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<lanefu> What's the SBC everyone has bought recently
<nekomancer[m]> raspberry pi 4
<c0rnelius> the one that just sits on pre-order forever
<c0rnelius> gives you a feeling inside like: `should have just taken that cash and placed it right in the garbage`
<c0rnelius> I did get a zero 2w a little while ago. $15, why not? But honestly the lack of 5ghz wifi on it makes it kind of stupid.
<lanefu> yeah i think the most exciting deals right now are some of the radxa zero models
<lanefu> the 2G ram ones have 5ghz i think
<lanefu> wifi6
<c0rnelius> Yeah thats what I'm waiting for. But the 4GB 16MMC.
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<Armbian-Discord> <Z​aza> For me,, the stupid thing on the zero 2w was mini hdmi...I mean really?? Whats the problem to stick with the micro hdmi like the new pi4 😑
<[TheBug]> probably supply, they have used same connector on older boards and probably had it stocked
<lanefu> choosers cant be beggers
<lanefu> btu doesnt support panfrost so its software rendering
<lanefu> LIBGL_ALWAYS_SOFTWARE=1 alacritty
<lanefu> oh this is awesome
<lanefu> yeah it eats my cpu
<lanefu> lol
<sunshavi> the icon is nice on alacritty. But I avoid when possible
<lanefu> will try on wayland _one day_
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> got a phytium and is going to preorder Rock 5, expecting delivery some time in 2023 😉 (saracasm)
<c0rnelius> I never understood the mini hdmi over the micro hdmi either. Considering the LG Revolution `smart phone` came out in 2011 and had a micro hdmi, to me it seemed like a stupid choice by the foundation from the get go, to use a mini.
<c0rnelius> Like Bug said, it must have just been something in stock and cheap to get.
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> Blackberry Z10 had Micro hdmi
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> but yeah, it was a cheap part so they ran with it I'm sure
<lanefu> phytium can run alacritty :P
<lanefu> yeah rock 5 is all about planning for the future
<lanefu> Phytium is an unappreciated hyper-niche of ARM computing
<lanefu> it's like buying an m1 mac mini to run linux, but... without the nonsense
<lanefu> and technically a _better_ pricepoint
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> someone talks me into these things
* lanefu is a world-class enabler
<Armbian-Discord> <N​eonFetch> With gpu/vpu acceleration too. So, in fact it's more practical
<Armbian-Discord> <N​eonFetch> And more ram
<Armbian-Discord> <N​eonFetch> Ahh I forgot you are an apple fanboy
<Armbian-Discord> <N​eonFetch> Sorry 😂 😋
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<c0rnelius> I know this is off the cuff, but has anyone actually contemplated suicide here. I don't just mean the act of say, hanging ur self. But the actual fact that everything we do really is kind of suicidal to a certain degree. Our whole lives are subject to outside forces that could or could not kill us, but yet we still knowingly participate.
<c0rnelius> Like from a religious stand point its bad... But also wouldn't that also mean its all kind of bad? Like what if you got cancer because of some job you had and you knew it was bad and did it anyway because you needed the job. Isn't that still suicide?
<c0rnelius> Does anyone else ever think about this?
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> seems like a really deep and potentially upsetting topic for some
<c0rnelius> Well of course. But lets say we are talking about it from a person looking in. I myself have friends you have done this and others who have died because of things they did to them selves over years. I guess I'm trying to see the difference between the two and I'm having hard time in my self to find a difference. One was faster... That was it.
<c0rnelius> So from a religious stand point how could one be truly judged in my mind. I'm not a religious person, but am just taking that under consideration as some people are.
<c0rnelius> I find this to be one of many oddities with in our world view, that really when contemplated make no sense.
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> well right, we do have DNR's for example
<c0rnelius> Its like the conception of time. Is time really there or is this how we just view our world? Is there no time?
<Armbian-Discord> <Z​aza> Hey man, are you ok?
<Armbian-Discord> <Z​aza> Thats some deep subject here
<c0rnelius> We base time on the revolution of our planet around the sun. Thats kinda it, inside a nut shell. So if you were born say on a ship orbiting Jupiter when would ur actually birthday be?
