ChanServ changed the topic of #kisslinux to: Unnofficial KISS Linux community channel | https://kisscommunity.bvnf.space | post logs or else | song of the day https://vid.puffyan.us/H7PvgY65OxA
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<asdfhjkl> Anyone know why upstream sources don't provide Configure files for most gnu projects?
<asdfhjkl> Makes it so that we have to rely on their tarball releases to build
<asdfhjkl> Git sources I'm referring to particularly
<midfavila> if it's git it's probably because it's expected that only people with a proper development toolchain are pulling from there
<midfavila> no point in including a configure script if the only people you expect to clone the repo will have autotools
<asdfhjkl> It's throwing a monkey wrench in my project
<asdfhjkl> that and they're expecting you to clone git submodules too when building from source for some things
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<asdfhjkl> yea
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<asdfhjkl> going to have to include autohell
<phoebos> asdfhjkl: what's wrong with a tarball cache?
<asdfhjkl> my project entails including all sources from git via unified git server direct from upstream sources
<asdfhjkl> i dont want to depend on gnu devs with autohell installed to be able to build their source
<asdfhjkl> what if they died or the internet went black or both
<dilynm> Then... You'd have to use autotools...
<asdfhjkl> yea that's what i just said
<asdfhjkl> > going to have to include autohell
<asdfhjkl> i want all sources, for everything, buildable, from my own mirror server
<asdfhjkl> that's the project. kiss linux + everything it takes to bootstrap kiss linux from git sources purely
<asdfhjkl> any reason https://github.com/kiss-community/openssl is still on github
<asdfhjkl> just caught that in the openssl sources, thought i'd mention it
<phoebos> > direct from upstream sources
<phoebos> if upstream goes down, you're left with a snapshot
<phoebos> just like if "gnu devs" stop making tarballs, you're left with a tarball
<phoebos> so why prefer git?
<asdfhjkl> and if the net goes down, and you dont have autotools, lol
<asdfhjkl> idk maybe you can keep on keeping on with the current generated Configure / makefiles etc from the tarball
<asdfhjkl> I'm trying to get everything. everything. all in one spot.
<asdfhjkl> including commit history, all the jazz
<phoebos> what do tarballs lack from "everything"
<phoebos> ah
<phoebos> well, if you want.
<asdfhjkl> imagine if covid was actually deadly
<phoebos> not much good for building stuff though
<asdfhjkl> or if the jab actually does kill a large portion of the devs
<asdfhjkl> or if WW3 goes down and blackouts around the world are happening
<asdfhjkl> and you want a distro that just has it all in one place
<asdfhjkl> and you want to build mesh networks and help your community communicate
<asdfhjkl> things like that
<asdfhjkl> really doomer scenario distro
<midfavila> if you're doing that you don't want to be using fucking gahnoonix
<midfavila> or a modern pc if you can help it
<phoebos> in this situation, you want to read... commit logs?
<midfavila> if you want a doomer OS look at collapse or duskos
<asdfhjkl> links please :)
<asdfhjkl> hmm, interesting stuff, bookmarked for sure thanks
<asdfhjkl> furthermore though I want a daily driver. I'm learning as I go things, too. I enjoyed my time at kiss a couple years ago and this is fun building out my version of it in a chroot
<asdfhjkl> let's see how far I get
<midfavila> how is http://wiby.me so unbelievably comfy
<midfavila> i can like, reliably get good results that are almost exclusively from smaller sites
<asdfhjkl> Sick
<asdfhjkl> Bookmarking!
<midfavila> i've been using it as my primary search engine for a while
<midfavila> these days i only use duckduckgo when i'm looking for something either obscenely obscure or normie-tier
<asdfhjkl> Yeah this fits in to my projects self hosting stuff at https://asdfhjkl.xyz
<midfavila> pls consider offering your site over http or gopher
<asdfhjkl> I have so far mail, matrix, nextcloud, git
<testuser[m]> Hi
<asdfhjkl> gopher!! yeaaaah I want to do that
<midfavila> mandatory tls for content that doesn't absolutely require security is really gross
<asdfhjkl> Yea, most everything it links to requires security, i'm actually looking in to being my own CA too tho with my kiss fork
<asdfhjkl> hang on i'll modify the nginx and see if I can get you an http link
<midfavila> i wish links was structured in a more clean fashion
<midfavila> every time i look at patching it to use libtls i just want to die
<midfavila> a classic
<illiliti> mandatory tls is good cuz mitm
<midfavila> overrated threat
<midfavila> if you're concerned about mitm then use the optional tls provided by sane sites
<illiliti> i know isp that inject ads into unencrypted http connections
<midfavila> yeah so use https if you use a trash isp
<asdfhjkl> Here you go http://asdfhjkl.xyz
<midfavila> based
<midfavila> tyvm
<asdfhjkl> The rest of my services auto rewrite but i just did that for you lol
<asdfhjkl> nah my ISP dont know shit because what happens is my traffic hits a tiny little VPS in a datacenter in texas
<asdfhjkl> wireguard routes it to my computers at home from there
<asdfhjkl> so my whole stack is here at home other than the wireguard
<Torr> asdfhjkl: Why did u skip the "g" for your username?
