<SiFuh>
It's true. This event folded before beerman
<SiFuh>
Now beerman is defending it, but it really has nothing to do with him.
<zorz>
brb
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<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: My friends know that I have honor. As much as I hate or dislike someone, I will never lie, frame, decieve or blame them.
<zorz>
SiFuh: you are unbelievable.... just forget about it.
<SiFuh>
I have honor dude
<SiFuh>
As much as you annoy me, I will take care of you in Malaysia without a doubt
<zorz>
they will never admit that your are right!
<SiFuh>
Oh they will
<SiFuh>
Maybe 18 years later
<zorz>
you want to hear only the words... you are right!
<zorz>
THEY WILL NEVER SAY THAT!
<zorz>
finito la musica.
<remiliascarlet>
SiFuh: I check out #crux all the time, but I can't see beerman anywhere.
<SiFuh>
#crux-devel
<remiliascarlet>
Oh.
<zorz>
i have enough drama here allready no need to go over there.
<SiFuh>
in #crux his a bot that has [cruxbridge> <tim> as his handle
<SiFuh>
Heh so zorz leaves CRUX to join CRUX-Social to avoid drama?
<remiliascarlet>
Probably too late to check, because if I join now, I will only see messages from after joining.
<remiliascarlet>
zorz leaves CRUX to join CRUX-Social to wear tight jeans.
<zorz>
Now zorz is in #soviet aswell
<SiFuh>
HAHAHA
<SiFuh>
zorz: You wearing tight jeans again?
<zorz>
of course
<remiliascarlet>
zorz: Communism logic: enslave all of society in name of "freedom".
<remiliascarlet>
Communism is licensed under GPL.
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<remiliascarlet>
Capitalism is under BSD license. And corporatism is under an EULA.
<remiliascarlet>
And by "capitalism" I always mean libertarian free market capitalism, not the "corporatism" liberals and commies always refer to as "capitalism".
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: farkuhar: is hiccups funny?
<remiliascarlet>
First person or third person?
<SiFuh>
Me
<zorz>
yes hang george now.
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<SiFuh>
ivandi: are hiccups funny?
<remiliascarlet>
It's hard to decide whether it's funny or not if the person having hiccups is hidden behind a text-only chat protocol.
<zorz>
SiFuh: going to pass
<SiFuh>
I have a htred towards hiccups. My body doesn't do what it is suppose to. I eat chilli, I hiccup. It's idiocracy
<zorz>
:q
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<SiFuh>
I know all your tricks
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Any new?
<remiliascarlet>
But in real life: first person is frustrating. Third person depends on the timing of their hiccups.
<SiFuh>
I usually beat myself until I am in pain and broken ribs
<SiFuh>
I think I have broken more ribs than a boxer
<remiliascarlet>
I just drink lots of water under it's gone.
<SiFuh>
I shout try that
<SiFuh>
should
<remiliascarlet>
Depends on what causes the hiccups of course.
<SiFuh>
Usually I hold the breath and the when it comes back I beat the shit outof myslef
<SiFuh>
Errrr
<remiliascarlet>
But to me it always happens to be because my body is lacking water.
<SiFuh>
hiccups are caused by one reason
<SiFuh>
okay remiliascarlet next time I try it
<SiFuh>
Mine is from chilli
<remiliascarlet>
Holding the breath works for some causes, but for insufficient water drinking it won't work.
<SiFuh>
I eat chilli daily
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: I got it
<SiFuh>
No need anymore unless you got some skills you want to pass on to me
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<zorz>
SiFuh: you see... you are the beggining of Everything wrong
<zorz>
i almost forgot to scrape!
<SiFuh>
zorz: I am the beginning of everything right
<SiFuh>
I am
<zorz>
Total wrong!
<remiliascarlet>
Are you god?
<zorz>
ok scrape mission is hapenning
<SiFuh>
I have to get ready for passing out
<zorz>
go go
<zorz>
when i am done .... i will aswell
<SiFuh>
zorz: Do you understand whu I am fighting this?
<zorz>
for correctness ?
<SiFuh>
Actually remiliascarlet Do you understand as well?
<zorz>
i see no point talking to a wall... or to someone that will never admit if he is wrong.
<SiFuh>
zorz: You seem to not understand anything. Even a book
<zorz>
enlighten me
<remiliascarlet>
SiFuh: Understand what exactly?
<SiFuh>
nothing remiliascarlet
<SiFuh>
accident on my part
<SiFuh>
It is like 9 am here almost. I should dust off.
<zorz>
ciao
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<SiFuh>
(-:
<remiliascarlet>
SiFuh: Bought some squid jerky, because it's the only meaty thing in the entire convenience store that doesn't have more ingredients than a frankenstein, the squid jerky is literally just squid and salt. And goddamn it's tough!
<SiFuh>
Yeah, we have that here in Asia
<SiFuh>
South East Asia
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Often used as a snack. They tear it with hands and pick off pieces
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: [08 47 16]-zorz(~zorz@user/zorz)- you seem not to understand politics.....
<SiFuh>
He's really strange
<SiFuh>
He can talk on channel, then suddenly it is private messages and next it is notices.
<remiliascarlet>
Oh.
<remiliascarlet>
https://invidious.jing.rocks/watch?v=eEoY7OT3xwE Europe: "Europe has 3 years to prepare for war with Russia." Also Europe: "Oopsie daisy, we wasted all our ammo on Ukraine, so now we're completely defenseless. TEEHEE!"
<SiFuh>
You watching propaganda?
<remiliascarlet>
Yeah, to make fun of them.
<remiliascarlet>
Especially towards the end he's talking nonsense. "Yes, Russia has a larger army, but Europe has a much larger economy, industry, and population, therefore Europe will win hands down." In a war, nobody cares about your economy, industry, and population count, all what matters is the army!
<remiliascarlet>
Fucking nitwit!
