infra

15:28 <heat> which, imo, could _easily_ be replaced by any other git service out there

15:28 <heat> for big stuff like e.g glibc or gcc the GNU people (@gnu.org) only pop up when it comes to removing abortion jokes or being purposefully incompatible with LLVM and LLD

15:30 <pog> abortion jokes????

15:30 <pog> it's not a joke i'm pro-life ok

15:30 <Ermine> savannah at least has bugtracker *giggles*

15:36 <Ermine> Though, with such minimalist infra, why do they need $400k on it???

15:37 <pog> to pay me

15:37 <Ermine> we can pay you directly, no need to involve fsf

15:38 <Ermine> and there's fsfe also