<dilyn>
also, I only appropriate texan lango because it's inclusive
<dilyn>
so y'all folx better get with it, y'hear?
<akira01>
GalaxyNova: is already mounted
<claudia>
I always thought that 'y'all' was some kind of urban/hiphopish lang :D
GalaxyNova has quit [Quit: Whoooooshh]
riteo has joined #kisslinux
<riteo>
hiiiiii!
<riteo>
I did it, now minekiss supports fabric!
Guest9706 has quit [Quit: leaving]
<noocsharp>
nice!
<kayw>
minekiss? minecraft for kiss?
<riteo>
sort of
<riteo>
it's a minecraft launcher written in pure* posix shell
<kayw>
oh nice
<akira01>
lol
<riteo>
still, there's no java on kiss, I'll work on it when the time comes
<riteo>
I might also fiddle locally with the package format slightly to make gradle and the whole java stack fit into the "download first, build later" mindset behind kiss
<akira01>
make a port of minecraft to run in shell not java lol
<riteo>
lmao
<riteo>
I seriously plan to make a minecraft clone as my first big c project
<riteo>
but not a regular minecraft clone, one with all I wish minecraft became, expecially on the technical side
<riteo>
btw I just read the note
<noocsharp>
i would do something smaller tbh
<dilyn>
ang: man-pages-posix is actually bundled with man-pages in repo/extra, so we should drop it
<riteo>
I actually quite like the separation behind the huge community repos and the smaller repo! This should burn out dylan way less
<riteo>
althought I'm relatively worried about community feedback
<dilyn>
riteo: ddevault had a minecraft clone iirc
<riteo>
like, staying on the IRC server really gives you an idea of what the community wants and needs
<dilyn>
still on github i believe
<riteo>
dilyn: oh cool
<noocsharp>
it's written in c#
<dilyn>
f
<riteo>
oh
<riteo>
so java microsoft edition
<riteo>
what a bummer
<noocsharp>
i mean...
<riteo>
I'll do it in a later time though, and I'll surely have to learn a TON of stuff, but it'll be worth it I'm sure
<noocsharp>
well i guess it is java microsoft edition
<noocsharp>
but minecraft is already minecraft microsoft edition
<dilyn>
minecraft has been msft edition since like... 2013 or something
<riteo>
minecraft the name itself sort of
<riteo>
minecraft:je is basically the same
<riteo>
microsoft came to notch and like told him: hi we would like your brand
<riteo>
that's the only thing they did lol
<noocsharp>
until they start forcing microsoft accounts this year
<riteo>
i found out it wasn't because of microsoft
<riteo>
mojang just needs "safer" accounts, you know, 2fa and whatnot
<riteo>
so instead of implementing it they're choosing the lazy path, still hate it though
<dilyn>
claudia: i'm opting to drop them one by one in the hopes that people notice something tragic going on the next time they `kiss u` (:
<claudia>
heh, y :D
<claudia>
I thought in perspective of people who have to send several PRs in your way
<dilyn>
also like what xeno-hypster said; maintainers have the option of swapping some packages to wayland, and I don't want to investigate that option myself lol
<dilyn>
they can just say 'i will drop this' and I'll do it for them haha
<claudia>
ah ok
<dilyn>
but they're welcome to if they want their name on it
<dilyn>
they can put a little angsty comment in the PR or a diatribe against ayyland in the commit message...
<dilyn>
express yo selves
<claudia>
Leaving this project full of anger.
<riteo>
oh, it looks like the official repo is free from fribidi
<riteo>
how will it rendere bidirectional text now?
<riteo>
s/rendere/render/
<acheam>
it wont
<cem>
it won't?
<riteo>
so it'll be, like, black squares?
<acheam>
not sure
<riteo>
or will it literally be invisible
<acheam>
kiss targets english, its in the guidestones
<cem>
it'll be black squares
<riteo>
I mean, I'm not arabic or whatever, but on a webbrowser having messed up output is kinda weird
<riteo>
I mean, at this point you could switch to ascii
<rio6>
rotate your screen 180 degrees /jk
Guest55 has joined #kisslinux
<acheam>
xrandr to flip your screen
<riteo>
lmao
<riteo>
I see that kiss avoids // in paths
<riteo>
I wonder both why and how
<riteo>
is /folder//anotherfolder/file non standard?
Guest55 has quit [Client Quit]
<cem>
They are the same to the filesystem, but they are not the same as a string to be parsed
<dilyn>
wl-randr*
<acheam>
no.
<dilyn>
^ multiple slashes behave strangely sometimes too
<riteo>
I see
<acheam>
you will use xrandr on wayland and deal with it.
<dilyn>
musl ml recently (<12mo ago) had a discussion about resolving //, ///, /////...
<dilyn>
you can't... use xrandr... on wayland...
<dilyn>
:thinking:
<cem>
Jokes on all of you neither xrandr nor wl-randr work for me
<cem>
nvidia gang
<dilyn>
wl-randr doesn't work on hikari (:
<riteo>
damn, I'm still kinda unsure about bidirectional text. I mean, isn't it breaking a feature? After all the system supports unicode, doesn't it?
<dilyn>
imagine MY surprise!
<cem>
riteo: I mean, it's not that bad unless you need it
claudia has quit [Quit: zzz]
<riteo>
well, thinking about it it'll be the same as not having arabic fonts I guess...
<dilyn>
I think KISS targets english primarily, fully conforming to UTF be damned
<riteo>
yeah I know that
<riteo>
mhh, I'll have to get used to this idea
<dilyn>
now imagine using only a single font
<dilyn>
and that font only supports english characters...