<remiliascarlet>
I see this kind of bullshit again and again when it comes to China vs Taiwan and/or Japan. "China has a bigger population, therefore China will win the war." What good is a bigger population if they don't have any combat skills though?
<remiliascarlet>
You can deploy 3 billion inexperienced civilians, but the 5 million highly experienced fighters are still going to win because of the pre-existing experience.
<remiliascarlet>
And there's plenty of evidence throughout history of exactly that too.
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<remiliascarlet>
Ah well, there is a silver lining to it all. If the west plunges into WWIII, at least all the woke shit is going to end overnight.
<zorz>
next time I should say bonjour... everybody answers :P
<zorz>
SiFuh: still here, I thought you will be in #noPAM already :PPpp
<ppetrov^>
hm, seems the link to my CRUX review is gone from crux.nu. Sup, womeone didn't like it? :P
<ppetrov^>
*someone
<SiFuh>
zorz: I thought I did very well last night. I didn't tear anyone's head off over the PAM issue
<zorz>
SiFuh: you mean early morning.
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: Just blame beerman. I always do. haha
<zorz>
ppetrov^: you did not like it ?
<SiFuh>
zorz: I drank a shit load of vodka and beer last night.
<zorz>
SiFuh: now I understand.
<SiFuh>
I then went over the coversation in #crux and I was impressed at how restrained I was. haha
<zorz>
restrained?
<SiFuh>
conversation*
<SiFuh>
restrained = Like holding myself back, biting my tongue, not exploding like a bomb
<zorz>
that is what I am asking....
<zorz>
hicups aswell
<SiFuh>
SiFuh_zen
<remiliascarlet>
SiFuh: https://invidious.jing.rocks/watch?v=QAdJBkehoqI He makes really good points regarding population for a politician. Talks a lot about people being brainwashed, which I think is absolutely correct. And also says that what Japan needs is not a lot of low IQ retards, but high quality citizens, another statement I completely agree on.
<SiFuh>
Oh yeah, I got hiccups last night.
<zorz>
SiFuh_zen is nice
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: You don't talk English like that do you?
<remiliascarlet>
What do you mean?
<SiFuh>
The English pronunciation in that video is awful
<remiliascarlet>
Ah, you mean vocally.
<SiFuh>
Yeah
<remiliascarlet>
I think I sound even worse.
<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, after the guy was mocking my ports, I really do not care what he thinks
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: beerman?
<SiFuh>
If so, he mocks a lot of people.
<zorz>
#crux is drama like the series DYNASTY from eighties.
<zorz>
SiFuh: did your mother watch DYNASTY ? mine did.
<SiFuh>
Mother was banned from watching drama series
<zorz>
hahahaha
<zorz>
good choice.
<SiFuh>
It changes their minds. They end up untrusting of everyone
<SiFuh>
My father would be late coming home and she'd think he was cheating on her. He would talk to a woman and she'd become jealous. So drama series was banned until she grew the fuck up
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Not a fan of modern Japan. I prefer traditional Japan
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<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, yep
<SiFuh>
Also people that live in cities usually live a closed lifestyle as opposed to village people. So dating and finding a partner is much harder in cities
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: I don't write my ports the way they do. I don't care because I write my ports to the actual standards of bash scripting. No one has complained or mocked me. But those who poach my ports usually revert them to the lazy insecure way that CRUX has their ports layed out.
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<SiFuh>
The original Pkgfile is based on old bash rules. Much has changed since then
<ppetrov^>
i have poached a few ports from you :)
<ppetrov^>
ah, it was something along the lines that I did not have identation they way he likes it and that I had old stuff
<SiFuh>
I don't use CRUX as a GUI anymore. I stopped using it a long time ago.
<SiFuh>
I do have a CRUX on USB stick that has GUI though. I only use it for monitoring the CCTV
<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, what do you use as GUI?
<farkuhar>
old bash rules, heh. What if we followed the example set by KISS Linux and separated out the build() function into its own file? Then it could be written in any programming language you like. As long as the 'build' file is executable, the package manager can run it.
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: https://www.youtube.com/@Paulsaladinomd/videos This guy wrote a book on carnivore diets. Was 100% a meat eater, and then started getting skin rashes and stuff. So he reintroduced fruits and vegetables. Still a carnivore though.
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: xorg + fluxbox
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: Yes
<farkuhar>
there's already a precedent for distributing the various components of a port among multiple files. Consider the pre-install and post-install scripts, which are standalone executables, not functions embedded in the Pkgfile.
<ppetrov^>
farkuhar, Arch seems to have several functions in their PKGBUILDs
<SiFuh>
Paste any Pkgfile in it
<farkuhar>
ppetrov^: yes, Arch was inspired by CRUX when they devised their packaging standards. But Arch grew more complicated over time, faster than CRUX has accreted new features and modern bashisms.
<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, that's a nice tool, thanks
<farkuhar>
ppetrov^: the command-line version is available as shellcheck-bin.
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: I don't agree with 'inspired'. The guy use to constantly come into CRUX and ask questions.
<SiFuh>
I think he should say, 'copied from and then heavily modified'
<zorz>
i use shellcheck in my vim
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: I use it to check all my scripts to make sure they follow the standards.
<SiFuh>
And it is a good teacher as well.
<zorz>
SiFuh: because of shellcheck i realized why openbsd uses pkg_add and NOT pkg-add
<SiFuh>
cd "${name}"-"${version}" will complain too because it doesn't have a safe exit? I think.. not sure
<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, you catually remember this?
<SiFuh>
Yes
<ppetrov^>
Aaron something? the creatopr of arch
<zorz>
its not good to have aliases like prt-get
<zorz>
should be prt_get
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: Yeah something like that
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: You remember emmet1 :-)
<SiFuh>
Creator of venom linux. A CRUX user
<ppetrov^>
yes
<SiFuh>
zorz: Wow, what is the reason?
