teepee changed the topic of #openscad to: OpenSCAD - The Programmers Solid 3D CAD Modeller | This channel is logged! | https://openscad.org/advent-calendar-2021/ | Website: http://www.openscad.org/ | FAQ: https://goo.gl/pcT7y3 | Request features / report bugs: https://goo.gl/lj0JRI | Tutorial: https://bit.ly/37P6z0B | Books: https://bit.ly/3xlLcQq | FOSDEM 2020: https://bit.ly/35xZGy6 | Logs: https://bit.ly/32MfbH5
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<gbruno> [github] kintel pushed 1 modifications (Use a separate cache for the PR). https://github.com/openscad/openscad/commit/9629ffaf86ef4729c050bcf54681ecba50e76e9d
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<ecraven> InPhase: thanks
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<Nirjhar> Hi i am totally new to programming part of cad though i used 3d max for making 3d product designs for clients, now ....I am more into CAD side of things since i found i like programming and aurduino thing...Please guide me through baby steps if i wan't to make a software like shape3d which language and path should i take...thanks ~India~
<teepee> as in making a new application and language from scratch?
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<Jack22> looks to me like shap3d could be an scad script - Ü
<Jack22> Nirjhar CAD software need a lot of math - so start with openSCAD and see if you get the math right ..
<Nirjhar> what could be optimum way to do it @teeteepee
<Nirjhar> Jack22 : Ok
<teepee> well, I personally disagree on the optimum way, but that's mostly as I like this stuff as open source as possible
<Nirjhar> So the command used in opens cad will work on other programming languages..! Also Matrix and Trigonometry is a way to go..!
<Nirjhar> ?...
<teepee> and in that case this is a bit of the wrong place, as this channel is mainly about OpenSCAD as existing application / language
<Jack22> the functions are math which can be used in other programming languages
<teepee> if you plan on an open source project, I'd say first consider joining an existing effort, but of course it's your time, your choice
<Nirjhar> Can you suggest some existing projects or where should i look for it, sry if i'm asking a lot.!
<teepee> well, one is OpenSCAD obviously, others are jscad (in JavaScript), cadquery (Python), ImplicitCAD (Haskell)
<Jack22> FreeCAD and openSCAD Nirjhar
<Jack22> Nirjhar  make yourself familiar what is there  so you get an idea what you are aiming for as CAD software can be very different depending for what and how it should be used later.  Blender is also something to have a look
<Nirjhar> is blender accurate in dimensions for 3d printing.
<teepee> yeah, Blender is a great tool, and it does have some internal scripting capability via python
<Nirjhar> i am learning it already..!
<Nirjhar> seems fun.! :)
<teepee> it's not a classic CAD tool, but for 3d printing it can work, it does have some 3d printing support plugins
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<Nirjhar> Could 'Unity' also used to make and modify object like a customization game..?
<Jack22> you can use your models in Unity but Unity is for realtime render not modelling
<Nirjhar> Thanks 'Teepee' and 'Jack22' for Helping me out, definitely look forward..! ~namaste-n-greetings~
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<buZz> teepee: -some- ppl do a lot of printdesigns in blender
<buZz> even for mechanical parts
<buZz> i'm always amazed at that :)
<Scopeuk> I guess its what you are familiar with
<Scopeuk> I've played with blender a handful of times but never really clicked with it so I avoid it
<Scopeuk> but I guess if you know it inside out then its easier to create things there than learn another cad packages that sawps all your axis on you
<Scopeuk> I belive blender does computer graphics convention x across y up z in
<teepee> buZz: yeah, I know some #reprap ops doing that ;-)
<buZz> :)
<teepee> I do have the DVD with the 3d printing videos for Blender
<buZz> i do use blender for printing sometimes, its quite a handy tool for just finding holes in objects and closing them
<buZz> if you dont need superaccurate closing
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<ecraven> I think there's no good way to do parametric design in blender :-/
<ecraven> (yet)
<ecraven> how do
<ecraven> I do a rotate_extrude that gets *smaller* along the rotation?
<InPhase> Well not with rotate_extrude.
<ecraven> what I want is a bent pipe that gets smaller along the bend
<ecraven> can this even be done??
<InPhase> ecraven: Sure.
<ecraven> hehe, I don't think I understand that
<InPhase> Well it's a slightly way of thinking about design. The demo_gear_thing is close to a bendy pipe, although you probably want a ClosePoints rather than a CloseLoop that comes all the way back around.
