Werner changed the topic of #armbian to: armbian - Linux for ARM development boards | www.armbian.com | Github: github.com/armbian | Commits: #armbian-commits | Developer talk: #armbian-devel | Forum/Twitter feed: #armbian-rss | Type 'help' for help | Logs: -> irc.armbian.com
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<Armbian-Discord> <N​eonFetch> that was an amazing new. long live panfrost! 🙂
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<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> [thebug] someone advised Quectel EC25-A for modem
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> so grabbed one from the ebay
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<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> any idea how I can find uart serial pins on a random undocumented rockchip tablet motherboard?
<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> should I be looking for something obvious?
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> Look for a group of 3 or 4 pins
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<BCMM> i'm really not an expert in these things, but aren't they more likely to be just, like, test points, as opposed to actual pins?
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> yup
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> they will say debug or uart
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> you will also need a usb to ttl converter
<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> nothing obvious i'm afraid
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> need to see full board both sides
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<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> that looks like it might be bottom side
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<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> maybe here?
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> hmm maybe not
<stipa> uart on a board is a luxury
<stipa> maybe there's JTAG
<stipa> d​jaye , sexy joints on that power port
<stipa> first you tin the wire, then solder it on things, some flux in between is welcome
<stipa> for even better job tin the surfaces you're soldering your tinned wire to
<stipa> you're be a pro over night
<stipa> qou'll*
<stipa> you'll*
<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> i made these joints 6 years ago back when i was just getting started with soldering
<stipa> d​jaye maybe your board has that USB thing to upload the firmware
<stipa> through USB directly
<stipa> or, find a datasheet of that rockchip soc and see what pins are uart and try to trace them on the board
<stipa> is that rockchip the main chip?
<stipa> what's that big one doing?
<stipa> in the middle
<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> yes its a rk3066 chip
<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> I flash firmware through the microusb port, which is also usb otg
<stipa> right
<stipa> try to find in datasheet which pins are uart on rockchip
<Armbian-Discord> <d​jaye> the chip is bga so tracing the lines would be quite hard
<stipa> if you have any better idea go for it
<stipa> i never did that but i guess when you reboot the device serial port would spit some data that could be probbed by oscope
<stipa> while probing traces try to guess what each is
<stipa> and write it down
<stipa> i guess fast data like buses won't look nice on the oscope if you have a slow one
<stipa> but serial data should be clear
<stipa> but even if you found it it might be that it's out of function
<stipa> or not even soldered to the board
<stipa> dunno
<stipa> it's a proper reverse engineering
<stipa> there are some test points on the back of the board
<stipa> do you see those four in a row below the power port?
<stipa> that could be uart
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> jtag vs console
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<Guest63> hello
<Guest63> i need somehelp please
<Guest63> i m only here ?
<Guest63> i m new
<Xogium> don't ask to ask just ask ;)
<Guest63> hahah
<Guest63> ok
<Guest63> sorry
<Guest63> ok
<Guest63> i want to install armbian on wince system
<Guest63> but i don t see the version for
<Xogium> armbian on wince ?
<Guest63> on wince device like gps navigator
<Guest63> it it s 600mhz cpu and 128MB ram
<Guest63> it can t se the motherboad name on the technical fiche
<Xogium> well its hard to make a port for such devices considering most of them are probably not even supported by upstream linux and such
<Guest63> yeah
<Guest63> but wait llok that
<Guest63> it s from the site
<Guest63> Using our automated build system
<Guest63> If you do not own the proper equipment to build images on your own, you can make use of the automated build system. Packages are recompiled every night (starting at 00:01 CEST) and a few testing images are produced. These images are accessible on the download server under board folder, subfolder “Nightly”.
<Guest63> it cant see the image
<Xogium> well, if noone ported your device to armbian, that wouldn't surprise me
<Guest63> yeah i nown.
<Guest63> armbian it soo simple
<Xogium> you would have to make a port of it yourself
<Guest63> a port ?