<riteo>
well I understand that translating is a mess
<riteo>
but I still need accented characters
<riteo>
I'm italian after all
<acheam>
dilyn: what font do you use
<dilyn>
cozette still
<cem>
accented characters are supported by utf
<riteo>
while reading the new changelog I wonder: will dylan switch to pax?
<dilyn>
might move back to iosevka... wish foot supported it better
<acheam>
how do you support a font better?
<dilyn>
dylan wants to! I can't say I blame him
<dilyn>
I'm digging it so far
<acheam>
i can.
<riteo>
I agree it would be a pretty nice thing
<dilyn>
iosevka does ligatures foot does not support ligatures
<akira01>
anyone can help me with my efivar build error?
<riteo>
its portability is scary
<acheam>
o
<dilyn>
akira01: I'm not sure what's up with it
<cem>
acheam: why don't you like pax?
<akira01>
dilyn: you see my logs?
<dilyn>
mmhmm
<acheam>
cem: one more program to install
zola has joined #kisslinux
<acheam>
for 1-2 sec speed gain
<dilyn>
efivar is trying to link against libefivar.so, for a reason
<dilyn>
idk why
<dilyn>
acheam! dylan just saved us all 30 extra packages by switching to wayland!
<dilyn>
you've got package space aplenty!
<cem>
acheam: I mean, true, but it's 180K statically linked on my system
<acheam>
no! I just can't install this one!
<dilyn>
lol
<riteo>
wooo llvm/clang will become officially supported!
<acheam>
yeah thats nice
<cem>
lol
<dilyn>
you'll have an issue building nodejs without libatomic tho
<akira01>
any idea if xwayland will be in the official repo?
<cem>
dilyn: I think acheam has been spending too much time with mid lol
<dilyn>
it won't
<zola>
I see there is a giant purging of X packages from community repo, will they get a new home?
<dilyn>
cem: it's noticeable!
<dilyn>
these impressionable youths (:
<acheam>
leave me be, I need to get back to my bayonet
<dilyn>
efivar was recently updated here d8e18b91c6c7882f4c025c21095c6d9d116e45c2 so it's possible the new version is just... broken...
<akira01>
oh sad :€
<riteo>
oh what does the last part of the changelog about bearssl talk about?
<acheam>
akira01: can always downgrade it temporarily
<riteo>
will dylan think about implementing it or is he just talking about the fact that he considered it?
<akira01>
is just dylan saying that is interesting idea using bearssl
<acheam>
mcf pls port more thingz for us
<akira01>
riteo: considered
<dilyn>
akira01: do export MAKEFLAGS=-j1; kiss b efivar
<dilyn>
should work now
<dilyn>
it's just a race condition
<riteo>
akira01: I see
<akira01>
damn
<acheam>
throw that in the build file?
<akira01>
i will try dilyn
<acheam>
it does make me wonder why dylan was building with -j1
<dilyn>
dylan will see my comment and add it hisself soon enough :v
<acheam>
^^ DYLAN ^^
<dilyn>
he probably didn't set his makeflags that one time...
<dilyn>
j24 might be too much either way
<acheam>
wow whenever you can show that off, eh?
<dilyn>
:) :) :)
<akira01>
anyone knows if dylans read all hes emails?
<cem>
-j24?
<cem>
what?
<dilyn>
3900x baybeeee
<akira01>
i send one about the site not sure he will see
<acheam>
idk, do you read all your emails, akira01?
<riteo>
oh dilyn thinking about it the website should stay as a quick hub to all the community's stuff and to the main website if you plan to keep it up IMO
<riteo>
there are still mirrors and links to irc and whatnot
<dilyn>
i'm just worried about stepping on the official namespace :X
<riteo>
mhh
<riteo>
maybe slowly transition to k1ss-community.org as a domain name?
<acheam>
i can provide *.armaanb.net if you /really/ dont want to step on the namespace lol
<dilyn>
hyphens are bad praxis
<riteo>
then without one
<dilyn>
but yes that's the current plan
<riteo>
I don't get why dylan chose .xyz domains though
<riteo>
those are UGLY
<dilyn>
I won't mind stepping on the namespace as long as dylan doesn't yell at me :v
<zola>
Cheap and available most likely
<dilyn>
heck riteo I'll just get kisscommunity.xyz to flex on u
<riteo>
lmao it'd be consistent though
<riteo>
i don't think he'll scream at you anyways, expecially if it's just an hub to the main website
<cem>
dilyn: do it
<riteo>
and community links I suppose
<dilyn>
> 99c
<dilyn>
kekw
<riteo>
oh yeah xyz domains are cheap a
<riteo>
af
<riteo>
do you know an "important" site that uses it?
<riteo>
abc.xyz
<riteo>
alphabet being based for once
<cem>
i was lowkey expecting luke smith joke
<riteo>
no it's really their domain
<dilyn>
our lovely woods screaming boomer is not a joke cem
<cem>
i'm so sorry
<dilyn>
oh damn my life with qt5 just became trivial
<cem>
openssl?
<dilyn>
mmhmm
<cem>
Ah yes, I also love it when my graphics toolkit requires openssl for some reason
<dilyn>
:v
<cem>
:^)
<acheam>
hey you use webkitgtk you dont get a say
<dilyn>
somebody could bring lirishell to KISS
<dilyn>
and adopt qt5* while they're at it
<acheam>
lol
<dilyn>
frfr
<dilyn>
the sooner the number of packages in community i maintain drops to zero
<dilyn>
the sooner i can kiss r git
<cem>
webkit is literally the simplest browser backend compared to chromium and firefox
<acheam>
which means no more github!