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> so dates/units are arbitrary, like everything else (0 C is based on water freezing at a theoretical sea level pressure with pure water for example)
<c0rnelius> Z​aza: I'm fine.
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> there is in theory a lower limit to time that you could use as a universal basis
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> assuming we can't do something better
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<c0rnelius> I see where they are getting at. But time is distorted by space correct?
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> gravity
<c0rnelius> Or is it really?
<c0rnelius> This is just all theory
<Armbian-Discord> <T​onymac32> You're literally at the limit of our physics if you dig into this discussion, so it becomes arbitrary and baseless philosophy
<c0rnelius> Besides the stupid watch test
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<c0rnelius> No one else thinks about this stuff?
<c0rnelius> 11 gods and 12 gates. 12 tribes of Israel, 12 Apostles of Jesus... +1 equals 13. The question becomes why? All based on sun Worship? The Zodiac is no different. None of you people question this?
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<steev> c0rnelius: that's why the best thing, is not to be born. but who is as lucky as that? not to one among millions and millions of people
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<f476> o/ have rock pi s, and last image armbian buster with kernel 5.13. how i try connect serial to rockpis over usbc without uart?
<f476> on armbian page for rockpis write "Login console is enabled also on USB-c connector"
<f476> on official site rockpis with debian image this work over adb bridge with 4.4 kernel, but adb bridge for me not best solution
<f476> sorry for question, found solution on forum
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<Armbian-Discord> <Z​aza> For armbian, you connect on uart2, which is another pinout
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<lanefu> okay.. desktoping with khadas edgev now
<lanefu> hopefully my mind will be hole again soon
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<f476> no directory sunxi_usb_role
<lanefu> rock pi s isn't sunxi chip
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<lanefu> so why is HDMI the goto on SBCs? when display port doesn't have a licensing fee like HDMI does
<f476> @lanefu: this all dirrectory in /sys/bus/platform/devices/
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<Guest97> Hello, how about I want to know if you can do me a favor about what program there is for web design in Armbian
<lanefu> Guest97: same as whatever is avaiable for the coorespondign debian or ubuntu flavor you're using of armbian
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<Guest97> i have armbian buster. See what application do you recommend me please
<lanefu> gogole debian buster web design app
<lanefu> has nothign to do with armbian
<lanefu> sorry
<Guest97> igual gracias
<c0rnelius> Guest97: you are better off learning how to write it:
<c0rnelius> Which is what I do. If you want it done for you, there is always wordpress or drupal.
* stipa PinePhone Malware Surprises Users, Raises Questions
<lanefu> So I don't understand how the C.St. values work on armbian-config
<lanefu> i mean armbianmonitor
<lanefu> like their relationship on how they activate, vs what i see for temp adn cpu speed doesnt alwayas align
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<c0rnelius> steev: Did you ever try that script from chewitt to see if it fixed the hdmi audio issue on the radxa zero?
<steev> c0rnelius: which script?
<steev> yes, but no
<c0rnelius> hmm
<c0rnelius> oh well
<steev> that awk there, doesn't work on my system, i had to remove the $2==OUT
<steev> even then, still no luck
<c0rnelius> I'll play with it when mine arrives.
<steev> thanks for reminding me i wanted to mention it to him
<steev> ah, except he isn't online at the moment, it seems
<c0rnelius> holidays
<c0rnelius> I would imagine it needs to be adjusted. LibreELEC vs Everything else.
<steev> possibly, except i'm using their patches
<stipa> what could be the reason that application that doesn't exist on my system fills up logs ?
<stipa> service*
<c0rnelius> is there a service that is running that thinks the application is suppose to be there?
<stipa> ├── [ 73M] atop
<stipa> i've deleted atop, rebooted
<c0rnelius> disable said service
<stipa> it still fills the ramlog
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/var/log# systemctl disable atop
<stipa> Failed to disable unit: Unit file atop.service does not exist.
<c0rnelius> Does the ramlog service know that?
<stipa> dunno, how to check?
<c0rnelius> Would need to ask Armbian dev. Probs something in the scripting there.