<Xogium> but I don't know any details of this, since I'm neither an user nor a dev of armbian
<Guest63> do u have a linkplease ?
<Xogium> porting armbian to your own device
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Yeah, you would need to add a kernel/u-boot etc that supports your device
<Xogium> including kernel and bootloader and etc.
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> I do not believe an Intel StrongARM has any upstream.support. (closest device I can think of at 600-ish mghz from that era)
<Guest63> the bootloader i will have that with the imager tool but the rest i dont have an image
<Xogium> if you have the kernel vendor's sources and same for the bootloader it might be workable. Same if upstream linux/bootloader supports your hardware. If you only have binaries that might not work out so well
<Guest63> ok .
<Guest63> thanks
<Xogium> if your kernel is earlier than 3.10, you're out of luck to use armbian
<Guest63> what s kernel ?
<Xogium> linux kernel
<Guest63> yeah but i don t have an image
<Xogium> vendors tend to fork an old version of it and never update it again
<Guest63> you have some link please i look ?
<Guest63> because i have nothing
<Xogium> well if you don't have even the sources of a kernel or bootloader, you're in for a tough ride
<Xogium> I'd recommend to check if upstream linux supports the hardware you want to run this on
<Guest63> with usbimager that create a bootloader no ?
<Guest63> link rufus or ethcher ?
<Guest63> just the kernel with the image i don t have
<Guest63> i check for upstream linux support
<Xogium> it won't create a bootloader for you
<Xogium> that will just create a bootable usb drive
<Xogium> but for it to be bootable you need an actual bootloader in your image
<Guest63> aah ok.
<Guest63> i am looking now
<Guest63> buut
<Guest63> do i have to switch to and other os ?
<Guest63> it s other link armbian
<Guest63> simply root
<Guest63> ?
<Xogium> I don't understand your question, sorry
<Xogium> can you try asking another way ?
<Guest63> yes sorry my bad
<Guest63> i m looking for an way to find an image. i m looking for linux kernels but do i have to change to an other os no armbian ?
<Xogium> no the goal would be to integrate this kernel source into your own build
<Xogium> same for the bootloader
<Guest63> aaah ok
<Guest63> i start to underthand
<Guest63> all the sub os have the same kernel ?
<Guest63> sorry i use just sometime linux
<Werner> Buster, Focal, Bullseye... all share the same kernel/uboot package
<Werner> However these packages are different depending on board family
<Guest63> aah ok
<Xogium> thanks Werner ;) you put it in words faster than I could
<Guest63> now i have to find a 3.10 kernel version
<Xogium> or later
<Guest63> ok
<Xogium> but like I say, it all depends what the vendor of your SoC gives, some don't even publish the source code
<Werner> you're welcome :)
<Guest63> and what i do after that ?
<Xogium> upstream linux is up to 5.13
<Guest63> thanks a lot
<Xogium> you do the very same thing for the bootloader
<Xogium> try to find the sources of the vendor's bootloader, if not, try to see if upstream u-boot -- that is generally the bootloader for ARM is, support your hardware
<Guest63> ok and armbian in there ?
<Xogium> if you find all of this, then you might be able to assemble something for armbian, though Werner might be able to help much more on that end since he is a dev of armbian, iirc
<Guest63> ok
<Guest63> thanks
<Guest63> i look for that weekly
<Xogium> but yeah, one step at a time, as they say ;)
<Guest63> thanks to take your time for me
<Guest63> haha
<Xogium> no problem at all
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<Guest63> i have the u boot boot looder
<Guest63> what format i download ,
<Guest63> ?
<Guest63> im on windows
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> we are almost all on linux 😉
<Guest63> sorry it s ok;
<Guest63> ok i think i will install that nown
<Guest63> wait
<Guest63> i dual boot always
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> what exactly you want to achive?
<Guest63> armbian
<Guest63> on a wince device
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> with 3.10 kernel and some outdate u-boot --- trash the hw
<Guest63> i need bootlooker firt with kernel
<Guest63> newer
<Guest63> ok
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> we have trashed Odroid c1 for example for the same reason
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> and is probably much more populer and used
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> u-boot was never mainlined, which means death sentence
<Guest63> odroid is and andoid os ?
