<dh`>
I don't think naming things with extension sets is viable
<dh`>
even with just single-letter extensions it's a mess
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<dh`>
also, if the isa version periodically changes and this leads to incompatibility warnings on libc, that itself is a problem
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<jrtc27>
this is _supposed_ to be a one-off thing
<jrtc27>
we shall see
<jrtc27>
but I'm not happy even this one happened
<jrtc27>
not sure what the right answer was though, that's what happens when you decide to spilt some instructions out of your base ISA years after everyone's got toolchains for it
<jrtc27>
even if it was technically not yet ratified when they did that
<jrtc27>
but then we should have gone through this transition years ago when the ecosystem was much smaller, then we would've been done by now and not have so much legacy to care about
<jrtc27>
back when it was qemu, hifive unleashed or kendryte k210
<jrtc27>
and that wasn't that long after the sptbr -> satp etc changes
<jrtc27>
possibly even the same spec revision, I forget the exact history
<qwestion>
Are yall part of the closed mailing lists? Is it futile to try to understand whats being decided based on public MP's/info?
<qwestion>
Ml's
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<jrtc27>
discussions are on public mailing lists
<qwestion>
Didnt lkcl mention he couldnt get nlnet grant money because they had to sign ndas?
<qwestion>
For joining certain rv mls
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<jrtc27>
lkcl says lots of things
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<jrtc27>
the articles of association and membership agreement do not include an NDA
<jrtc27>
in fact the articles of association expressly state that nothing is confidential unless expressly agreed by the board of directors
<jrtc27>
you can go read them for yourself if you're really that interested
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<qwestion>
jrtc27: so can you know what you cant know? Is there a list of example valid reasons for keeping things confidential ?
<jrtc27>
I have no clue, it has never come up in discussions I've been and I don't see why it would
<jrtc27>
it's completely counter to how riscv works
<jimwilson>
submarine patents
<jimwilson>
like what happened to DDR and Rambus
<jimwilson>
so only people who have signed patent agreements can participate
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<qwestion>
Thx all ill read these and check mls
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<dh`>
maybe someone has some submarine patents that mailing lists infringe? :-) otherwise that seems unlikely
<join_subline>
actual patents for submarines? oh no, my civilian submarine travel project is going to run aground on some rocks, if the self-driving / self-sailing submarines cant run seL4 on riscv because of ITAR (international traffic in arms regulations). gotta figure out how to advocate to demilitarize/declassify development.
<dh`>
lol
<dh`>
(actually there probably really are some significant patents on UUVs)
<join_subline>
well, i'm at the intersection of geopolitics and underwater foss technology. i'll stay in my lane, and tackle the geopols of it.
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<jimwilson>
the problem is someone posts an idea on a mailing list, the idea gets added to the standard, and then later they claim patent infringement and demand royalties from everyone
<jimwilson>
so only people with patent agreements can subcribe to closes lists and contribute ideas that can get into the RISC-V standard
<jimwilson>
this has already happened in the real world, see RAMBUS patents and the JEDEC/DDR standards
<jimwilson>
this is why RISC-V International has closed groups and closed mailing lists, that are only open to members
<jimwilson>
you must sign a patent agreement before you can become a member of RISC-V International
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<sumoon>
hello
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<join_subline>
03:26 "Hi I just got LicheeRV Dock with D1 chipset,..." -> neat. i'm a noob too. so i also dont know how to debug your problem. ¯\_༼ᴼﻝᴼ༽_/¯ d-🐞
<qwestion>
> the problem is someone posts an idea on a mailing list, the idea gets added to the standard, and then later they claim patent infringement and demand royalties from everyone
<qwestion>
I cant believe judicial systems are this stupid/corrupt
<qwestion>
U can easily assume a mailing list's tos function as clickwrap
<qwestion>
> this is why RISC-V International has closed groups and closed mailing lists, that are only open to members
<qwestion>
Y openpower doesn't have this problem then? Or just about any other Foss ml?
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<sorear>
last I checked "open"power wasn't taking submissions from the public at all, so they don't have a problem on that front
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