<zorz>
wait to write something and i will tell you what posts
<farkuhar>
My dead-tree copy of "Learning the bash shell" dates from the years when CRUX was just getting started, and it has no mention of associative arrays. Such is the evolution of the shell, within a decade it would acquire a nifty feature that Alan pushed for inclusion in the Pkgfile standards.
<SiFuh>
Alpine Linux creator also use to come into #CRUX for assistance
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: Yes, so we should adapt. But ukky might complain it makes more work for the maintainers. HAHA
<SiFuh>
zorz: Which reminds me about mounting drives in OpenBSD and folders and names of drives
<farkuhar>
Converting the old Pkgfile format to a new format should be easy to automate, though. We just have to write a definitive proposal for the new format, and get it accepted.
<zorz>
and told me not good.... and i used upload_file
<zorz>
thats how i upload pictures to SiFuh
<farkuhar>
The harder task will be supporting CRUX users during the bumpy transition. While they're still running the old pkgmk and cannot handle a new Pkgfile format, bootstrapping pre-built packages will have to suffice.
<ppetrov^>
farkuhar, why not just update the instructions in the Handbook and the Pkgfiles of core, opt, xorg, contrib and compat32. Then leave it up to the users to update their ports
<SiFuh>
name="test"
<SiFuh>
version="1.2.3"
<SiFuh>
cd "${name}-${version}" || exit
<SiFuh>
Like this
<farkuhar>
ppetrov^: if we made a breaking change to the Pkgfile format, then the best time to publish it would be at the release of a new ISO.
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: Or have a shellcheck script to verify if there are issues. :-P
<SiFuh>
Don't worry, we still use tech from the 1800's
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<ppetrov^>
hmmm..
<ppetrov^>
may I ask the English native speakers about sth...
<ppetrov^>
which is better:
<ppetrov^>
This program aims to produce a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportional to its length.
<ppetrov^>
This program aims to produce a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportionally to its length.
<ppetrov^>
This program aims to produce a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains in proportion to its length.
<ppetrov^>
the proportion part is bothering me
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: 1st one and 3rd one are fine
<farkuhar>
ppetrov^: what is the meaning of "domains" in this context? Can it be made singular, to agree with the pronoun "its"?
<farkuhar>
or if you want to emphasize that multiple domains are plotted, then the problematic phrase is "its length", which needs to be made plural.
<ppetrov^>
it's length referes to the length of the protein
<ppetrov^>
domains are regions in a protein that exert a certain function
<ppetrov^>
like, enzymes have catalytic domains
<farkuhar>
well, as a non-specialist I would have trouble identifying protein as the antecedent of "its". Better to restate explicitly "... proportional to the protein's length".
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<ppetrov^>
thanks farkuhar!
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<farkuhar>
Of course, the sentence is meant to be read in a larger context, and there it might be obvious that "its length" refers to a single protein. Based on what you gave us, though, I found it slightly hard to parse.
<ppetrov^>
the sentence is meant as a single sentecne explanation, so, better to make it more clear
<SiFuh>
I liked 1 or 3
<ppetrov^>
thanks SiFuh
<farkuhar>
As for the link to your CRUX review ... maybe when beerman replaced Apache with nginx, he restored the website from older backups. No malicious intent, just the inevitable hiccup that comes with refreshing a server.
<zorz>
nginx is good.
<SiFuh>
This program aims at producing a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportional to its length.
<SiFuh>
How about this? I midified the first part as well.
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: ^
<SiFuh>
midified/modified
<ppetrov^>
hey, that's sounds good
<ppetrov^>
thank you
<ppetrov^>
This program aims at producing a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportional to protein length
<ppetrov^>
maybe like this
<SiFuh>
Use the 'to the protein'
<ppetrov^>
This program aims at producing a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportional to the protein length
<ppetrov^>
geez, and i thought i knew English
<SiFuh>
Yeah and if you are talking about more than one protein you can make it proteins
<ppetrov^>
nope, one at a time
<farkuhar>
ppetrov^: the landing page for prt-utils now includes an oblique reference to your CRUX review, but nothing that links it with your IRC nick. If you want more credit, let me know.
<SiFuh>
then protein should own the length so protein's length
<ppetrov^>
farkuhar, it's fine really. I am not "credit-fishing" or anything. Just noticed it was gone, that's all. And I am sure it was not intentional.
<SiFuh>
This program aims at producing a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportional to the protein's length
<SiFuh>
This program aims at producing a concise protein-topology scheme, by plotting domains proportional to the length of the protein
<ppetrov^>
last one
<SiFuh>
Cool
<ppetrov^>
thank you both
<farkuhar>
shellcheck will complain about cd "${name}-${version}" because it doesn't have a safe exit? But did you inform shellcheck that the build() function is invoked in a subshell with errexit explicitly enabled? /usr/bin/pkgmk line 577: (set -e -x; build)
<farkuhar>
I think the proper way to run shellcheck in this case is to cd into the port's directory, then run shellcheck -x /usr/bin/pkgmk, which will follow any files that are sourced.
<zorz>
pkg_add shellcheck :Ppp
<remiliascarlet>
Monero is tanking hard in value this week, holy fuck!
<SiFuh>
cd "${name}-${version}" || exit <-- farkuhar
<farkuhar>
SiFuh: yes, that's what shellcheck will recommend if you ask it to validate just the Pkgfile. But what if it saw the Pkgfile in its proper context (sourced by pkgmk which explicitly enables errexit)?
<SiFuh>
Found a rotten mango. So I squeezed the juice out of it and mixed it with some of my vodka. Wife thinks it is the nectar of the gods.
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: Understood, but it is still a script within a script
<SiFuh>
script or other program*
<farkuhar>
SiFuh: on that we are in agreement. Hence my curiosity at the approach taken by KISS Linux: put the build() function into a separate executable file.