<Guest63> u boot bootlooder u say
<Guest63> ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> odroid is a modern version of hw you want to boot 😉
<Guest63> it s ok no ,
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> https://www.hardkernel.com/shop/odroid-c1/
<Guest63> ook
<Guest63> that and a raspberry
<Guest63> what is better ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> if you are not awere of the problym complexity it doesn't mean its simple 😉
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> discontionued hardwware without modern software vs raspberrry pi?
<Guest63> i needed to traduct because i don t speak for first language english but ok . by the link ?
<Guest63> it s not my hw
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> if hw is not on our support list, there is nothing we can do
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> its too hard and very expensive to assist
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> this is the start https://forum.armbian.com/forum/22-board-bring-up/
<Guest63> im a sorry.
<Guest63> just i was looking for a way
<Guest63> now i have a way
<Guest63> just i want a support to finish
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> understand. but hard reality is that whart you want is not simple
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> and is expensive
<Guest63> i need just an bootloader u boot ?
<Guest63> and kernel ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> "just"
<Guest63> newer better
<Guest63> no no just
<Guest63> because i m nob i follow that step
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> this is hard job for experts
<Guest63> after that to compile just if i can have more help
<Guest63> aaah ok
<Guest63> sorry
<Guest63> u have a work
<Guest63> but i start good
<Guest63> thanks
<Guest63> a loot for your time
<Werner> Many of us aren't native English speaker as well. I am German for example and Igor is Slovenia ;)
<Werner> Porting Armbian to a new/old device can be as easy as a similar image just works OOB up to impossible due to lack of vendor sources and/or configs, hw schematics, device tree and so on...
<Guest63> ooh ok
<Guest63> thanks for your explication
<Guest63> i m from france
<Werner> Salut :)
<Guest63> salut
<Guest63> ;)
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> i drive french car 😉
<Xogium> ooh, french
<Xogium> cool
<Guest63> haha
<Werner> haha
<Xogium> I'm french, too !
<Guest63> i drive a peugeot ,
<Guest63> ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> me 2 308SW
<Guest63> enchanté
<Guest63> nice car
<Xogium> to be fair I did tell him the basic for porting to armbian because I wrongly assumed he knew how ;)
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes, i am pleased. now soncd 308 in a row, after nenault
<Xogium> so, that's my bad for that
<Werner> no worries
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> its hard to know how much persons really know about
<Guest63> i see that before
<Guest63> but i need to learn more about
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> armbian-config is interface with the low level. tooling
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> sw install and similar
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> https://github.com/armbian/config
<Guest63> ok. Thanks i have those links
<Guest63> i will loke after
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> if you have scripting skills, we plan to rewrite this tool https://forum.armbian.com/topic/16933-armbian-config-rfc-ideas/
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> its a waya to learn a about hw on the way
<Guest63> haha i cant code
<Guest63> or script
<Werner> Me neither ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
<Guest63> hahaha
<Guest63> it s u the erperts
<Guest63> experts
<Werner> I wasn't joking actually I have low skills in shell scripting, virtually zero in C or similar. That's it
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> not many experts / not enough
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> this means you can learn a massive a lot of things 😉
<Guest63> yeah sure
<Guest63> thanks a loot guys
<Guest63> u do a great job
<Guest63> continue in that way
<Xogium> oh, while you guys are around, [TheBug] told me you were in need of some really good build machine for the armbian CI ? I was wondering what specs you guys recommend for this, disk space, ram, cpu
<Xogium> etc.