<acheam>
woot
<riteo>
dilyn: will you use your own fork of kiss for that?
<cem>
and don't say crap like netsurf, I use a browser that can actually display most of the web
<acheam>
cem: i mean, I use webkit too
<cem>
acheam: i love you
<dilyn>
lol
<dilyn>
wdym riteo?
<riteo>
well you said you wanted to use fossil
<dilyn>
i've been doing my own KISS thing for a long-ass while (:
<dilyn>
yaaaaahhhhh
<riteo>
you said you wanted to avoid forking a distro now that dylan's there
<dilyn>
i mean officially forking it, where I have to actually be held responsible when I push a breaking update
<riteo>
oh I see
<dilyn>
that's a long ass-while
<acheam>
cem: it doesnt work in this case
<dilyn>
wait a secon...
<riteo>
I'm still kinda unsure about fossil, I kinda like it, as it basically has an integrated huge cool readme (the website part) but at the same time I feel like it does too many things as once
<dilyn>
yeah! now the only one who gets mad when I break their system is me :D
<cem>
acheam: yeah that's true
<acheam>
thats what anyone in love with me would say
<dilyn>
it does many things, that's for sure
* cem
winks, I guess?
<acheam>
someone call the UNIX police
<riteo>
lmao
<cem>
o shit
<acheam>
I called them on dilyn, but now that there here, might as well arrest cem too
<dilyn>
commit to the wink
<dilyn>
wink with both eyes
* cem
gouges own eyes
<cem>
I didn't do it, officer
<cem>
I don't even have eyes
<acheam>
dilyn: literally lol
<cem>
Well, UNIX police can't arrest both dilyn and me
<cem>
But I'm sure they can arrest dilyn really well
<riteo>
wow you're right
<riteo>
they have to do one thing and do it well
<riteo>
oh you already said it lol
<dilyn>
f
<riteo>
well, now that fabric works it's time to put the most important feature in minekiss
<cem>
lmao
<riteo>
KISS style compatibility
<riteo>
minekiss' style is inspired by kiss, but not *identical*
<riteo>
how should I name the variable?
<riteo>
KISS_STYLE?
<cem>
to add a layer to my dumb joke, they can't catch me because I'm middle-eastern and fribidi is dropped
<riteo>
lmao
<riteo>
does anyone know if there's a way to know if the current shell is interactive?
<cem>
Uhm, not in POSIX
<riteo>
I see
<riteo>
wait, how does kiss then work fine with less?
<cem>
You can check whether the output is a terminal
<riteo>
that'll do the job
<cem>
[ -t 1 ]
<riteo>
thanks!
<cem>
You're welcome
<akira01>
gosh dylan removed the eiwd article part saying about add a network
<riteo>
yes, I did it
<riteo>
now minekiss has the most important feature of them all
<riteo>
accurate kiss style compatibility
<riteo>
now it should look identical to kiss
mahmutov has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
<akira01>
guys is mdev required in sway?
<acheam>
idk if its required but your probably going to want a device manager
<acheam>
s/your/you're/g
<dilyn>
you don't need a running device manager service for wayfire, i would assume this extends to sway
<akira01>
i still divided
<akira01>
sway or sway-tiny?
<akira01>
not know what is the gains and the costs
<acheam>
do you want a bar?
<acheam>
if not, sway-tiny
<acheam>
if yes, sway
zenomat has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
<akira01>
the bar is this useful?
<acheam>
not really
<acheam>
I only use a bar on tag-based window managers like DWM
<acheam>
because they are impossible to keep track of without one
<acheam>
but on a workspace-based compositor like sway you can do without it
<acheam>
wow lots of people running IRC as root today
<akira01>
I will test sway
<akira01>
Probably run tiny in few weeks
<zola>
acheam: People running as irc as root aren't really in any more danger than everybody else who just runs irc as their default user
<zola>
If irc client can be exploited to get code execution, then that code will execute with the privileges of the default user
<zola>
And as such be able to access (and destroy) everything that is really important to the person, as everything will be kept in the default user home dir
<rio6>
that's why you run your irc client on a raspberry pi :)
<zola>
That is insecure, that pi will most likely be on your network and all those master hackers could come get you easily
<zola>
You need to get a server on the other side of the planet, and ssh into it
<acheam>
zola: that only applies to single user systems
<acheam>
i was mostly joking too
<acheam>
i run lots of things I shouldn't as root
<dilyn>
ssh into a wireguard machine which exclusively connects to your irc client through a vpn
<rio6>
<You need to get a server on the other side of the planet> that's what I do, but it's for the uptime not for security :P
GalaxyNova has joined #kisslinux
<acheam>
dilyn: maybe I'm just blind, but what's the difference in the case statements in your pre-build hook
<dilyn>
the difference is the first set are very important/things that buid other things
<dilyn>
the second set are things that sit on top of those/extras
<dilyn>
it's a sorting thing rather than a meaning thing
<acheam>
oh
<acheam>
the python people who drilled DRY into my brain are shouting at you right now
<dilyn>
DRY?
<acheam>
dont repeat yourself
<dilyn>
lol
<acheam>
there's an analogous one for most or damp or wet or something I forget it though
<dilyn>
technically I could just put all these in the build files themselves
<dilyn>
considering I maintain every package I use...