<SiFuh>
I am sure new problems will arise if CRUX adopts to the modern bash standards
<SiFuh>
simple chmod +x Pkgfile sh ./Pkgfile
<SiFuh>
I think the current Pkgfile is fine to be honest. I just wish they'd use 2 spaces instead of 4 or tabs. Double quote variables. And I think the variables should be in capital letters accross the board.
<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, along with the PAM stuff, bring this up in crux-devel. i am sure they will love you
<ppetrov^>
:P
<SiFuh>
Oh no, I am done for now, I will bring it up again later, maybe a month or two.
<SiFuh>
I have to see if I can break the record of 18 years.
<ppetrov^>
never give up, man
<zorz>
haha
<ppetrov^>
let's discuss this again in 20 years?
<SiFuh>
Bet you linux-PAM ends up being essential to core before then
<SiFuh>
When ukky was talking about patching, I was a bit curious because I know that sudo is being developed by an OpenBSD guy now and OpenBSD doesn't use PAM
<zorz>
actually SiFuh is screaming, for a secure core. and that he mention that 4-5 years ago. they did not pay attention they found the problem ahead.
<farkuhar>
I recommend doing more to separate data from code. Dependencies and upstream urls are all basically strings, they don't need to be interpreted by bash every time. Put them into separate files, and then apply chmod +x only to the script that does the compiling.
<ppetrov^>
farkuhar, i like having all in a single file
<ppetrov^>
SlackBuilds.org use separate files for download links, version number, etc
<ppetrov^>
it's a bit tedious
<farkuhar>
The fact that you're squeezing into bash arrays all these data that are essentially strings, makes it awkward to parse using external tools. Good luck getting Perl, awk, python, ... to read the Pkgfile without implementing their own parsers for the various "bashisms".
<SiFuh>
I'd like to see CRUX using flavours in the Pkgfile. That way, I can install a system without Linux-PAM.
<ppetrov^>
so, the ports system there is kinda 'intelligent'
<ppetrov^>
"knows what to do"
<ppetrov^>
is it similar with gentoo's portage?
<SiFuh>
Yes, very intelligent
<SiFuh>
No
<SiFuh>
Mostly we install binary pre-built packages. You only use the port sources if you want to tweak something. When you do pkg_add emacs it will ask you which one you want in a nice numbered list.
<SiFuh>
First option is always 0) none
<ppetrov^>
cool
<SiFuh>
When I use to build servers I use to use lynx to dump the ports tree page, extract the port names and stick them in a text file. Every line commented out. I would then open the text file in an editor and uncomment the programs they wanted. Then run pkg_add in a script to install everything without questions. You could go to work and come home 8 hours later and the entire system is installed.
<SiFuh>
is/was
<zorz>
guys this is the shellcheck error of using - https:\/\/a.uguu.se\/HAKEutOd.png
<zorz>
and this is https:\/\/a.uguu.se\/RkZGxTFD.png by changing - to _
<zorz>
uguu.se is good.... since my firefox is not allowed to upload files.
<SiFuh>
Does anyone know what zorz is talking about?
<zorz>
fuctions in sh having bla-bla is not correct they work but not correct should be bla_bla
<ppetrov^>
i am not clicking on anything called HAKEutOd
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: it's just a dumb screenshot of a terminal doing nothing
<ppetrov^>
see? didn't miss much
<ppetrov^>
rofl
<zorz>
SiFuh: as i said now i understand why everythiing in openbsd is pkg_add and not pkg-add
<SiFuh>
All you see is "scrot ~/check.png" and a huge debian advertisment
<SiFuh>
And the second one iw
<zorz>
i had open the shell of the server...
<SiFuh>
"scrot ~/check2.png" and a huge debian advertisment
<zorz>
the server runs debian.
<zorz>
ooo fuck shake sifuh
<zorz>
let me reproduce it for your eyes.
<SiFuh>
Why you want to shake SiFuh?
<SiFuh>
zorz: Do you actually know what you sent us?
<zorz>
https:\/\/a.uguu.se\/kZzlAxAQ.png
<SiFuh>
Still don't know what the fsck you showing me
<zorz>
W: In POSIX sh, naming functions outside [a-zA-Z_][a-zA-Z0-9_]* is undefined.
<remiliascarlet>
Q: "When to consider owning multiple credit cards?" A: "Never, because 1) you don't own a credit card, but Mastercard, VISA, and the rest of the debt cartels do, and 2) credit cards are a trap."
<farkuhar>
Maybe it was intentional that they named prt-get with a hyphen instead of an underscore. That way you cannot define a shell function that masks the prt-get program.
<farkuhar>
That is, if you follow the POSIX standard. Maybe some shells will let you define such a function anyway.
<zorz>
i am not expert, i am just telling you what it happened when running shellcheck
<SiFuh>
zorz: usually before the release the current branch flips to the new version. A new version is expected in a fortnight. Usually this month however can be delayed until May. If you are on current and your kernel is still saying 7.4, then I am guessing it might be May instead of April
<zorz>
i am not current, just stable... default installation.
<zorz>
i gave up long time ago with current, rolling, bleeding.
<farkuhar>
"before the release" is right. Even now you can see a 3.8 remote tracking branch if you sync your CRUX repositories using git, yet there's no plan for a new release anytime soon.
<SiFuh>
zorz: okay current is saying 7.5 so I reckon this month then 7.5 will be released
<zorz>
okay... SiFuh you remind me to make backups, if lost python script and csv i am screwd
<SiFuh>
Chuck that in a script so your server boots up and sends it to your email
<SiFuh>
zorz: Actually, it would be better to also have a function to compare the old address with a new address in cron so if there is an IP address change while your computer is running, then it can email you as well
<zorz>
not need, usually is down.... incase i need anything. should be enough.
