ChanServ changed the topic of #kisslinux to: Unnofficial KISS Linux community channel | | post logs or else | song of the day
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<sewn> Hi
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<testuser[m]123> giu
<testuser[m]123> hi
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<midfavila> jfc i hate that IBM's site demands JS
<midfavila> all I want is a hypertext version of the CUA spec
<illiliti> you must suffer
<midfavila> i'll suffer through a lack of documentation, not a lack of specification
<midfavila> that's one step too far illiliti
<illiliti> email ibm and ask them for text version
<midfavila> considering it tbh\
<midfavila> might also see if i can get a hardcopy version
<midfavila> i'm certain that 95% of the reason Athena programs feel clunky and gross is that they have no consistent UI
<midfavila> the toolkit itself isn't particularly sophisticated, sure, but no less so than its contemporaries, and those programs are perfectly usable, so...
* midfavila shrugs
<midfavila> big brain deducation at work
<midfavila> deduction
<midfavila> fucking
<midfavila> aa
<midfavila> i'm going to shut up now
<midfavila> been listening to this and "dedication" played while i was typing "deduction" and my brain brain'd
<midfavila> oh also sewn after looking at the output of the command you posted the other day (asking about name substitution or whatever in rc, you used the syntax ${var##.*}.ext) you can just do the following to get the same results: for(i in *.png){convert $i $i.jpg}
<midfavila> my original response was overly verbose because it was my (incorrect) understanding that the shell syntax you used was replacing the .png extension with a .jpg, which was incorrect
<sewn> cat.png.jpg
<midfavila> ${i##.*}.ext also seems to be equivalent (at least on a surface level) to "${i}.ext" so i'm not really sure what's going on there
<midfavila> uh, yeah, what's wrong with that. running your command in bash, dash and oksh all results in that same sort of output
<sewn> I suppose . is used as a delimiter but this shouldn't happen
<midfavila> 'convert' is part of imagemagick right? it's probably what's removing the extra extension
<sewn> yeah prob
<midfavila> if you wanted to remove it in shell itself you would need to use cut
<sewn> not really a solution but a workaround lol
<midfavila> uh, no
<midfavila> what you're using is a feature of *imagemagick*
<midfavila> not your shell
<shokara_> can't you use %%.* to get rid of the extension in shell expansion?
<sewn> so its a workaround to a missing feature in the shell.
<shokara_> instead of ##.*
<midfavila> it's not a missing feature, it's *literally* the purpose of cut
<midfavila> to split text based on delimiters
<sewn> mid
<midfavila> %%.* does seem to get the job done, shokara_, but idk, it feels wrong to have the shell do that
<midfavila> same with using it for arithmetic
<shokara_> \_(:/)_/
<midfavila> idk just personal preference speaking there
<shokara_> agreed for arithmetic
<midfavila> the shell is a command language, not a mathematics or text manipulation one, so trying to shove all those extra features in there is just... bleeegh
<shokara_> mhm, but it works
<midfavila> barely, and it's hard to read >.>;
<shokara_> just because it isn't correct nor readable doesn't mean it's not right :D
<midfavila> oh huh hold on
<midfavila> nvm
<shokara_> but I do remember seeing % and %% used for removing or substituting text in my shell's man page
<shokara_> last occurence*
<midfavila> yeah it's either POSIX or a de facto extension
<shokara_> I think it's latter
<midfavila> nah they're POSIX
* midfavila shrugs
<sewn> basic arithmetic is expected for a script language
<midfavila> bc, dc and hoc are all superior to sh
<midfavila> when it comes to mathematics
<shokara_> but you can also just pipep to a separate calculator
<sewn> I said basic
<shokara_> i.e. bc
<midfavila> iunno i disagree
<midfavila> i think that shell has an overly verbose and complex syntax and it's also kind of redundant
<sewn> I agree with the syntax parts
<midfavila> i mean, why implement string manipulation and arithmetic operators when POSIX already guarantees awk, sed, bc and dc?
<sewn> also turnary
<midfavila> i don't know why you're so obsessed with ternary, but bc can do arbitrary bases
<shokara_> arbitrary bases for logarithms?
<midfavila> my bc can, at least, it seems
<midfavila> log(x, b) returns log base b of x
* midfavila shrugs
<shokara_> what bc are you using?
<midfavila> gavin howard's version
<shokara_> are you importing a bc file that containes definitions for these math functions?
<midfavila> looks like it is part of its library, yes.
<shokara_> just asking since gnu bc doesn't seem to include it
<shokara_> (not on kiss at the moment)
<midfavila> fair
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<sewn> midfavila:
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<midfavila> CDE port for KISS 2nite bby
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<midfavila> managed to get it to build and start dtlogin, just couldn't get to the actual desktop
<midfavila> standalone applications run just fine
<midfavila> one thing that's kind of annoying is that there are race conditions in the build because of the reliance on yacc/lex
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<phoebos> sewn: good hostname