<dilyn>
BuT
<dilyn>
nah
<acheam>
yeah thats a dilemma I faced recently too when I was revamping my kiss hook
<dilyn>
I should be better about my hooks
<dilyn>
just delete all of /usr/share frfr
zola has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
<rio6>
I should probably move my configure-related change to hooks so I don't need to fork things like vim just to get python and clipboard to work
zola has joined #kisslinux
<akira01>
sway-tiny get failed to build
zola is now known as Guest2884
<akira01>
Is a good day to install kiss
<GalaxyNova>
lol
<GalaxyNova>
akira01 sauce the kiss log
<akira01>
one sec
<akira01>
termbin.com/e4hq
<Guest2884>
quit
Guest2884 has quit [Quit: leaving]
<GalaxyNova>
akira01: kiss b cmake
<akira01>
Think in this
<GalaxyNova>
or kiss b pango
<akira01>
pango cannot set
<akira01>
because dylans said that pango is not in sway-tiny
<akira01>
i will try
<akira01>
cmake
<akira01>
if works this is a missing dependencie from sway-tiny
<GalaxyNova>
acheam: Good news! wayland fixed the annoying nouveau tty bug
GalaxyNova has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
<acheam>
nice
<akira01>
cmake not work
<akira01>
sway-tiny is not so tiny
<acheam>
akira01: it would be very helpful if you accompanied your issues with logs and at least a somewhat detailed description so that we have a chance at helping you
<akira01>
i send a log
<akira01>
is up in chat
<akira01>
i will send to dylan
<akira01>
is a fresh install of kiss
<dilyn>
sway-tiny definitely depends on pango
<dilyn>
which is basically what that error tells you
<dilyn>
repo/wayland/sway also has a dependency on pango, but sway-no-seat and sway-tiny don't, which looks like a mistake
<testuser[m]>
Hi
akira01 has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
<testuser[m]>
claudia: webkit needed libglvnd for GL stuff right ? To use the WPE renderer
<acheam>
hi testuser[m]
akira01 has joined #kisslinux
<akira01>
well mistake or not
<akira01>
i will send dylan something about it
<testuser[m]>
Wat
<akira01>
sway-tiny error
<akira01>
missing pango
<akira01>
build failed because of it
<acheam>
^^^ DYLAN ^^^
<akira01>
and he said in last post that sway-tiny had no depends on pango
<noocsharp>
hmm, ownership in rust is a really cool idea
<acheam>
I dont really get it from my quick web searching
<acheam>
there are no pointers?
<testuser[m]>
Ddg borrow checker
<testuser[m]>
Idk if they're talking about that
kyxor has joined #kisslinux
<kyxor>
so sad to see packages dropped :(
<noocsharp>
basically things that you allocate on the heap act like something stack allocated, in that they disappear when they go out of scope
<acheam>
so it automatically frees variables for you?
<acheam>
that doesnt seem so revolutionary
<noocsharp>
yes, but with extra flexibility
<rio6>
my experience is more like if I forget to free the compiler won't event compile
<noocsharp>
like a scope can have a variable, and then it can pass off ownership to another scope
<rio6>
free using destructor (I forgot what rust calls it) I mean
<testuser[m]>
Traditional user interfaces can rely on this interface to define the foundations of typical desktops. Currently it's possible to set up background, panels and locking surfaces.
mobinmob has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
gtms has joined #kisslinux
claudia has quit [Quit: zzz]
claudia has joined #kisslinux
<claudia>
haha, sway-tiny does not recognize XF86Audio* keybindings :v
<testuser[m]>
Cuz Its tiny
<testuser[m]>
:p
<acheam>
you can probably just give it the keycode
<dilyn>
sounds like sway is just dum
<dilyn>
maybe they're called wlr_audio :P
Guest4 has joined #kisslinux
smartin has joined #kisslinux
claudia has quit [Quit: zzz]
<soliwilos>
The "mach-o/compact_unwind_encoding.h" bits was removed from (kiss-community) lld's build file? It's not building here without that.
akira01 has joined #kisslinux
Guest4 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
<konimex>
dilyn: you use netbsd-curses?
Guest92 has joined #kisslinux
smartin has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
smartin has joined #kisslinux
<konimex>
how do you generate those terminfo database for your favorite terminal and add it to netbsd-curses database? I can't wrap my head around the docs on its readme
<dilyn>
I don't (:
<dilyn>
foot uses tic -e, which netbsd-curses tic doesn't support. so I just disable it
<konimex>
then I'll just probably move back to ncurses, according to its creator it ain't a GNU project anyway
<dilyn>
it's true, it isn't
<testuser[m]>
Not even GPL (anymore)
<dilyn>
mit 4lyfe
<konimex>
well I don't mind GPL
Guest92 has quit [Quit: Client closed]
<icy>
yo
<icy>
just saw y'all are switching to wayland
<icy>
wasn't dylan firmly against wayland about a year or so ago? what changed?
<dilyn>
humaid_02: maybe, but my chromium build is different from the one that would (eventually) be in community
<acheam>
xsel failed me
<dilyn>
wl-copy is the way
<acheam>
maybe soon
<acheam>
maybe soon
<dilyn>
akira01: you're so close now
<dilyn>
does /usr/share/X11/xkb exist?
<akira01>
no
<dilyn>
install xkeyboard-config
<akira01>
gosh
<akira01>
if works
<akira01>
i had to email dylan again
<akira01>
another missing dep
<dilyn>
yeah
<akira01>
yeah
<akira01>
now work
<dilyn>
either libxkbcommon or wlroots or sway should depend on xkeyboard-config << @dylan (:
<dilyn>
yey
<akira01>
Emailed he
<akira01>
also mentioned that sway-tiny need tty permissions
<akira01>
so is good idea to mention it in wiki
<dilyn>
much easier to just use seatd (:
<akira01>
lol
<akira01>
so
<akira01>
i unfamiliar with sway
<akira01>
how can i start term?