<ecraven> maybe I can do without actually getting smaller...
<ecraven> for now ;)
<InPhase> And probably you want to run it twice, once for the outside and a second time to difference out the inside.
<ecraven> until I understand more
<ecraven> yea, that's what I thought
<ecraven> is there a way to shear an object?
<ecraven> multmatrix, probably
<ecraven> ah, or polyhedron to directly calculate the object, right
<ecraven> ?
<teepee> no, multmatrix only allows affine transformations, shear is not
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<teepee> yes, calculating points directly works as that's "just math" :)
<teepee> this might even be supported by some of the libraries
<InPhase> ecraven: Modified example from the gear thing to a pipe: https://bpa.st/33TA
<teepee> nice example
<ecraven> InPhase: great, thank you very much! I'll try to use this!
<InPhase> ecraven: The "Affine" language can sound confusing if you're not used to the notion, but at the end it's just matrix multiplication behind the scenes doing exactly the same operations you would do with sequences of things like rotate/translate, which themselves do matrix multiplications very similarly inside of the CGAL library.
<InPhase> The point of the library is just to rip some of this calculation step out into user space so you can tweak a few extra things dynamically along the path.
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<ecraven> is there any place on the web where I can paste openscad code (no external dependencies) and where other people can look at the results?
<teepee> you can put the file to github and just let it read that for showing it
<teepee> or create an account there
<ecraven> thanks for all the help over the last few days, I've finished a first draft of my thing ;) shorturl.at/vwFU4
<teepee> othx: cadhub is https://cadhub.xyz/draft/openscad (needs login) or just have it fetch an externally stored script via https://cadhub.xyz/draft/openscad#fetch_text_v1=<URL>
<othx> teepee: Okay.
<ecraven> anything glaringly obviously wrong with it?
<ecraven> it doesn't render very well in preview, sometimes things get mirrored along the cutting plane (I use the cutXY module to see "inside" the part, is there a better way to do this?)
<teepee> the mirror is due to the big cutting cubes, when the camera ends up inside the cube
<teepee> and it looks good to me
<InPhase> ecraven: Looks like you missed the overlap rule for differences.
<ecraven> teepee: any way to avoid it? can I somehow find out the extents of my model and make the cube only slightly larger?
<ecraven> InPhase: I did, because I use all sorts of heights for calculations, making everything slightly larger messes that up :-/
<ecraven> it works nice in rendering, just not in preview
<InPhase> ecraven: You should never count on that working in rendering remaining stable without overlap. You can get non-manifold outputs without realizing it.
<ecraven> ah, ok, so I'll fix that
<InPhase> ecraven: It's better to add on a little extra to the negative pieces.
<teepee> no easy solution at this point, there's a geometric one but that might increase the runtime quite a bit
<InPhase> ecraven: Notice I did that subtly in my pipe example with the internal t going a little further on each end.
<ecraven> how much overlap do I need? this is ~35 units high, will 0.1 overlap suffice?
<InPhase> ecraven: Yep.
<ecraven> hehe, thanks, but that sounds very slow.. I'll just add up all my height, that's the largest, and use that for x and y and z
<teepee> yeah, for overlap even 0.01 is enough in most cases
<InPhase> ecraven: When they're pieces being differenced out and there's nothing else in the way, you can often just add 1 to each end for simplicity (or sometimes adding 2 to the height and moving down by 1). But if there's stuff in the way you can make the overlap 0.01 and it's usually fine.
<teepee> but there's no gain in having it close, so for example for punching holes, I usualls just use something like difference() { <something with height h>; cylinder(h = 3 * h, center = true); }
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<ecraven> thanks again for all the help!
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<ecraven> looking forward to using openscad a lot more ;)
<ecraven> this worked much better than I had feared it might :-/
<ecraven> some day I'll look into getting things rounded a bit better ;)
<teepee> that's still one of the more difficult topics, but it can be hugely simplified by some of the libraries
<ecraven> yea, but in the end it might help if I actually understood how things work, because all the libraries I've looked at so far handled some, but not all the cases I wanted ;) [though I only took about 15 minutes, so maybe I just misunderstood things]
<ecraven> InPhase: for example, I didn't understand how to set the *end* radius of the diminishing pipe in the example. it's related to the 4 in the `baser - 4*t' expression, but I didn't understand how to get it to run to an exact diameter
<ecraven> (which is entirely my fault, for not taking the time to understand that!)