<Werner> main build engine is TR 64 core IIRC
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> 16 CPU 32 gig ram VM would be minimim specs for affing to CI
<Xogium> oh, is it ? Hmm
<Xogium> ah well… I was offering because I got this ryzen 7 3700x and 32 gb ram machine right next to me, but I see it won't quite work
<Werner> If it were dedicated it could be a useful CI runner anyways I think
<Xogium> yeah… But then it wouldn't do anything else
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> well, we onlyy use this from time to time
<Xogium> really ? Hm. I thought CI meant continuous integration so that meant running 24/7
<Xogium> I probably took the word too litterally
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> we only rebuild things when its needed
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> not just like that
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> kernel changes every few days at best
<Xogium> would it still be some help though ?
<Xogium> I'm afraid my ryzen 7 has not much weight against a threadreaper ;)
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> rootfs rebuild once per month, unless packages are shuffled here and there
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> it does
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> i tried to add my NaS as one runner
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> that was a joke 😉 its 6C Pentium D
<Xogium> oh wow
<Xogium> lol
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> but it has plenty of memory, so i tried
<Xogium> right so this 3700x has like 8 cores 16 threads and can definitely maintain the 4.2 ghz frequency boost for a while
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> i have 3950x for workstatuion and its faster then lans dual xeon 😉
<Xogium> it built a vanilla x86_64 linux defconfig in about 2 minutes
<Xogium> temperature are stable at around 60C max
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> do you see timing here https://github.com/armbian/build/actions/runs/1059772264
<Xogium> but I have 1 tb nvme only in there. I did not put any mechanical drive in, although I suppose I could, somehow, maybe. It is my first time using a desktop for years, and I've never put hard drives in there yet
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> 1h 20m is one threadripper VM, 10h is 1/2 of Pentium D
<Xogium> yeah, some of them take 4 hours, one took an hour and 40 minutes, something like that ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> for similar job
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> we have two VM on threadriopper. both has 128C and 80G of memory
<Xogium> so I guess my ryzen 7 would be closer to the theadreaper ;)
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> defently
<Xogium> but not as, er good as it
<Guest63> u have a link please to assemble kernel and bootlooder with armbian ,
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> it can be 2-3x slower
<Guest63> ?
<Xogium> I feel kinda pathetic with my 16 theads 32 gb ram lol
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> bootloader is diofferent for each hardware
<Guest63> i use u boot
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> pathetic is my try with Pentium D 😉 which is much slower
<Xogium> I have someone with an amd epic server, otherwise, with 40 gb ram…
<Guest63> ^^
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> Guest63: each hardware different
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> your hw. no idea
<Xogium> Model name: AMD EPYC Processor (with IBPB)
<Xogium> CPU family: 23
<Xogium> Model: 1
<Werner> Almost all of our image use uboot too, however the config for every board is different. Since the build script takes care about the process creating uboot and kernel images basically the step by step manual is reading the code: https://github.com/armbian/build
<Guest63> aah ok
<Guest63> thanks
<Xogium> that server is on spinning disk however… and might not be the best choice. Perhaps mine would work faster considering the nvme drive
<Xogium> but it all depends what disk space requirements you folks have ;)
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> 250G perhaps?
<Werner> Spinning disk but good bandwidth would be useful for torrent sharing ;)
<Guest63> u are on ubuntu or ,
<Guest63> ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> and upload line must be decent since artefacts are uploading to our server
<Xogium> ah well, hmm
<Xogium> I don't have decent upload, yet
<Xogium> 250 gb sounds like something I could definitely spare
<Xogium> I'll see what I can do about getting better connection
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> how bad it is now?
<Xogium> erm
<[TheBug]> :Z
<Xogium> really really bad
<Xogium> here, I'll show
<[TheBug]> simple answer he is on DSL, for $15 more a month can upgrade to fiber I think..
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> uf 😉
<Xogium> yep I'd do it but since my income is really new and we did buy the place and are not renting it, we're definitely not sure about the impact going for fiber would make
<Xogium> not to mention that fiber or not, I'm stuck on wifi because none of the ethernet sockets in the walls work
<[TheBug]> 5Ghz? thats at least 100Mbit
<Xogium> 2.4 ghz only
<[TheBug]> Ouch
<Xogium> this wifi router is so crap it is wifi 4
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yeah, my 4g connection via vpn is almost 3x faster 😉
<Xogium> I checked in there and there is litterally not one option to enable anything but 2.4 ghz
<Xogium> wifi 4, not even wifi 5 let alone wifi 6
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> upgrade to fiber will cost 150 per year?