<dilyn>
it's similar to i3 so presumably mod4+enter or mod4+shift+enter
<illiliti>
s/mod4/super
<dilyn>
it's all keycodes to me
<akira01>
whats the best place to put xdg_runtime?
<akira01>
run is not a good idea
<akira01>
delete the dir everytime
<dilyn>
add mkdir $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR to your .profile
<dilyn>
possibly mkdir -p
<akira01>
i already did it
<dilyn>
mkdir -p -m 0700 ...
<akira01>
not did mkdir in .profile
<akira01>
will do
<akira01>
yeah not good idea
<akira01>
it will need root permissions
<akira01>
and in login session
<dilyn>
i mean well
<akira01>
can /tmp be a better place to set?
<dilyn>
you can put it all in /etc/profile and chown $whoami:root, or you can put it in /tmp
<dilyn>
there are many places it can go. basically anywhere tbh
<dilyn>
UNLESS sway would be so picky as to demand it be some place more canonical... but I don't know about that
<akira01>
mouse okay
<akira01>
but nothing about term
<akira01>
debug again
<acheam>
hmmmm mandoc segfaults on sphinx-generated roff tables
<acheam>
thats fun
<dilyn>
I could never get my trackpad to work in sway, that's why i never used it
<acheam>
sway specifically or any wlroots compositor
f1nniboy has joined #kisslinux
<schillingklaus>
what is the major point of wlroots?
<acheam>
wayland is just a protocol
<omanom>
the original goal was to create a codebase of boilerplate that people could then use and build off of
<acheam>
a lot of the stuff that xorg implements isnt implemented by wayland
<acheam>
so instead of having every project implementing the same stuff
<omanom>
"you're going to be writing these xxx lines of code anyways, so we made wlroots to generalize those lines"
<acheam>
wlroots implements it as a library
<msk[m]>
setting GDK_BACKEND to wayland and/or setting MOZ_ENABLE_WAYLAND to 1 did not help
<dilyn>
acheam: sway specifically
<acheam>
interesting
<dilyn>
yeah. it was a very frustrating time
<dilyn>
neither on KISS nor with Arch, which I thought was interesting.
<dilyn>
you'd think that would mean it's my fault, but I'm a genius so that's obviously not it...
<dilyn>
"(/usr/lib/firefox/firefox:1497): GLib-GIO-WARNING **: 12:04:03.231: Failed to create file monitor for /home/michael/.config/glib-2.0/settings/keyfile: Unable to find default local file monitor type" same problem msk?
<dilyn>
i've never seen that one before
<msk[m]>
something is happening to my client, sorry, nothing is loading
<akira01>
damn iam fucking gonna explode sway
<dilyn>
hikari 'justwerked' :v
<msk[m]>
I'll try irssi
<dilyn>
"glxtest: libEGL initialize failed (t=0.535061) |[2][GFX1-]: glxtest: Unable to open a connection to the X server" this is ofc v bad if you're using wayland?
mahmutov has joined #kisslinux
michael has joined #kisslinux
<michael>
back on irssi
<michael>
the log I sent was the full one
<akira01>
sway need to config keyboard?
<michael>
(this is msk)
<akira01>
because it fucking launch nothing
<testuser[m]>
msk repo-bin was last updated half a month ago
<testuser[m]>
So no
<michael>
so I need to get firefox from the official repo?
<michael>
qt5-webengine has an update so I would need to wait a long time either way
<dilyn>
are you running wayland?
<michael>
yeah, this is inside dwl
<dilyn>
how did you manage to install firefox from repo-bin
<dilyn>
are you still using kiss-community/repo?
<dilyn>
you now have dozens of Xlibs installed my man
<michael>
yesterday I cloned dylan's repo
<michael>
not everything has updated
<michael>
but most things
<michael>
dhcpcd, nodejs, openssh, qt5* and wpa_supplicant need updates, that's it
<michael>
this firefox came from kiss-community/bin
<dilyn>
right but that package depends on no less than 13 Xlibs
<schillingklaus>
rust is contagious, I avoid it rigorously
<michael>
I still have xorg installed
<acheam>
hello from dwl
<dilyn>
hng
<michael>
but I would need the firefox package from dylan's repo, then
<michael>
to use wayland with it
<dilyn>
are you using wayland?
<michael>
yeah, I'm inside dwl
<acheam>
as am i
<dilyn>
did you build mesa with x11 & wayland platforms?
<dilyn>
did you enable xwayland in your xorg-server build script?
<michael>
no, I don't have xwayland, I thought firefox could do it natively?
<dilyn>
it *can*
<dilyn>
but that's why you're getting that error with repo-bin's firefox
<dilyn>
if you build mesa with x11 and you build xorg-server with xwayland you don't have to build rust & firefox lol
micro_O has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
<michael>
I only wanted firefox-bin as a quick way to test a browser, I'm planning on using qt5-webengine
<michael>
would that also need xwayland to work easily?
<dilyn>
no, if you plan on using falkon it'll install qt5-wayland
<dilyn>
and then you'll just have to specify QPA platform and it should "justwerk"
<michael>
is falkon special that it can use qt5-wayland, or should that be possible for any qt5-webengine browser?
<michael>
I was going to use qutebrowser
<dilyn>
falkon's special in that it's the only one i've ever tested
<jstnas>
finally got sway to work
<dilyn>
but I assume that any browser using webengine just defers to qt for the graphics plugin it should use
<michael>
so it may work by just replacing qt5-webengine with qt5-wayland in the depends file?