<stipa> probably
<c0rnelius> probs missing a if [[ `command -v atop` ]]; then blah; else :; fi something to that degree anyway.
<steev> stipa: try sudo apt purge --autoremove atop
<steev> debian leaves dangling services in case of restarting
<steev> reinstalling*
<c0rnelius> yeah it does have a nasty habit of doing that.
<stipa> Setting up atop (2.6.0-2build1) ...
<stipa> Created symlink /etc/systemd/system/ → /lib/systemd/system/atop-rotate.timer.
<stipa> Created symlink /etc/systemd/system/ → /lib/systemd/system/atop.service.
<stipa> Created symlink /etc/systemd/system/ → /lib/systemd/system/atopacct.service.
<stipa> atop-rotate.service is a disabled or a static unit, not starting it.
<stipa> steev: i'll try
<steev> you have to purge to remove the systemd units, sadly
<steev> we've run into a pretty annoying issue with it because of the move from pipewire-media-session to wireplumber because of it leaving the old service around, which means wireplumber can't enable its service
<stipa> that's beyond my hacking abbilities
<stipa> sudo apt purge --autoremove atop didn't help
<stipa> steev: so, i would have to install atop, check what services it depends on, stop it, purge services it depends on and purge the atop, then install all services it depends on back ?
<steev> you don't need to reinstall it to look, just "apt show atop" and look at its dependencies
<steev> though
<steev> i'm guessing there's a crontab somewhere that's trying to call it?
<steev> that should be removed with a purge, but you might need to restart the cron daemon you're using
<stipa> Depends: libc6 (>= 2.33), libncursesw6 (>= 6), libtinfo6 (>= 6), zlib1g (>= 1:1.1.4), lsb-base (>= 3.2-14)
<stipa> Recommends: cron | cron-daemon
<stipa> Pre-Depends: init-system-helpers (>= 1.54~)
<stipa> those depends sound like those that could break the system if deleted or smthn like that
<stipa> i'll concentrate on cron thing
<stipa> 'crontab -l' seems empty
<stipa> 'less /etc/crontab' too
<steev> maybe grep for atop in /etc ?
<stipa> there's some folders in /etc/cron.daily/
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/etc/cron.daily# ls
<stipa> apt-compat aptitude armbian-ram-logging cracklib-runtime dpkg logrotate man-db sysstat
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/etc/cron.daily# ls /etc/|grep -i atop
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/etc/cron.daily#
<stipa> no results
<stipa> i guess you meant folders and sub folders grep
<stipa> just a sec
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/etc/cron.daily# tree /etc/ |fgrep atop
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/etc/cron.daily#
<stipa> no result
<steev> you want to grep the contents, not for the files
<steev> you want to grep the contents, not for the files names
<stipa> i'll try to look for the string atop in all files
<stipa> steev: root@orangepilite2:/etc/cron.daily# grep -Ril "atop" /etc |nc 9999 /
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:~# ack 'atop'|nc 9999
<steev> did you manually install atop at some point?
<steev> is it in /usr/local ?
<stipa> steev: i think it came with the image
<steev> if you have aptitude installed, and atop were still installed, you could have done "aptitude why atop"
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/usr/local# aptitude why atop
<stipa> Not currently installed
<stipa> The candidate version 2.6.0-2build1 has priority optional
<stipa> No dependencies require to install atop
<stipa> i'm searching through hole / for the atop now, maybe it'll be over soon
<stipa> seems like it's still on the system
<stipa> running if it's wrting the logs
<stipa> but invisible to the tools
<stipa> commands*
<steev> pkill atop ?