<Xogium> more like 180 euros per year
<Xogium> it sounds stupid but heh, when you have not a lot of income
<Xogium> at least with fiber they would be forced to hand a better router
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> well, we can put that on our bill, you take the rest?
<Xogium> huh, sorry ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> if you can run one runner at your hw with lets say 95% reliability, we cover you those expenses
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> but we have to test if it makes sense in term of cpu power
<Xogium> oh hmm
<Xogium> how do we test ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> one moment
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> one VM would be nice to have, so we can ruin it 😉
<Xogium> heh
<Xogium> I got debian 11 running over there… I'm er, really not good at debian though so I might act a bit dumbly :p
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> then i 'll give you instructions how to install github runner
<Xogium> I'm used to archlinux
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> this runs on anything
<Xogium> yeah hmm so
<Xogium> I could probably make an arch vm in my debian
<Xogium> but then that would split the cpu power and such. My cpu is only a 8 core 16 threads
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> your machjine is 24/7 up, right?
<Xogium> hmm should be, yeah… Unless something bad happens or if I have to shut it down for whatever reason
<Xogium> but I'd try to warn you guys in advance for that
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yeah, that's not a problem. this is 3rd location of runners
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> if runner is offline its skipped
<Xogium> ah
<Xogium> I plan on building stuff using buildroot on there as well, but if you guys build packages and etc only once a month, I figure I can definitely spare a few hours a month just to help you out ;)
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> a little more often than one per month, but not everyday
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> kernel packages are rebuild whenever there is a change ion source, once per weekl
<Xogium> yeah so I can still use it to be my daily driver
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes ofc. lets eveluate some time and we will see
<Xogium> ah yeah kernels should be no trouble at all… 2 minutes or less to build a vanilla one
<Xogium> yeah I'll see what I can do for the vm… Given I have only 32 gb ram in total and 16 threads, do you think the vm would work out ok with say, half of this ? That's really the max of my hw
<Xogium> I'm not sure I could add more ram on my own if I needed that, and my cpu cooler is rather big :D noctua nh-u14-s
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> give 14 threads to vm
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<Xogium> huh, and leave 2 for the host ?
<Xogium> that sounds quite unbalanced
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes, its plenty
<Xogium> and if I need to take the vm down to build stuff using br and it takes 5 minutes, that would be fine ?
<Werner> doing a full virtual machine takes ressources. Something simple like lxc would do as well. both host and container could share same ressources as needed
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes, but probably you don't need to
<Xogium> heh I suppose it the vm doesn't do anything the host is probably free to grab the threads and use them ?
<Xogium> *if
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes
<Xogium> fancy
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> memory can be a bit more tricky to optimise
<Xogium> yeah…
<Xogium> random idea though, wouldn't a container work as good ? Like nspawn or lxc
<Xogium> that way I wouldn't have to carefully share resources between host and vm
<Werner> downside is that building images wont work without additional hacks or wont work at all. rebuilding kernel is perfectly fine though
<[TheBug]> Xogium: I will be happy to help you with any setup if you need help -- atm on a meeting so can't really chat but do feel free to ping if you need help
<[TheBug]> we could also invite him to the server room Igor and talk about that more there?
<[TheBug]> IgorPec ^
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> yes, why not.
<Armbian-Discord> <r​pardini> hello
<Armbian-Discord> <r​pardini> i've some N1 cores unused on the Oracle cloud. Should I just up a github runner?
<Xogium> Werner: why wouldn't rebuilding images work without hacks in a container ?