<dilyn>
no you need both
<michael>
oh, it's not a replacement for anything
<dilyn>
qt5 is normally responsible for providing the plugin backend (xcb, gles, w/e), but if you use wayland you have to have qt5-wayland to provide EGL
<dilyn>
webengine is the 'browser' part of falkon -- falkon is basically just some KDE fun splashed on top
<jstnas>
/run/user/$(id -u) did not work as $XDG_RUNTIME_DIR, /tmp/$(id -u) was suggested by gentoo
<dilyn>
i believe i pushed my update for qt5* yesterday, so it should be as easy as kiss b qt5-webengine qt5-wayland
<michael>
I only see subtractions in the qt5-webengine package, so shouldn't it work if I just build qt5-wayland?
<michael>
qt5-webengine is going to take all day
<michael>
I'd rather update it later
<michael>
or is qt5-wayland a big one as well?
micro_O has joined #kisslinux
<michael>
alright, thanks a million dilyn, I'll let it compile and go do my chores
claudia has joined #kisslinux
<claudia>
Hm, I have not quite found out what I have to do "to be the first to call DRMSetMaster"
<claudia>
A syscall in this direction was introduced with linux 5.8, I guess. So for unprevileged users it was possible to become the 'drm master'
<claudia>
I have a kernel which is able to do this :v
<akira01>
testuser[m]: i need to config the keyboard in sway to make it work?
<dilyn>
michael: qt5-webengine shouldn't need a rebuild, afaik
<dilyn>
qt5-wayland should be relatively quick; about as long as qt5-declarative to build
<akira01>
now i know
<akira01>
the keyboard work
<akira01>
thanks duckduckgo to keys how move the mouse
<akira01>
but fuck
<akira01>
foot wont launch :€
<akira01>
Gosh
<akira01>
Is fonts
<omanom>
do you have fontconfig installed?
<akira01>
yeah
<akira01>
Is something with fonts in foot
kqz` has joined #kisslinux
<acheam>
do you have a font installed?
<akira01>
Prettt dumb liberation fonts fault
<kqz`>
test
<acheam>
test passed kqz`
<akira01>
acheam: i had nothing is because of it foot wont launch
<kqz`>
lol think the matrix bridge is borked, not seeing irc messages
<acheam>
akira01: so drop to the tty and isntall a font then
<dilyn>
font size in foot is set similar to how fontconfig reads things
<dilyn>
or rather, they're syntactically similar
<akira01>
oh so i can put a .config file to change it?
<acheam>
dilyn: did you choose #dcdcdc as your foreground because its your initials? lol
<dilyn>
clever if true
<dilyn>
but no
<dilyn>
yes akira; idr the defaults foot uses
<acheam>
I am judging you very hard for having so many things in ~
<acheam>
also dotfiles in ~/.cache
<kqz>
test 2
<dilyn>
those test past
<kqz`>
ok so its passing the messages to the channel but not back to matrix
<dilyn>
acheam: cleaning ~ is hard :(
<dilyn>
I stopped using ccache shortly before ccache.conf moved to .config, sue me :P
<acheam>
see you in small claims court, mister
<dilyn>
just 22 files :'(
<acheam>
but some easy improvements: .shrc can go anywhere, .profile can be merged with .shrc, .gitconfig can go to .config/git/config, .asoundrc can be specified at a custom location, you can not use the BLOAT of vim, and .system/* can be moved to .local/
<dilyn>
and most of them are just temporary to serve as reminders
<acheam>
lol yeah I do that too
<acheam>
I usually have a todo, tmp1, tmp2, and tmp3 file
<dilyn>
most of the files in that repo aren't even on disk anymore
<dilyn>
that's why they're in there xD
<dilyn>
I like keeping .shrc separate from .profile :X
<acheam>
but why
<acheam>
also what is the advantage of running foot as client/server?
<dilyn>
less ram usage per terminal
<dilyn>
tho if the server crashes, all your terms die
<acheam>
how often does that happen?
<dilyn>
it's happened once in the last four months or something?
<micro_O>
dilyn: the way i've cleaned ~/ is by changing permissions to read-only :)
<dilyn>
lmfao
<acheam>
dilyn: i think I can take that risk lol
<dilyn>
most of my things live in /mnt/share, and half the things in ~ are symlinks to there
<noocsharp>
d'you see his terminal emulator made just to spite the windows terminal people?
konimex has joined #kisslinux
E5ten[m] has joined #kisslinux
<kyxor>
yeah I saw that
testuser[m] has joined #kisslinux
jstnas has joined #kisslinux
felinae has joined #kisslinux
kqz has joined #kisslinux
rgybmc[m] has joined #kisslinux
msk[m] has joined #kisslinux
<kyxor>
Actually I've been handmade network lurker for very long time, though last year I burned out and left, I still have my Pbr vulkan game engine that I wrote from scratch though
<kyxor>
That code base is pretty solid, pure c99, rewrote it 3 times over span of 2 years. Interesting experience.
<kyxor>
Learned a lot of things
<noocsharp>
neat, you have a link?
<kyxor>
Nah, it's private I think I might come back to it again some time, maybe make it public
<kyxor>
I am currently working on this library https://github.com/kyx0r/pikevm the goal is to create fastest regex implementation in the world? Xd but with 0 bloat and all resonable features
<msk>
anyone else having their font break on foot, but work fine on other emulators?
<msk>
nvm, finally fixed it
claudia has joined #kisslinux
msk has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
msk has joined #kisslinux
<noocsharp>
kyxor: can i ask why there are semicolons right after colons on case labels?