<zorz>
SiFuh: but is good to know.
<SiFuh>
I have a menu item in fluxbox that launches a script
<SiFuh>
Well when my system boots up. It shows me in green at the bottom corner of my screen my IP and 5 seconds later my external IP.
<SiFuh>
I should upgrade the script to the new bash standards :-P
<SiFuh>
If I need to check again, I just click the menu item "IP Address" in fluxbox and it shows me again
<zorz>
you should... wanna see whats going on ?
<SiFuh>
No, I do it with my eyes closed
<zorz>
:)
<SiFuh>
Reminds me of the conversation today I had with the wife. Starting with me "Why is there a naked woman wrapped in a towel walking around my house?" "Why? You want to see me 100% naked?" "No, that's just wrong. That is also why you turn off the lights"
<SiFuh>
And she cracked up laughing and walked out
<remiliascarlet>
SiFuh: "Not a fan of modern Japan. I prefer traditional Japan" With no Japanese around in the future, the tradition will be lost.
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Yes, it will sadden me deeply
<SiFuh>
zorz: I forgot to tell you
<SiFuh>
"my sister said supplier told her, they no longer sell this brand, ask me to try search at shopee" and she doesn't know what a VQFN8 SIM card is.
<SiFuh>
Also Shogun has released a new episode
<remiliascarlet>
SiFuh: "https://www.youtube.com/@Paulsaladinomd/videos" I think I saw 2 of his videos before + 1 podcast video where he was part of. But that's too little to really form any meaningful opinion for or against him, or just neutral.
<SiFuh>
I only saw his coconut on the airplane video. And 2 billion debunkers of his carnivore diet
<remiliascarlet>
But I do understand that Okinawans weren't entirely animal based, but they did prioritize pork over all else, only didn't do so after WWII when their entire pig population got killed, but nowadays they prioritize pork again.
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Today I was given free curried beef. I took one spoon full and grabbed all the beef, washed it in water and stuck it in a bag for my friends dogs. The put sugar in the curry!!!!!!!! These fucking Malays and their addiction to sugar!
<remiliascarlet>
zorz: If OpenBSD 7.5 was out, you'd see it instantly on openbsd.org, as they have a completely different logo with every release, and a new song with most releases.
<SiFuh>
So now my dinner is two rotten mangoes. Haha
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Not really. It usually gets updated about 2 to 5 days after its release. #OpenBSD is the fastest to update
<remiliascarlet>
Ah, so just like with NetBSD. DistroWatch already had the ISO ready to go, but neither the official website nor the sysupgrade utility had it yet.
<remiliascarlet>
Until a few days later.
<SiFuh>
The packages are already being built and uploaded.
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Pretty much. But NetBSD doesn't have a cool link to Theo's basement
<remiliascarlet>
OpenBSD has Theo's server rack, NetBSD has a donation meter.
<SiFuh>
And zorz was complaing about SPARC servers
<SiFuh>
I use to own a Sparc 64 with OpenBSD on it. Came to work and the office was full of smoke.
<SiFuh>
Realised it was coming from the OpenBSD Sparc 64. I pulled the plug and opened the box to find the plastic cover above the CPU had caught on fire. Haha
<remiliascarlet>
Every time I see an old PC that isn't x86, ARM, or PowerPC, they're all expensive as fuck for whatever reason.
<SiFuh>
I wonder if my old office still has them. If so, I might ask if I can buy them off of them,
<remiliascarlet>
Older PC98 ones are mixed between expensive and cheap depending on the model.
<remiliascarlet>
But those are all DOS-based, so meh.
<SiFuh>
I just messaged the old boss. I hope they still have and will sell/give them to me. I will drive to Thailand just to pick them up.
<remiliascarlet>
Glad to see the Go compiler in OpenBSD 7.5, making OpenBSD 2 minor releases ahead of FreeBSD, 1 minor release ahead of NetBSD, and on par with CRUX.
<remiliascarlet>
Not like it matters, as the Go dev team always pre-compiles their compilers for as many platforms as possible anyway.
<remiliascarlet>
But OpenBSD still remains at Blender 3.3, while FreeBSD is on Blender 3.6, and Linux on Blender 4.0.
<zorz>
wait to rewind, lunch was good... mussles in rice salad beetroot
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: seems the next jungle date may be 1st of May.
<SiFuh>
zorz: ^
<zorz>
curl -4 icanhazip.com is fast aswell
<SiFuh>
Yes, I changed to it in my script. Haha
serpente has joined #crux-social
<zorz>
haha
<zorz>
SiFuh: Sparc makes sparks heh
<SiFuh>
I am planning to do a 6,000 KM drive to Thailand and back so if they still have those SPARC 64's, I will pick them up during the trip
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: :-) You want to be my co-driver. Hahaha
<zorz>
hahaha
<SiFuh>
Road car, not offroad truck
<SiFuh>
I guarantee that if they still ahve those old SPARC machines and they will still be running the old OpenBSD I installed on them in 2002
<SiFuh>
Hmm
<SiFuh>
I guarantee that if they still have those old SPARC machines, they will still be running the old OpenBSD I installed on them in 2002
<ppetrov^>
SiFuh, only after you have a drive with me at -30
<zorz>
SiFuh: do not go,,,, 12 yo shoot people in Finland
<zorz>
SiFuh: they will shoot you! :Pp
<ppetrov^>
ye, i read it... in Vantaa
<ppetrov^>
not the first time it happens in a school. Some 15 years ago they had a school shooting. That's when I heard about the Estonian movie, called "Klass"
<ppetrov^>
i highly recommend it
<zorz>
ppetrov^: will check!
<zorz>
ppetrov^: klass - -imdb: 7.9 - actors: Vallo Kirs, Pärt Uusberg, Lauri Pedaj
<SiFuh>
remiliascarlet: Did you see that section of Japan'
<SiFuh>
s got talent that I sent to zorz last night?