<Werner> lacking access to loop devices and such
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> containers needs privilege acxcess
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> rpardini: hello, yes ofc
<Xogium> ah, I see
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> i have to pardon due to some family duties. will be back in 1h
<Werner> have fun
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> @rpardini i've got a turnkey ansible job to add to our CI
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> what spec VM did you setup
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> Xogium we could also use memory ballooning on your VM
<Xogium> hmm, what's that again ? I forget
<Xogium> btw I joined the server chan ;)
<[TheBug]> hahaha, no discord over there so you have to actually use irc :S
<Werner> cloud be adjusted :P
<Werner> s/cloud/could
<ArmbianHelper> Werner meant to say: could be adjusted :P
<[TheBug]> Werner: always gott aruin my fun :(
<[TheBug]> lol
<[TheBug]> IRC 4 Life!
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<[TheBug]> Manouchehri: it looks like you probably pulled plug on board without shutdown and Armbian tends to do resync of data from memory to hdd on regular basis
<[TheBug]> if you pulledf power or crash at this time
<[TheBug]> it could cause the file it mentions to have been corrupt
<Manouchehri> [TheBug]: 13:16:56 up 74 days, 15:08, 7 users, load average: 5.98, 6.03, 4.96
<[TheBug]> so when it goes to start and move it back maybe not working
<[TheBug]> hmm
<Werner> bad sdcard?
<Manouchehri> Werner: could be, is there a "safe" way I could do an online check?
<Manouchehri> I'm worried if I reboot I'll lose remote access lol
<[TheBug]> have you tried to remove that journal file so it can remake it?
<[TheBug]> but yeah would suggest some deeper issue maybe
<Manouchehri> bleh
<Werner> reliable online check? not possible
<[TheBug]> er wait
<[TheBug]> is it already trying to do so and fail
<[TheBug]> what does dmesg look like?
<[TheBug]> you have disk errors?
<[TheBug]> also check 'journalctl'
<[TheBug]> and go to bottom of log and go up
<[TheBug]> see if any weird issues
<Manouchehri> [TheBug]: this was from dmesg :p
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> raspberry pi
<[TheBug]> no filesystem errors?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> are you joking?
<[TheBug]> OHH
<Manouchehri> [TheBug]: nothing aside from systemd freaking out
<[TheBug]> :facepalm:
<Manouchehri> that's the only thing in dmesg
<[TheBug]> yeah then no idea you talking whole other system
<[TheBug]> I mean I can guess for pi but its not same
<[TheBug]> um
<Manouchehri> fff
<Manouchehri> sorry, I forgot armbian isn't the same as raspbian
<Manouchehri> that's totally my bad.
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> we can't help since we don't deal with
<[TheBug]> suggested a bug in their systemd
<Manouchehri> IgorPec: yeah sorry, that was totally my bad.
<[TheBug]> but no resolution
<[TheBug]> though means your not only one who seen that issue
<Manouchehri> too many systems
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> why not?
<[TheBug]> though I would go post it on their forum
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> trashinfg rpi ? 🙂
<[TheBug]> maybe even in that thread
<Manouchehri> RIP uptime
<[TheBug]> "It seems that this is related to system time. You can see that restoring time from the RTC failed during boot:"
<[TheBug]> "When the RTC was not able to keep system time, the system resets to some older date (date at build time). However, the journal on disk has a newer timestamp which makes systemd-journald refusing to load the journal, leading to the messages you are seeing:"
<[TheBug]> Google is your friend. /thread
<Manouchehri> I've removed /var/log/journal/9401a50fcd834a7082ef418e91cf5248/system.journal
<Manouchehri> new one gets created
<Manouchehri> same issue
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> tell raspbian paid staff to fix this
<Manouchehri> is that sarcasm, or do they actually have paid staff?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> they do
<Xogium> I know why it happens
<Manouchehri> Xogium: oh?
<Manouchehri> I just rebooted, fingers crossed if the machine comes back online
<Xogium> even if you have an rtc in there, whatever they did for detecting it during boot and loading the time from it with hwclock is racy and it does not wait for the rtc devicve to appear
<Manouchehri> ffs
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> i think i saw this problem soewhere. you need to sync time ias early as possible
<Xogium> they could have built the rtc driver in the kernel instead of as a module also, but yeah
<Manouchehri> and maybe as time goes on, the race happens more often or something?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> in init rd
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> that is rocket scoence for raspbian 😉
<Manouchehri> ugh
<Manouchehri> I don't get how armbian is so much better than raspbian.