<kyxor>
scope, it's equalent to case 'a': {}
<kyxor>
when you create varibles inside switch cases they have to be scoped
<kyxor>
or you can just make then outside of the switch case, I am pretty sure compilers optimize those the same way
<noocsharp>
ah, i've always just used braces, didn't realize the semicolon did the same thing
<kyxor>
semicolon is cleaner because you don't have to make new lines, less loc
spei has joined #kisslinux
<noocsharp>
good to know
spei has quit [Client Quit]
<acheam>
goddamn it someone take rm -rf away from me
<kyxor>
why? I had an alias rm = rm -rf for years now, never made a mistake in deleting something
<dilyn>
rm="rm -i"
<kyxor>
prompts are annoying, well it's interesting though, that if you do alias rm to always -Rf, then you never make mistakes because you know that this command is deadly, so you always check before you commit
<kyxor>
its a psychological thing
<noocsharp>
see, i just think of rm as dangerous so i don't need that
<kiedtl>
heya all
<kiedtl>
corrupted filesystem took me offline for two days, what'd i miss?
<dilyn>
lol
<dilyn>
a lot
<kiedtl>
did kisslinux merge into fsf?
<kiedtl>
ohhhhh
<kiedtl>
dylan's back, veyr nice
<claudia>
We are now 21st century linux.
<kiedtl>
so it looks like stuff from kiss-community's kiss/repo "fork" is being merged back upstream after all?
<kiedtl>
what about the wiki? unless im missing something there's no mention of that in the posts
<kyxor>
no, dylan is doing his own thing
<kiedtl>
damn
<acheam>
lol hi kiedtl
<kiedtl>
heay
<kyxor>
wayland is not the meta
<kiedtl>
heya
<acheam>
heay
<kyxor>
now*
<kiedtl>
yeah, I can't stand wayland
<kiedtl>
which probably means I won't use KISS again even if I get the chance, but well it was fun while it lasted
<kiedtl>
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
<acheam>
you can use KISS without the main repo!
<acheam>
thats what i'm doing
<kyxor>
honestly I don't even know, wayland might be actually less efficient than Xorg, because everything has to go though gpu, and compositor
<kiedtl>
^^
<kiedtl>
that's one of th emain things
<kiedtl>
acheam: yeah... I'm kinda at the stage where I don't really want to fiddle too much with my distro anymore, and just kind of want to use the defaults and get some actual work done :p
<dilyn>
ubuntu gang
<kiedtl>
so unless there's a reliable kiss-xorg repo I dunno if that'd work
<acheam>
thats the path most people take lol
<acheam>
there will be im sure
<kiedtl>
I mean, I still use alpine
<dilyn>
there IS a kiss-xorg repo
<kiedtl>
ah, nice
<dilyn>
you could also take over kiss-community/repo
<dilyn>
which I am going to turn into a kiss-xorg+libressl repo at the end of the month
<kiedtl>
but then I'd have to blame myself for screwed up packages :(
<dilyn>
:)
<kiedtl>
I'd rather take peace in the thought that I can always just come here and howl when I find a borken package
<acheam>
I will say, ive tried way more new things now that i've hard forked
<kiedtl>
but I'm just spoiled, lol
<kiedtl>
Yeah, KISS is a really nice learning experience
<akira01>
guys
<akira01>
now that kiss is wayland pure
<kiedtl>
but now that I'm kind of disillusioned with the whole simplicity thing I'm beginning to wonder if that's the only thing it's good at :(
<akira01>
chroot is not more a option right?
<kiedtl>
...?
<acheam>
you can launch wayland programs from within a chroot so long that XDG_RUNTIME_DIR is mounted
<akira01>
but i mean X programs
<kyxor>
but sadly not x11 programs, like I run blender from arch-chroot
<akira01>
yeah
<akira01>
that what i mean
<akira01>
someone pls do xwayland package in community for community sake
<kiedtl>
you go ahead :)
<dilyn>
xwayland not allowed
<akira01>
but dilyn :(
humaid_02 has joined #kisslinux
<kiedtl>
tf? Do the repos have to be *that* pure of x11?
<acheam>
if youre using xwayland just use xorg
<dilyn>
^
<akira01>
I just need xwayland for steam and nothing more
claudia has quit [Quit: zzz]
<dilyn>
so build xorg-server with xwayland enabled
<dilyn>
and mesa with the x11 platform
<dilyn>
ezclap
<noocsharp>
crazy that dylan's decision caused so many people to move to wayland
<soliwilos>
Pretty sure you'd also need to do things like build wlroots with xwayland support. If you use a compositor which relies on it.
<dilyn>
yes also that
<thebuzzing>
Without the intent of starting a war, why did we decide wayland is an okay redhat decision, but like, pulseaudio is satan?
<noocsharp>
wayland is simpler than its predecessor, pulseaudio is more complicated
<noocsharp>
it has nothing to do with red hat afaic
<soliwilos>
Didn't more or less the majority of Xorg devs leave the project to make something simpler/better?
<thebuzzing>
Makes sense, it's just about simplicity?
<noocsharp>
keep it simple stupid
<kiedtl>
it is true, wayland is free of a lot of legacy trash from xorg
<thebuzzing>
A few months back, prior to Dylan taking a break, the room was talking about how Redhat devs had posted a blog saying they were basically the sole maintainers of Xorg, and they were no longer interested in it, so they were going to dump it and we had to either like it or lump it.
<kiedtl>
I mean yes
<thebuzzing>
I remember the room being sorta mad about it, but since then we've obviously had a change of heart, just wondered what the turning point was.