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: Why with you? I have already driven at -30 in RI. USA
<SiFuh>
I remember when a woman wanted to date me in Kyrgyzstan. When I found out she was Ukrainian, I cancelled the date instantly
<SiFuh>
My friend married a Ukrainian. I told him that this was a silly move. He said we have 2 beautiful daughters now. We are happy. The moment her citizenship was approved, she divorced him and ran away with a younger man.
<zorz>
normal
<SiFuh>
It could be considered unilateralism but I don't trust Ukrainians. I think that they are very low IQ people.
<zorz>
the other one in uk, that was hosting ukrnian young refugee... divorced the wife... he was lucky!
<zorz>
british women the worst.
<SiFuh>
Ahh the modern British.
<zorz>
yes!
<SiFuh>
These days women are dumb all over the western and Asian world.
<SiFuh>
Thank goodness we have some with brains like remiliascarlet
<SiFuh>
That VID you sent was me reversing up the start of a 1KM mountain. I ended up reversing the entire lot.
<SiFuh>
It becamse more difficult when the Land Cruiser in front of me put on his head lights and destroyed my vision.
<zorz>
the link opened in a folder with kernel modular config and had a dir jungle
<SiFuh>
But after that complete reverse I won the respect of everyone as the guy that can drive
<SiFuh>
Well the DIR needed to be Other.
<zorz>
sif "license" => "GNU GPL v2", BSD or MIT ? hahaha
<SiFuh>
The last like 90 metres, I drove with the foot flat to floor backwards with only a few stops to go around fallen trees
<SiFuh>
90? 900 metres
<zorz>
this toyota does not have gas by hand... how you call it in english
<SiFuh>
No idea
<SiFuh>
Gas by farting?
<zorz>
cars like this have manual by hand pressing gas like you press gas pedal and put it in a position you like.
<zorz>
so its steady.
<zorz>
even nissan kingcab have that
<SiFuh>
A hand throttle control?
<zorz>
i think is called like this
<SiFuh>
I have never heard this except in cars driven by retards and invalids
<SiFuh>
You wouldn't mean cruise control?
<zorz>
very usefull
<zorz>
its like cruise control
<zorz>
but not the same
<zorz>
my mercedes G in army had one
<SiFuh>
You can use throttle control with a phone
<SiFuh>
Greece is going to war, in a Mercedes. Hahaha
<zorz>
u use for many occasions... cold minus morning. or very high hills or... goind down iced slopes and you need some speed of you go to slow its slippery
<zorz>
so you keep the engine run at specific rpm
<zorz>
simple mechanism
<SiFuh>
No we don't have this
<SiFuh>
But actually would be great when reversing up a mountain, in the jungle, in the rain
<SiFuh>
Wouldn't be hard to make one work with my truck
<SiFuh>
That way I can stand and pee while driving
<SiFuh>
The video I sent was my camp site
<zorz>
to imagine in a nissan king kab you have this, i go down snow on the mountain and has ice.... because of ice and the slope i have to keep minimum 15km/h but max 20km/h so what do i do i use the slow 4x4 ( not the fast) the 4th gear adjust this... thing and I go.
<zorz>
no matter what the car runs on this enviroment 15-20km/h
<zorz>
up down is this.
<zorz>
SiFuh: Greece is going to war, in a Mercedes. Hahaha thats the benefits of being european, rafalle aircrafts... curry nice missles
<SiFuh>
ppetrov^: Can insects taste?
<SiFuh>
I was taught ants can with their feet but I don't remember ever learning about insects.
<SiFuh>
I remember they hear with thei knees, smell with their antennas, see with their eyes, breath from their arse
<SiFuh>
Insects smell with their antennae and taste with specialized structures associated with the mouth called “maxillary palps.” And also sometimes their feet. And also sometimes some other random body parts.
<SiFuh>
Cool
<SiFuh>
zorz: In Shogun the man is told to stop watching drama series and not cut the head off the Anjin. Hahahaha
<zorz>
did not watch yet. not online in my greek sites. i think i will pass this moment... they should love Anjins :P
<SiFuh>
zorz: Sorry to spoil the show, but Anna Sawai leaves the show and is coming to Malaysia to be with me.
<SiFuh>
dlcusa: CRUX is a distribution made by dictators. We care not what you want, we only care what we want.
<SiFuh>
You know I am the oldest, longest running CRUX user here and I was here in the very beginning when CRUX started and now you are saying that I should fork it because some clowns selfishly have fscked up the original reason for CRUX to ever come into existence?
<zorz>
or change.... distro, or bsd for linux
<zorz>
hahaha
<SiFuh>
BSD isn't a liux distro dude
<SiFuh>
It's an OS
<zorz>
this is what i say.... i tried to say
<SiFuh>
Actually I was very annoyed when jaeger says 'developers are users too' like that even matters.
<SiFuh>
Per Liden gave CRUX to the users and a small collection of people have stolen it
<SiFuh>
Per's principals were suppose to be recreated and followed onwards. But now we have to fork it because CRUX was stolen?
<SiFuh>
They should rename it to Not-CRUX
<SiFuh>
And give back CRUX and the name to people who HONOR what Per had created
<SiFuh>
Traitors
<SiFuh>
Okay, I am going to explode. I need to stop
<dlcusa_>
I'm only saying they control the distribution. The users can offer their opininons, but they do the work. I'm voting with my feet, having registered my opinion. I am sad at what CRUX has become and hope they update the doc to reflect what they're philosophically doing.
<zorz>
SiFuh: dlcusa_: says not to explode.... at the end of the day everybody does his business
<SiFuh>
dlcusa: They chose to do this and they chose to not follow the philosophy. There work means zero!
<zorz>
after all dont use linux.
