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<geist>
boo, i just noticed a pair of adjacent dead pixels in my monitor
<geist>
physical monitor though, not ocular migrane (though i do get those from time to time)
<kof123>
"so did someone create AsbestOS yet?" see the SICP cover. that was a name for the magical salamander lambda
<kof123>
so whatever it is, it will be reflective surely
<ChavGPT>
geist: my previous monitor broke by having a vertical red line
<ChavGPT>
i googled wtf is it
<ChavGPT>
found a guy with the same model with the line in the same spot
<ChavGPT>
:X
<geist>
yeah the only other kinda dead pixel i've ever had was something like that, one of the colors having problems in a vertical line
<geist>
this one isn't too bad, it's just annoying. about 2/3 of the way from the left, slightly above center
<ChavGPT>
oof
<geist>
at least it's just a hard stuck to black, so i dont tend to notice it considering how much i use dark mode stuff
<ChavGPT>
maybe it will relocate if you stare with enough anger
<zid>
I've never owned a dead pixel before
<zid>
do you have to pay extra for them
<zid>
My entire fuckin monitor is dying, but the pixels are great
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<gorgonical>
the only positive trait I have as a programmer is stubbornness
<gorgonical>
otherwise i definitely am too dumb to get this phd
<gorgonical>
just now think i've figured out that arm tf-a fucking turns the console off willingly
<zid>
ah so you finally found your faulty assumption
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<zid>
(That being the final step in 'wtf this makes no sense')
<zid>
You accidentally rely on some assumption, "I'd see an error" "This file totally exists though!" etc and 30 layers later "this shit is broken as fuck"
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<ZipCPU>
gorgonical: I've got to believe anyone building their own OS must have both a 1) software ability, and a 2) stubbornness trait--otherwise they'd just use the operating systems built by others.
<zid>
imagine using anything you wrote
<zid>
Sounds like a terrible idea
<zid>
I'd know where all the skeletons live in it and how unusable it is
<ZipCPU>
I suppose that depends upon how well it is built, and how well it is verified
<zid>
That isn't how software works
<zid>
It's very much a "pick 2" situation
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<gorgonical>
zid: i often think of os work as like that scene from malcolm in the middle when hal replaces the light bulb
<bslsk05>
'Malcolm in The Middle "What does it look like I'm doing?"' by MITM Clips (00:00:40)
<zid>
yea very
<gorgonical>
So I think I've just fixed the car now
<zid>
OS dev is trying to maintain a very large mansion by yourself, you pick if the parlor is dusted, or the bedroom, if the lawn is mown, or the driveway de-weeded etc
<zid>
but not all of them all of the time at the same time
<zid>
Like, it's just a fact of all software though, it can be easy to read, or fast, but often not both, etc
<gorgonical>
also I literally just today found dill pickle chips and all dressed chips here at my local aldi
<gorgonical>
i have never seen all dressed chips anywhere in america and today they are at my regular grocery store
<Hammdist>
how rapidly does a typical pll lock? on rk3328, I'm trying to configure a ppl. I set the pll parameters and then read the lock state immediately after in code and it always appears locked right away. is that right?
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<Hammdist>
the ppl appears to lock fine, but there is a crash when trying to switch to the pll as clock source
<Hammdist>
I'm using the exact same pll parameters as linux uses, this has been checked thoroughly down to the bits and bytes
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<Hammdist>
ah wait I just encountered a run in which it didn't lock right away
<Hammdist>
so that part seems to be explained
<gorgonical>
My disappointment is immeasurable and I am out of ideas again
<gorgonical>
Linux appears to be running in non-secure mode. But this doesn't explain the fucking gic accesses
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<geist>
giiiiiic
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<kazinsal>
gic gic gic
<kazinsal>
is the G in gic soft or hard
<kazinsal>
not to start the gif/jif argument but
<kazinsal>
is it gick or jick
<Mutabah>
gick to me
<klys>
glob integrated circuit
<childlikempress>
well usually it's soft but if you're really good you can make it hard
<kazinsal>
I'm on team gick
<kazinsal>
(I say, not actually being an arm guy)
<klys>
I bought an intel macbook 2020 the other day, intending to give it away after installing ubuntu on it. then yesterday I installed ubuntu on it.
<klys>
in other news, capable four port thunderbolt pci-e cards exist now
<klys>
I had looked a few months back and they did not exist then.