<kiedtl>
when you're the maintainer of an ancient codebase nobody blames you when you decide to quit
<kyxor>
but now redhat is gone, it was bought by other company right?
<kiedtl>
at least, I don't blame them
<kiedtl>
erm, they're not really gone
<thebuzzing>
IBM, but I think they let them basically continue as before.
<kiedtl>
^^
<thebuzzing>
I guess I don't blame them either. I don't even want to maintain my own systems, let alone legacy other peoples systems.
<acheam>
ok I give in
<acheam>
im installing chromium
<kyxor>
oh yehaaa
<acheam>
I find it funny that chromium needs node to build
<acheam>
like, you need to compile a part of chromium to build that same part of chromium again
<kyxor>
yeah lets build that V8 js engine twice
<thebuzzing>
Hey, if you install chromium you can enjoy the unparalleled joy of laggy gaming on various streaming platforms!
<kiedtl>
acheam: what happened? too many firefox issues?
<acheam>
too many webkit issues
<acheam>
I never used firefox on kiss
<kiedtl>
ouch
<acheam>
more just that I dont want to keep gtk, ruby, ruby, and some GNU libraries around for my browser
<acheam>
s/ruby/perl
<kyxor>
rusty firefox < fat chromium
<acheam>
indeed
<acheam>
I dont even have words to describe webkit
<acheam>
I was considering palememe
<rio6>
I kinda want gcc to be able to compile rust so I don't need to install llvm, but at the same time compile time for gcc would be even slower
<kyxor>
this is bad, if gcc gets rusty, then chances of kernel getting rusty is even higher than before
<acheam>
kernel is getting rusty
<acheam>
thats not a question in my mind
<acheam>
but at least it will be sloooooow
<acheam>
it will mostly be obscure device drivers at first
<acheam>
nobody really wants to rewrite ELF loading in rust
<noocsharp>
i wonder how many files of code can be deleted in the major browser engines without anyone noticing
mahmutov has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
<noocsharp>
i don't think rust's gonna become super popular in the kernel at all
<rio6>
there will be people pushing for it
<GalaxyNova>
I would really not like rust in the kernel
<GalaxyNova>
rust takes ages to compile
<noocsharp>
and there will be more pushing back probably
<GalaxyNova>
nah
<GalaxyNova>
we're the minority
<GalaxyNova>
most people don't care about compile times because other people do the compilling for them
<thebuzzing>
I doubt most people are pushing back, most people just have no strong feelings either way.
<noocsharp>
but kernel developers do, and they will be pushing back
<rio6>
yeah rust compilation is really slow
<kyxor>
the problem I see with rust is that its a parasite, they don't just rewrite everything from ground up, they use up all C and C++ stuff, require wrappers and create bloat. Just the fact that rust uses llvm instead of making their own llvm written in rust, is terrible.
<GalaxyNova>
not only that
<GalaxyNova>
compilling rustc and cargo also takes a lot of time
<kiedtl>
too slow? no, don't you see, you just have too many lines of code!
<GalaxyNova>
and rustc is a frontend to llvm so that's also pulled in as a dep...
<acheam>
was waiting for kiedtl's input lol
<kiedtl>
(/s)
<acheam>
rustc can soon be a frontend to gcc
<kiedtl>
and yes, I am silently celebrating at the thought of a Rust frontend for gcc
<kiedtl>
and for Rust inclusion in the kernel, hehe
<GalaxyNova>
that's a relatively new development
<acheam>
it is indeed
<rio6>
I don't think the kernel even has c++
<noocsharp>
acheam: chromium has python instead of ruby/perl
<kyxor>
people think making more layers of abstraction makes the program simpler, while in reality it is a complete opposite.
<GalaxyNova>
^^^
<acheam>
noocsharp: id rather have python2 over ruby/perl
msk has quit [Quit: leaving]
<noocsharp>
fair
<cem>
they are all dead languages after all
<kiedtl>
not ruby
<cem>
ruby is as alive as perl
<kiedtl>
ruby is used quite a bit in the webdev sector
<noocsharp>
they all *should be dead languages
<acheam>
perl would be honestly cool if it was still well adopted, and python didnt exist
<kiedtl>
now whether they deserve to be dead is another question
<acheam>
like, I wouldnt mind the combo of C + sh + perl
<noocsharp>
great way to make an ugly language
<kiedtl>
acheam: I dunno, I've tried perl and it just wasn't great
<cem>
interpreted languages were a mistake
<cem>
with the exception of sh and awk
<acheam>
thank god
<kyxor>
cem: shell is pretty good
<kyxor>
as interpreted language, everything else not needed
<kiedtl>
lol
<noocsharp>
i still think using a low-level language in a shell is not a bad idea
<kiedtl>
something like an interpreted C?
<kyxor>
I like the idea of TempleOs shell
<cem>
noocsharp: just pipe into gcc
<noocsharp>
yeah, holyc is waht i was thinking
<kiedtl>
TempleOS shell sounds really cool
<kiedtl>
ought to try that sometime
<noocsharp>
i started writing a parser for a language that may or may not be complete in several years, for that purpose
<GalaxyNova>
noocsharp: compiller would be horribly slow
<GalaxyNova>
and the code would be full of hacks
<noocsharp>
wdym?
<kiedtl>
What makes you think so?
aws has quit [Quit: Quit]
<noocsharp>
the templeos jit compiler is super fast
<kiedtl>
it's not necessarily compiling a full binary, it's just running the code
<rio6>
some sort of jit
<kyxor>
you do guys ever get a bug in kirc when you reach the end of terminal window size, the text starts to wrap to new lines and displays corrupted symbols. doesn't always happen, probably depends on the last character