<dlcusa_>
I, too, am not pleased--I feel betrayed to some degree.
<SiFuh>
So why defend them?
<dlcusa_>
They do the work, not me.
<SiFuh>
Theo says a very strong "NO!" to anyone who tries to change his philosophy.
<SiFuh>
They CHOSE to do the work
<SiFuh>
That doesn't make them entitled
<SiFuh>
I remember when Per left and he handed the keys to CRUX over. It was fine until around 2017 maybe 2018 then things started changing.
<dlcusa_>
Yes, and I can only suggest how they should do it. I cannot, indeed will not control their work--they're volunteers after all.
<SiFuh>
Developers became gods and we must accept. There was a new bureaucracy installed where developers felt they were entitled and they had absolute authority over decisions.
<SiFuh>
CRUX belongs to the people. Not the maintainers
<dlcusa_>
The only thing that doesn't change is change itself, it is said. CRUX has moved on from Per.
<SiFuh>
And for the record. Beerman isn't a CRUX developer. He is a port maintainer. Also he has nothing to do with what I am talking about
<SiFuh>
No you mean CRUX has moved from Per's philosophy.
<dlcusa_>
So he is more influential than you regarding what CRUX currently is.
<SiFuh>
So CRUX is no longer CRUX and therefore it is an insult for them to keep carrying the name CRUX
<SiFuh>
The second he got access to core he became the god of CRUX. Bigger head that Jupitor
<dlcusa_>
Yes--they are no longer supporting Per's philosophy.
<SiFuh>
So change the distro name and give CRUX back to us
<SiFuh>
I am sure people like remiliascarlet, farkuhar and even zorz will be better at sticking to the original philosophy
<dlcusa_>
No, fork them and it. Make your CRUX Per's CRUX were he still distributing CRUX.
<zorz>
myself i left, because of that....
<SiFuh>
How can it be Per's CRUX if they stole CRUX's name?
<dlcusa_>
He did?
<SiFuh>
You know what is really interesting?
<SiFuh>
This is exactly what is happening to the USA today.
<dlcusa_>
Oj. They didn't steal it, they simply became it's maintainers.
<SiFuh>
Can you imagine we call it "Not the Fake CRUX"
<SiFuh>
Hahaha
<farkuhar>
dlcusa_: update the doc to reflect what they're philosophically doing ... can you elaborate on what you think their current philosophy is? Even if only speculation, based on the changes you've seen since 2018.
<zorz>
its pity, to have the best package manager, in 2024 that computers compile fast, and make it shit.
<dlcusa_>
s/Oj/Oh/ ; s /it's/its/
<SiFuh>
dlcusa: It was stolen. They were handed the keys and the philosophy and they rejected the philosophy and used the name. That is theft
<zorz>
dlcusa_: you know what i did I moved to openbsd. and rarely when i need linux... i have a custom not crux linux to use.
<dlcusa_>
Find the solution to KISS versus what upstream are releasing.
<SiFuh>
zorz: Grownups talking here
<zorz>
Grownups..... should ended
lavaball has joined #crux-social
<zorz>
not continues talking
<SiFuh>
dlcusa: I reckon a fork maybe neccessary but it is still not fair
<dlcusa_>
Life is not fair.
<SiFuh>
I know, I want to drink and enjoy and here I am online arguing about a group of people who stole the only good Linux Distro and manipulated it to what they want.
<zorz>
SiFuh: crux 3.8 will come with Plasma support out of the box :Ppp
<dlcusa_>
I'd rant at upstream who now assume systemd, fo example--it's just as useful, but maybe they'll consider it.
<SiFuh>
I remember in the day when core had the introduction of a new package. They came on the channel and said we wish to introduce this package any rejections.
<SiFuh>
The person or persons that said no, were listened too
<SiFuh>
90 can say yes, and 10 say no.
<SiFuh>
If Linux-Pam is so fucking great then why is Linux only using it?
<SiFuh>
zorz: Silence!
<farkuhar>
dlcusa_: Is this an accurate summary of the current philosophy? "Work within the constraints of what upstream gives us, and make it conform to KISS as best we can. But don't reject bloatware just to take a stand."
<SiFuh>
What is the point of deleting documentation when you are going to replace it with software no one needs?
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: By the way, thanks for you lack of help yesterday
<farkuhar>
SiFuh: I wasn't the one who promised to help. You've got me confused with serpente.
<SiFuh>
My wife isn't the sharpest tool in the shed but she freaking understands what I was explaining to her last night.
<dlcusa_>
You'd have to ask the developers to find out for sure. I think reducing their workload is a major consideration.
<SiFuh>
They CHOSE to do it, and it is what they will do
<dlcusa_>
SiFuh, what is "No" responding to?
<SiFuh>
"Hey, can you lay the bricks for this building?" "Sure! But I will only lay one brick per day" Fired!
<SiFuh>
dlcusa_: They chose it, if they don't like it, then fuck off. It's simple.
<farkuhar>
15:28 <SiFuh> I might have backup soon serpente is online in Telegram. I just told him
<SiFuh>
There will always be someone that can work harder than them cry babies
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: That has shit to do with shit.
<zorz>
farkuhar: and afterwards said 200km away on the beach grilling steaks
<SiFuh>
Sorry, that has nothing to do with what you are talking about
<zorz>
I even read that! :Ppp
<dlcusa_>
CRUX has no formal "who is|is not a maintainer"--that can be problematic, but it is KISS. ;-)
<SiFuh>
Is it?
<dlcusa_>
Did you miss the wink?
<SiFuh>
I have shit on my core system I need to erase now that I don't fucking need
<SiFuh>
I find it funny that my wife can see this and she doesn't know shit about Linux. Yet the current developers live in a world where they are gods and care nothing for what the users want
<SiFuh>
jaeger "We are users too" Yeah what? Who cares? 1%.