<stipa> i did it, no output from the pkill, but something runs it on reboot too, i have no idea what could instead of it fill 70 MB of ramlog
<stipa> under it's name
<stipa> literally atop folder is created with 70MB of stuff
<stipa> on every reboot and it grows over time
<stipa> days*
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/var/log/atop# ls |nc 9999
<stipa> maybe atop by itself sends data to some other program that then does the logs for it
<stipa> and it's still doing it even if atop is not there
<stipa> with "empty" log files
<stipa> but, i can't catch what service is doing it, now it's silent
<stipa> i've practically turned everything that lsof showed writing to the logs
<stipa> off
<stipa> and on treboot something still writes 70MB of data to lsof folder
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:/var/log# systemd-analyze blame | nc 9999
<stipa> 740ms smartmontools.service , that one is fishy
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<stipa> ah no, that's disk smart thing
<stipa> yeah, main suspect for now is cron
<stipa> why would it maybe log files of a service that is not running is strange
<c0rnelius> I did look thru the armbian setup. I didn't see atop apart or related to any service.
<c0rnelius> It must be somewhere though. Why remove atop anyway? Its not hurting anything?
<stipa> it fills ramlog over time
<c0rnelius> disable ramlog
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<c0rnelius> Personally I don't run Armbian but I can't see it as being essential to anything.
<stipa> i think it's needed for services, i know it matters for apt update & upgrade
<stipa> i didn't want to update and upgrade because ramlog was full
<c0rnelius> Yeah but its something they introduced. Its not on a default debian install for example.
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<stipa> yeah, to save the sdcard from logs
<stipa> but, logs weren't so full before that atop shit, hardly ever it got fuller than 50MB
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<c0rnelius> Sounds like trying to re-invent the wheel for no reason and if probs more related to debugging issues.
<c0rnelius> But thats just me looking at it from the outside.
<stipa> it's just that if atop wasn't the culprit everything would have look fine and dandy
<stipa> loked*
<stipa> looked*
<stipa> i had to bump ramlog from 50MB to 200MB
<c0rnelius> Well I see many Armbian devs logged on. Maybe they could explain it? :)
<stipa> nah, not enough money
<c0rnelius> There is some level of truth to that.
<stipa> they're concerned just by those who pay
<stipa> neglecting everybody else
<c0rnelius> Well you don't have to run Armbian. Its a luxury in which you choose to do.
<stipa> yeah, it starts to make no sense anymore
<stipa> maybe its time to just give up
<c0rnelius> The best thing you can do for ur self is to learn how to do it for ur self. That way every mistake is ur own.
<stipa> nah, i just need to learn how to quit
<c0rnelius> I guess do that then.
<stipa> prioritize and simply dump time waste
<stipa> there's that fine point between curiosity and taking care of yourself
<stipa> going too deep is not healthy
<c0rnelius> Well everything is just a matter of opinion really. I think you would be better off learning how things work and doing it how you want it done.
<steev> how is atop running if
<steev> it's not installed
<steev> there has to be an atop executable somewhere
<stipa> or something else is making logs naming it atop
<c0rnelius> open a terminal and run: `command -v atop`
<c0rnelius> anything come up?
<stipa> c0rnelius: i understand that philosophy, it really is paramount if one wants to understand
<c0rnelius> for example: command -v top
<c0rnelius> /usr/bin/top
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:~# command -v atop
<stipa> root@orangepilite2:~#
<stipa> nada
<c0rnelius> so something is looking for it and can't find it.
<stipa> seems like it copies files from sdcard to ramlog on every reboot
<stipa> from /var/log.hdd/atop
<stipa> ok, last reboot
<stipa> we've come to the right point
<stipa> let's see if it works
<stipa> nope, after reboot folder that was deleted /var/log.hdd/atop still appears there and gets copied into /var/log
<stipa> deleting /var/log.hdd/atop folder and restarting armbian-ramlog service gets it back
<c0rnelius> do me a kindness and run: `dmesg | grep corrupt`
<c0rnelius> Has nothing really to do with ur problem I just wanna see what happens
<stipa> c0rnelius: nada, empty output
<c0rnelius> thanx
<stipa> it's log2ram service or armbian-ramlog script
<stipa> that create logs of a service that doesn't even exist on a system
<stipa> probably triggered by atop service when it's installed
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<stipa> ok, i guess i could see then what is creating /var/log.hdd/atop by restarting armbian-ramlog
<stipa> it happens fast but i saw command 'tee' doing something
<stipa> that one probably copies files from /var/log.hdd/atop to /var/log
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