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<kazinsal>
I love my M! air, it's a great laptop
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<bslsk05>
wiki.osdev.org: Exceptions - OSDev Wiki
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<x8dcc>
I ask because in the ISR page of the osdev.org wiki it says: "If the interrupt is an exception, the CPU will push an error code onto the stack, as a doubleword."
<gog>
that wording is misleading
<x8dcc>
oh, so it depends on the exception? on the "Error code?" column of the table
<gog>
yes
<x8dcc>
I see, that's a bit inconvenient
<gog>
it is
<gog>
you'll need to define an ISR entry point for each exception
<x8dcc>
Yeah, I do that with an assembly macro, but I will just make 2, one for no error code and one for exceptions with error code
<gog>
and if the ISR is an exception without an error code what i do is i push a dummy error code to the stack
<gog>
yeh that's the way to do it
<x8dcc>
okay, and another question
<gog>
ok
<x8dcc>
so from the ISR page, if I understood correctly, in an exception with no error code, the CPU pushes the EFLAGS, then CS and then EIP?
<x8dcc>
i.e. when the ISR is called the value immediately in the stack is the EIP?
<gog>
yes
<gog>
because iretd will return to cs:eip
<gog>
so for ISRs with an error code you have to pop that from the stack
<gog>
which is why everybody does the normalizing dummy code thing
<gog>
so that no matter what you just do the pop and it's fine
<x8dcc>
I see, I was looking at what IRETD does just now
<x8dcc>
well this is very useful, I was just using interrupt gates for everything
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<x8dcc>
I added it, now I can see where I kernel panic :)
<x8dcc>
thank you, gog
<gog>
noicsj
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<netbsduser>
what do people think about the caching of disk fs metadata? i have a file page cache (used to good effect with 9p and FUSE) but to use it for disk filesystems will require it learn new tricks
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<nortti>
do you have a dirent cache?
<netbsduser>
not yet; i have it implemented in principle but not in use yet
<netbsduser>
i wonder whether it´s worthwhile to access e.g. the block bitmap, the disk inodes, etc via the file page cache of the disk. or (it will have to be because of potential overlapping pages or misaligned blocks) through synthetic files representing the block bitmap, disk inode array, etc
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<zid>
I've been bitten again, where's the flamethrower
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<gog>
hi
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<sham1>
hi
<zid>
(I also have an awful sinus headache)
<gog>
hi
<gog>
i'm at work
<zid>
I don't think I will ever stop being sick :(
<gog>
apple pay is not cooperating
<gog>
zid: my sinuses have only been intermittently not clear for months
<gog>
s/not//
<zid>
I've got tight sinuses, but the fix is gruesome
<zid>
They just run a metal pipecleaner through them
<zid>
shave down your skull
<GeDaMo>
My sinuses have also been playing up recently :|
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<zid>
GeDaMo: I've got a wire brush if you're game
<bslsk05>
www.theguardian.com: ‘A first in Paris’: city fumigates for tiger mosquitoes as tropical pests spread, bringing disease | Paris | The Guardian
<gog>
hi
<zid>
I wish
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<heat>
so im fucking dying
<heat>
after all my month-long stomach problems i went and got myself gastroenteritis
<heat>
fucking shoot me
<zid>
same
<heat>
seriously, put me down, life is pain
<zid>
even better
<zid>
after I finished with the gastro, I now have sinusitis
<childlikempress>
rip
<heat>
long-term exposure to #osdev has us dying
<heat>
asbestos of IRC
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<heat>
netbsduser: btw re caching metadata, that's pretty common
<heat>
as in "pretty standard"
<heat>
that's what the buffer cache does
<x8dcc>
The cvttsd2si assembly instruction is supposed to store the integer part of a src float in the dst operand? e.g. int n = (int)fl;
<netbsduser>
heat: of course
<x8dcc>
I am getting a SIMD floating point exception when printing a float, and the instruction of the exception is a cvttsd2si
<netbsduser>
my concern is with whether or not to preserve a traditional buffer cache at all or whether to impose file-based caching everywhere
<heat>
if you consider the block device a very big file, it's already file-based
<childlikempress>
x8dcc: is it the inexact exception
<heat>
x8dcc: do you have SSE on?