<SiFuh>
My solutions is they rename CRUX and give the name CRUX to us
<dlcusa_>
It's funny since since they number of users is far from impressive.
<SiFuh>
URLS and all
<SiFuh>
dlcusa_: I know way more than 500 users of CRUX
<SiFuh>
Just because 99% are not on IRC doesn't mean they don't exist
<dlcusa_>
And that percentage is...
<SiFuh>
I don't know. I only know the locals
<dlcusa_>
Suffice it to say it's miniscule.
<SiFuh>
CRUX was the perfect distro for those who loved BSD and wanted a BSD like system that wasn't BSD
<farkuhar>
SiFuh: the way you count CRUX users, is it similar to how the OpenBSD page says that basically everybody is an OpenBSD user?
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: No
<farkuhar>
because remiliascarlet had a problem with that paragraph.
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: You are too newbie for this but I was teaching CRUX in 2002 at Uni.
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: I agree with remiliascarlet because it is like saying everone uses Motorolla because one chip in you vaccum cleaner uses it
<farkuhar>
You can teach year after year of CRUX users, reaching more than 500 in all, but how many of them are still with the distro all these years later?
<SiFuh>
I didn't say they were my students
<SiFuh>
I said there are over 500 CRUX users that I know of
<SiFuh>
Are you trying to play mind games with me?
<dlcusa_>
It's fair to say the developers past and present have never made expansion of CRUX mindshare a major goal.
<farkuhar>
SiFuh: sorry, I misinterpreted your statement about teaching CRUX at Uni. I thought you were clarifying where you got the count of 500 active CRUX users.
<SiFuh>
Good because my father said if anyone tries to play mind games with you, you must ignore them or kill them.
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: CRUX 3.7 has 2831 peers. That is pretty cool for a distro of 5 developers
<SiFuh>
farkuhar: In case you don't know. When a new release of CRUX is released. We seed the torrent untill the next release. It's a game but it is also informative
<dlcusa_>
I reasonable question would be is there a critical mass of talent and commitment to fork CRUX?
<dlcusa_>
s/I/A/
<SiFuh>
I think CRUX can be forked with a single person but this is only to focus on CORE and nothing else
<dlcusa_>
But that might be sufficient.
<SiFuh>
The issue I have is not with opt, contrib, xorg or anything else. CRUX is fantastic
<serpente>
it is a simple thing: PAM is NOT required/needed for the core system to work... to be more precise; NOTHING uses it. Now to put it in crux terms, the world "Crux" means Cruxial which is the needed only to work, so by pushing PAM to core you create a paradox of the meaning of this distro
<SiFuh>
It is what they are doing to core is the problem
<serpente>
Keep It Simple... Stupid
<SiFuh>
Actually serpente CRUX was named because it sounded nice. :-(
<serpente>
and ive seen in the past it all starts with pam
<serpente>
next stop is systemd
<serpente>
when this happens im out for good
<SiFuh>
Hahah I sead that yesterday
<SiFuh>
said*
<SiFuh>
dlcusa_: Did you succeed with that OpenBSD USB?
<serpente>
i will get this discussion back in #crux later, in a more proper manner
<serpente>
crux: "The basic, central, or critical point or feature."
<SiFuh>
serpente: I was very good!
<SiFuh>
I reviewed everything I had said and realised I was very restrained even though I wanted to tear the heads of some people
<SiFuh>
I also emptied almost 1/2 a bottle vodka
<serpente>
hahaha
<SiFuh>
I am proud about that
<serpente>
from my point of view PAM only creates another attack surface, complexing and modulazing authentication
<serpente>
i has being exploited in the past
<SiFuh>
Who exploited you? Spill the beans dude!
<serpente>
hahaha, *it*
<dlcusa_>
SiFuh, I'm still trying to make time to finish transcribing the log! My IRC load is high today.
<SiFuh>
dlcusa_: All good, I like you, so no worries
<dlcusa_>
Your IRC load is ALWAYS high.
<SiFuh>
I think so
<SiFuh>
zorz: Shogun was good again
<zorz>
better than the beer?
<SiFuh>
No
<SiFuh>
Asshole!
<zorz>
:)
<SiFuh>
I need to plan y work today
<zorz>
i was reading.... freebsd is not faster than openbsd..... openbsd can be fast as freebsd. So you are right!
<SiFuh>
OpenBSD is the slowest OS on the planet dude
<zorz>
hahahaa
<zorz>
its good for slow people :)
<SiFuh>
Have so many secruity check points
<SiFuh>
You ever go to an airport and need to scan in?
<zorz>
how much fast it should be ?
<zorz>
its fine.
<SiFuh>
OpenBSD has like a thousand of them
<SiFuh>
Just to talk down the hall
<SiFuh>
Here, you go from checkin to immigrations to airplane. 2 right?
<zorz>
yes get it.
<SiFuh>
OpenBSD is scan you ever second you move
<SiFuh>
I didn't even walk, I just brushed my hair back.... SCAN!
<zorz>
its good.
<zorz>
hard times.... no one is safe online nowdays
<SiFuh>
I am
<SiFuh>
Come one, try hack me
<zorz>
i am busy you know
<SiFuh>
Oh I hope my old boss can get me those old sparcs
<zorz>
i could not work till setup obsd... just finished and i am back with the scrape progress.
<zorz>
i missed the dual opteron
<SiFuh>
Scrape? You learned to spell?
<SiFuh>
I miss the ALPHA
<zorz>
next month iam growing my teeth aswell
<SiFuh>
How fucking old are you?
<SiFuh>
Thought you were born in 78 the year of the horse
<zorz>
learning spell next step is the teeth
<SiFuh>
You have no teeth?
<SiFuh>
Stop smoking then
<zorz>
hahahaaa
<zorz>
all of them..... i have no feelings
<SiFuh>
You got offended and hurt feelings by some of my words