<Xogium> yep that's what they are trying to do, but it is loading the module too late, and the udev rule is ran before
<[TheBug]> simply put it isn't keeping time
<Manouchehri> Xogium: does it make sense that this happened only after 72 days though?
<[TheBug]> easiest way around that is use ntpd or regularly run ntpdate
<Xogium> did you shutdown the pi before those 72 days ?
<Xogium> no the rtc keeps the time
<Xogium> it works as intended
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> raspbiuan is for people to play with
<Manouchehri> yes, it had been shut down over 72 days ago
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> its good enough for that
<Xogium> it is just loaded too late during boot, and the udev rule that tries to restore the time from the rtc using hwclock runs too early so /dev/rtc isn't even present yet
<Manouchehri> it hasn't been shut down at all in the last 72 days.
<Xogium> racy, as I said. You might have been very lucky before
<Manouchehri> how often does the race have a chance of happening?
<Manouchehri> once a day or something?
<Manouchehri> if it's an issue during early boot, I thought it would happen only once, during early boot :P
<Manouchehri> lovely, it's not coming back online (wireguard).
<[TheBug]> Xogium: do you mean on boot it is basically making the journal before it actually reads current time from rtc into register so you end up with the timestamp always being wrong on the journal?
<[TheBug]> if so then rming and having it recreate the journal file should be a solution
<[TheBug]> after boot
<Manouchehri> yeah I tried that
<Manouchehri> I removed it
<Xogium> it's not just that, the rtc at boot is entirely useless
<Xogium> you could have no rtc connected to the pi, and it wouldn't make one single shred of difference
<Manouchehri> YESSS
<Manouchehri> finally
<Manouchehri> back online
<Xogium> it is simply not used at boot
<Xogium> basically when you boot, normally with a proper kernel that has a rtc driver built-in, the kernel itself loads the time from the rtc very, very early at boot, before systemd is even started
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> what if its a module?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> usually that is the case since rtc hw is different
<Xogium> but since the default kernel is beyond dumb, it has the rtc driver built as a module, and this cannot be performed. The only way to have this, is to have udev run as early as possible during boot, so that it grabs the time using hwclock
<Xogium> but not too early, or it will not have the kernel module loaded yet
<Manouchehri> this still doesn't make sense to me why it worked for 72 days
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> in inird
<Xogium> well it works fine when the system is up
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> race conditions are usually act of randomness
<Xogium> time is saved to the rtc from ntp sync periodically, etc.
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> power cycle is not reboot
<Manouchehri> Xogium: right, the system was up
<Xogium> however restoring time from rtc at boot is where it falls flat
<Xogium> it may or may not work, as I said, it is very racy
<Manouchehri> so.. it shouldn't have been a problem?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> well, as designed it is a problem
<Xogium> what do you mean ?
<Manouchehri> like
<Manouchehri> we were 72 days past the time it booted
<Xogium> that does not matter
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> the problem is related to boot
<Xogium> as I said when the system runs, the rtc module is loaded, and it is all fine. It even saves the correct time when ntp synced itself
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> once its up it doesn't matter anymore
<Manouchehri> IgorPec: right!
<Manouchehri> the system was up! :P
<Manouchehri> I only rebooted it *after* this problem happened
<Xogium> yes, and once you rebooted, it was brought down, then booted again, and this happened. Your system time was not restored from the rtc
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> you still can have wrong date in journal databnase
<Manouchehri> but... but... I removed the journal file
<Manouchehri> and same issue
<[TheBug]> IgorPec: I think maybe he may be okay cause he removed before reboot, but yeah could end up in same race condition, it makes journal before the clock is updated
<Xogium> yes
<Manouchehri> Xogium: no, no, no, the issues started BEFORE I rebooted.