<InPhase> ecraven: t runs from 0 to 1 in the for loop I used.
<InPhase> ecraven: You can do it by any values you like, but I usually do 0 to 1 every time, because then I can easily transform 0 through 1 to what I need, especially if I need to change multiple parameters at once.
<InPhase> ecraven: For example, the 90*t in my example.
<InPhase> For example, you could have done: (1-t)*10 + t*6, for a value that goes from 10 to 6. It's equivalent to 10 - 4*t
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<gbruno> [github] t-paul pushed 2 modifications (Add action to open folder of the current tab.). https://github.com/openscad/openscad/commit/7d988c0652481cccd238dd20ff610061db3e3f89
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<lf94> InPhase: I meant have you seen anyone else do any noteable openscad stuff X)
<InPhase> lf94: teepee made a pretty LED light thing. I consulted on the swirly spokes.
<buZz> i bet most openscad stuff doesnt even leave the designs computer
<buZz> so you wouldnt see it, no
<lf94> I saw that, neat
<buZz> i too dont share all my designs
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<lf94> that's sad
<buZz> do you?
<lf94> me cry
<lf94> I do
<lf94> well most
<buZz> see
<buZz> so you dont either
<lf94> _most_, the other is crap
<buZz> extrapolate this to whole population of earth
<lf94> m(
<buZz> its a amazing you're seeing -anything- at all :)
<lf94> i dont think so
<lf94> there is a shit ton of art
<lf94> that we see
<buZz> you dont think its amazing that you are seeing those?
<lf94> nope
<buZz> ok? so why would they share anything with you
<buZz> if you already call it art, and then say you dont like it
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<lf94> what
<InPhase> lf94: I think I will post those boring folding chair feet I made on thingiverse later. My mother tried them on the chair and they worked perfectly, and a quick search showed that almost all folding chairs sold use the same kind of feet, with new chairs needed once the feet break selling in sets of 4 for $120 to $160. Therefore this is probably one of those boring designs that could get tens of
<InPhase> thousands of downloads.
<lf94> Ah, nice.
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<Guest98> hola
<InPhase> Hi.
<Guest98> is nop
<Guest98> do you speak Spanish
<InPhase> Well, not very well. :)
<Guest98> xd i will use google
<Guest98> some project for a newbie
<InPhase> Guest98: Have you see the tutorial? https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/OpenSCAD_Tutorial
<InPhase> Guest98: It walks through an example project.
<InPhase> Guest98: It is in English, but you could run it through google translate. If you know how to use wikipedia, maybe you could even fix up the phrasing a bit and get a Spanish version of it started on wikibooks, if you feel up for a challenge.
<Guest98> Thanks, I see it very well, I will try to try to learn
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<lf94> IMO we should let users speak their native language and use translators ourselves
* lf94 puts away language police hat
<Jack22> lf94 ich glaube das ended wie im Turm zu babel und hat keinen wirklichen Erfolg - zu dem spricht man die Sprache des Ortes den man besucht
<lf94> It works well if I just use google translate to understand you
<Jack22> Nein nein du musst natürlich in meiner Sprache antworten das macht ja sonst überhaupt keinen Sinn
<lf94> No, you must use google translate too
<Jack22> Das ist ja wohl die dümmste Idee - damit jeder Mühe hat und nicht nur einer .. zudem gibt es ja eine bringschuld
<Jack22> Im übrigen verstehe ich dich ja so auch da ist das für mich irrelevant und nicht irre relevant
<lf94> Yeah I guess there is the burden of having to translate everything if you are not following the conversation
<lf94> I'm convinced: bad idea :)
<Jack22> that was easy - nice
<teepee> stimmt, sehr überzeugend :)
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<lf94> If everyone translates to the target language it's easier to communicate
<lf94> Otherwise each new language added means N people must translate M languages
<lf94> vs 1 person translating 1 language
<lf94> You could've math'd me on this one!
<Jack22> if that is automated .. well  but else the possibility of problems will get bigger as you will always have a mix of languages (and you need to find out the target language)
<Jack22> i remember in early days of google talk (or something like that) you had some autotranslate feature within the comunications
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<Jack22> if you open the channel log in google translate that might work too
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<Guest98> entonces que hablamos todos el idioma que queramos?
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