<x8dcc>
childlikempress: I don't understand your question
<x8dcc>
heat: I do
<childlikempress>
well, which floating point exception is it
<netbsduser>
it would have to go through a special virtual file implemented by the FS driver, i think - because otherwise if a page-sized page-aligned set of blocks is mixture of metadata and data, youŕe in very deep trouble
<x8dcc>
this only happens with multitasking, and although I am running fxsave and fxrstor, I guess I am doing something wrong
<heat>
netbsduser: you'r not
<heat>
fwiw: linux does not handle consistency at that level
<netbsduser>
heat: consider this case: block size 512, blocks 1, 2, 3, 4 are metadata, 5, 6, 7 8 are data of a file
<x8dcc>
childlikempress: are you asking for the error code in MXCSR or...?
<netbsduser>
now in both cases each of the collections of 4 blocks are cached in different files (the metadata accessed through the disk device´s file page cache, the file data through the file´s cache)
<heat>
right, so you do per-block subpage tracking
<heat>
and now you're not writing back any of that, you didn't even need to read it
<netbsduser>
that´s exactly what you must do at some level - but that´s why i proposed to use a special file for the disk-level caching
<netbsduser>
caches of regular files are already fine since they read in and write back their blocks as required
<netbsduser>
but caches directly of disks are quite another matter altogether
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<gorgonical>
Man I am so confused
<gorgonical>
I have confirmed: Kitten does run in secure mode, Linux doesn't, u-boot runs in EL2 (expected), non-secure Linux can *read* what looks like the secure version of GICD_CTLR, can't write some bits marked res0, but can write others
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<gorgonical>
pastie.org/p/4arvQMrvTk9TA3h9JwDMqh
<bslsk05>
pastie.org: Pastie
<gorgonical>
All of the pain and suffering is just in this one function
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<zid>
have you considered
<zid>
becoming a trappist monk
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<zid>
It will fix more of your problems than anything else, I feel
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<gorgonical>
I am beginning to think this is the way forward
<gorgonical>
Honestly what's most aggravating is that this is just a knowledge thing. If I knew who to ask I could solve this problem in like five minutes
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<gorgonical>
Someone on this earth knows why this is happening and could tell me directly and simply if only I knew who they were
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<x8dcc>
I think that everytime I struggle with an error
<klys>
perhaps, there are only a few of us here though. have you tried discord?
<x8dcc>
e.g. right now
<gorgonical>
klys: if you know of a discord I should go ask in I would
<klys>
that would be the osdev discord of course
<gorgonical>
ah
<gorgonical>
Is it really more active than the irc?
<klys>
there are more projects listed there than I hear about here
<gorgonical>
hmm
<gorgonical>
I will give that a try then
<x8dcc>
I left because I asked something and they started trying to argue about what was better
<x8dcc>
I didn't argue and they told me I had no idea or something
<ChavGPT>
maybe they said you have no idea because you did not argue
<x8dcc>
I asked about something I didn't understand, and then 2 people started arguing over if it was accurate or not in the wiki
<ChavGPT>
i don't see anything wrong with it
<x8dcc>
I obviously didn't give my opinion because I didn't understand anything
<x8dcc>
after that they started blaming me for not understanding it, for some reason
<ChavGPT>
mate, if someone linked a page, i had a look and it was wrong in my assesment
<ChavGPT>
i would totally argue
<x8dcc>
I get that, and I don't care about that
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<x8dcc>
it's just that the 2 times I asked something there, they just told me how stupid I am instead of answering anything
<ChavGPT>
is that an osdev tiktok
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<x8dcc>
It's just my experience, but they were way more toxic to me than here (except the admins which are the ones who ended up answering something related)
<x8dcc>
ChavGPT: ...what?
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<heat>
microkernel vs monolithic
<heat>
??
<heat>
vim vs emacs guys
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<childlikempress>
I heard linux torvald said microkernels are good
<ChavGPT>
which why is FREAKS is an exokernel
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<bslsk05>
github.com: lk/arch/vax/asm.S at vax · littlekernel/lk · GitHub
<netbsduser>
but m68k - even the 68030 with its funny mmu - is nothing compared to the joy of having linear page tables with 512-byte page size where the user page tables are pageable pages mapped in the kernel space
<kazinsal>
geist: dang, that's clever
<geist>
yeah took me a bit of grokking. the svpctx and ldpctx have a complicated interaction with simultaneously saving context and switching the active stack and whatnot
<heat>
the joy""
<heat>
""joy""
<geist>
netbsduser: yeah that was the next thing i was starting to write, the paging code
<geist>
i think i wanted to fiish that up before rolling it back into mainline
<geist>
okay, really afk for a bit. might piddle with this this evening!
<netbsduser>
geist: i should be excited to see it, i think it was littlekernel where i learnt of the existnece of qemu virt m68k which i have had a lot of fun with