<Xogium> erm… what ?
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> same race condition is very possible.
<Manouchehri> 1:17:01 PM <Manouchehri> [TheBug]: 13:16:56 up 74 days, 15:08, 7 users, load average: 5.98, 6.03, 4.96
<[TheBug]> yeah that issue probably existed for 74 days
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> exactly
<Manouchehri> [TheBug]: I did not have any errors in my journald log until today.
<[TheBug]> and depending if you won the race this boot, it may exist going forward as well
<Xogium> well, obviously if your system time is wrong, systemd will attempt to use the release date as backup
<Xogium> it even says so when launching
<Manouchehri> Tue Jul 27 13:41:22 EST 2021
<Xogium> system time before build time, advancing clock
<Manouchehri> timeline of events: system was booted roughly on May 16, 2021. No journald errors until today at 13:08:19. I rebooted at 13:27:51.
<Xogium> that is definitely strange
<Manouchehri> I did not reboot once during May 16th to July 26th, and did not have *one* journald error
<Xogium> this kind of thing shouldn't happen while the system is up
<Manouchehri> aha okay thank you :p
<Manouchehri> tbh I'm content now lol
<Manouchehri> ah-ha!
<Manouchehri> I <3 journals.
<Manouchehri> sorry not sorry that I'm a systemd fan
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<Manouchehri> wat, raspbian hasn't had a kernel update since may?!
<steev> okau
<Armbian-Discord> <I​gorPec> manuouchehri: if you got bored https://armbian.atlassian.net/browse/AR-757
<ArmbianHelper> AR-757 [Task] "Adding Rpi" reported by Igor Pecovnik at 2021-05-19. Status: Backlogged
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<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> ಠಿ_ಠ
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> rpi ?
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Well, we need an Armbian hardware benchmark that makes BPi look good
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> (⌐■-■)
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> Tony need help on new add in board
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> when you get a little time
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> no rush as I know yout working on the rk3399
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> What board/SoC?
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> BeagleV
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Oooof
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> That one might be beyond my ken
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> ?
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> We'll need to add tools as well as the normal stuff
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> I have the outfiles
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> it boots debian as it is now
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> but they used sid
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Sure, but for us to support it we need to add RISC-V cross compilers
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> I have the dtb files
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> It uses U-boot?
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> yeah I figure that would be down the line
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Or can
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> yes
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Then there's qemu to consider
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> ok
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> just I know there are like 300 boards out there and soon a new version to come out
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> but no rush
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> I am still waiting to work on the fe-som-rk3399 and get edp working maybe before winter
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> lol
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> just yanking your chain a little
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Yeah I mean, between the proof of concept RISC-V board and the SoM I'm working on the SoM
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> SoM
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> like the one I got you
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> I have the board running and 99% of everything working
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> but I want to work on making the board dts better in the furute as right now its sharing the t4 dts
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Right
<[TheBug]> Tonymac32: is it also beyond your barbie?
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Not in the slightest
<[TheBug]> LOL I know,...
<[TheBug]> was being funny..
<[TheBug]> You know, Ken and Barbie..
<[TheBug]> play on words
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Oh yeah. But others may not have known (•‿•)
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> https://www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/63900.html
<[TheBug]> ;p
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Apparently we invented it, and the relatives took it back home to Scotland
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Also, German: Kennen, to know/be familiar with
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> So that might more clearly explain it
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Scots and Germans in Appalachia destroying each other's languages
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> what yeah talking about there bud
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> lol
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> dont yea know
<Armbian-Discord> <R​ichNeese> i betcha
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<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Yin's talk funny
<[TheBug]> Yall don't even know the half of it
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Spend 20 minutes talking to a man from Kingwood WV and you'll learn a whole new language
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> yeah there's applainchain folks who still speak parts of middle english
<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> there's an island thats part of VA that's like that too
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<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Well mostly they speak "Skoal"
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<Armbian-Discord> <l​anefu> Lol
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