#commonlisp on 2025-03-17 — irc logs at libera.irclog.whitequark.org

2022-07-28 16:55 jackdaniel changed the topic of #commonlisp to: Common Lisp, the #1=(programmable . #1#) programming language | Wiki: <https://www.cliki.net> | IRC Logs: <https://irclog.tymoon.eu/libera/%23commonlisp> | Cookbook: <https://lispcookbook.github.io/cl-cookbook> | Pastebin: <https://plaster.tymoon.eu/>

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06:22 <Josh_2> Hi hi

06:22 <Josh_2> is the swank:*use-dedicated-output-stream* deprecated?

06:22 <Josh_2> its still mentioned in the docs but the symbol doesn't exist

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10:50 <skeemer> hello everyone, could somebody help me understand where the execution starts in this common lisp OS https://github.com/froggey/Mezzano/

10:50 <ixelp> GitHub - froggey/Mezzano: An operating system written in Common Lisp

10:51 <skeemer> i don't understand where is the assembly code to then bootstrap the thing and be able to run common lisp

10:52 <skeemer> i mean in general when writing OS, i know that you have some sort of bootstrapping code, that sets up the stack and other things before the execution is passed to a higher level language like C, C++, Rust etc...

10:52 <skeemer> where is that part here?

10:53 <Inline> https://github.com/froggey/MBuild

10:53 <ixelp> GitHub - froggey/MBuild: Build system for Mezzano

10:54 <beach> Inline: I don't think the build system is what is asked for.

10:55 <Inline> make cold-image is the bootstrapping process

10:55 <Inline> download MBuild and look in the scripts

10:56 <beach> I think what is referred to here is the code that starts the already-built OS.

10:57 <skeemer> Inline: ok i don't see any assembly scripts in that repo either

10:57 <froggey> this is the entry point: https://github.com/froggey/Mezzano/blob/master/supervisor/entry.lisp#L130

10:57 <ixelp> Mezzano/supervisor/entry.lisp at master · froggey/Mezzano

10:59 <skeemer> froggey: ok but so there is no actual assembly code?

10:59 <skeemer> i mean i don't understand, i was expecting some assembly code to setup the environment before passing the execution to common lisp

10:59 <skeemer> but i am not able to find any asm code

11:00 <Inline> lol

11:00 <froggey> https://github.com/froggey/kboot/blob/mezzano-loader/source/arch/arm64/loader/mezzano_enter.S

11:00 <ixelp> kboot/source/arch/arm64/loader/mezzano_enter.S at mezzano-loader · froggey/kboot

11:00 <froggey> the bootloader sets that up

11:01 <skeemer> ohhh now i get it... thanks a lot... wow what an achievement to write an OS in common lisp

11:02 <skeemer> it would be really cool if there were resources to approach the same task writing something simpler just as an educational experience

11:02 <skeemer> i would like to do the same for RISC-V

11:02 <skeemer> do you have anything to suggest/

11:02 <skeemer> ?

11:05 <froggey> not really, I don't think I had any significant resources when writing it. Movitz was the big thing when I started: https://github.com/dym/movitz

11:05 <ixelp> GitHub - dym/movitz: Movitz: a Common Lisp x86 development platform

11:05 <froggey> aside from that, just sit down and spend the next decade working on it

11:06 <beach> Heh!

11:06 <froggey> :)

11:09 <beach> I guess skeemer would have to write a RISC-V backend for the compiler, and also rewrite the bootloader. But most of the Common Lisp code could be reused perhaps.

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11:15 <Inline> well, yes one could make a tutorial for a mini emulator to run on some fantasy HW

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12:37 <younder> You could 'dream'about this https://deepcomputing.io/product/dc-roma-risc-v-laptop-ii/

12:37 <ixelp> DC-ROMA RISC-V LAPTOP II - DeepComputing

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18:24 <skeemer> hello all, i was wondering if there was a kind of minimalistic common lisp implementation, easy to compile on most OS (not many deps) and so on...

18:26 <reb> skeemer: There's the clisp implementation.

18:27 <reb> ... and ECL ... both written in C.

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18:34 <semz> CCL might also be an option, it's usually pretty easy to compile

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18:35 <semz> come to think of it, CL implementations generally have rather few dependencies, don't they

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18:44 <reb> semz: Yes, both CCL and SBCL have very few dependencies ... libc, libpthread for threads, libm for math, libdl to load libraries. That's about it.

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18:45 <reb> ECL uses those plus libgmp for bignums and libffi for calling out to C libaries.

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19:07 <jackdaniel> and libgc

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19:12 <semz> jackdaniel: There's no way to ask this out of the blue without sounding extremely pushy, but: ECL was going to get a new compiler, right? How's that coming along?

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19:12 * semz was reminded of this while doing tests on ECL some time ago

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19:25 <skeemer> reb: semz do they all have the same level of interaction that i get with sbcl/emacs/slime?

19:25 <reb> skeemer: pretty much ...

19:25 <semz> When used over emacs/slime, yes.

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19:26 <semz> The raw REPL will be spartan, but so is SBCL's

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19:48 <skeemer> semz: yes it is

19:52 <kvik> i've learned a bit of lisp and now my programming career is dead (again). who do i contact for a refund?

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20:02 <jackdaniel> semz: slowly, but it moves forward; in any case nothing to brag about yet

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