<asdfhjkl> asdf hjkl is the home, hjkl is also the vim keys, and asdf is a common lisp thing
<asdfhjkl> home row*
<asdfhjkl> ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
<Torr> Is that so
<wael_> Hi
<asdfhjkl> Hi
<asdfhjkl> Anyone know if the version file suports numbering+lettering. I have a package that does that.
<asdfhjkl> e.g. 1.2a 1.2b
<illiliti> it supports any string
<asdfhjkl> k
<Torr> > any string
<Torr> $ cat version
<Torr> Mighty_Banana
<Torr> $ cd ../kernel
<asdfhjkl> lmao autoconf and automake require themselves to build themselves from source
<Torr> $ cat version
<Torr> BIG_KURWA
<wael_> Torr: you forgot the revision
<Torr> Truly
<Torr> Think I'll sleep.
<Torr> See ya folks
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<phoebos> season's greetings, #kisslinux
<wael_> hi phoebos
<wael_> thoughts on LTO & PGO?
<testuser[m]> useless
<testuser[m]> unless very large program like ff chromium linux
<testuser[m]> or something like ffmpeg or video codecs
<wael[m]> linux requires clang to build with lto
<wael[m]> how do i do it with firefox
<wael_> wht about gcc
<testuser[m]> no
<testuser[m]> extra time for compilng with pgo is more than time savings of a year
<testuser[m]> With more optimized gcc
<wael[m]> with ffmpeg wouldnt that need lto gcc or just some configure option
<saturn[m]> hi wael
<wael_> hi saturn[m]
<wael[m]> hi saturn
<wael[m]> bye saturn
<saturn[m]> hi wael(s)
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<saturn[m]> now it’s just one
<wael_> im the real wael
<saturn[m]> what….
<wael_> that wael was a fake
<saturn[m]> oh
<saturn[m]> i cant believe it
<wael_> why would clang be a dependency of firefox if it uses gcc
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<midfavila> i have acquired
<midfavila> internet that doesn't suck
<wael_> hi midfavila
<wael_> congratulations midfavila
<midfavila> hello, wael
<asdfhjkl> Merry Christmas
<midfavila> woo consoomas
* midfavila flails around
<asdfhjkl> Question: how do we know when we should e.g. make DESTDIR="$1"  install vs. just make install ?
<midfavila> look at the makefile
<asdfhjkl> For what
<midfavila> if there's no install target, a manual install is necessary
<wael_> asdfhjkl: btw i believe by kiss style that DESTDIR must always be explicit anyway
<wael_> there's some packages that have different variables for the destination directory
<asdfhjkl> So no harm done then, explicitly setting it
<asdfhjkl> There are many packages in core that do not explicitly set DESTDIR in or around make install commands
<asdfhjkl> e.g. for gmp, `make DESTDIR="$1"` install
<asdfhjkl> while others like make itself, or m4, and many others, are simple `make install`
<wael_> yeah not sure about enforcing it honestly
<asdfhjkl> should DESTDIR always be $1? $1 is the staged section in .cache right, before kiss (rsyncs?) moves the package to the system?
<asdfhjkl> I'm wondering what would happen if kiss tried to make install outside of $1? I suppose that priviledge escalation would not have occured yet, right, and so you might hit permission denied errors if it is trying to make install in the wrong location?
<wael_> kiss itself sets DESTDIR
<asdfhjkl> i'm running kiss as a regular user on a package i'm working on, it builds all the way through, and before i finish the install (where kiss allows me to escalate to root and install the files...) i inspect the `proc` directory, and **everything** is still owned by my regular user. NOW, when I install, kiss is unable to cleanup proc fully, permission
<asdfhjkl> denied, then I inspect again, and it turns out that there is a random tarball directory in there, that kiss extracts while it is root, and then it tries to clean up proc as a regular user, and fails
<asdfhjkl> is this a kiss bug?
<asdfhjkl> One would think that kiss while installing as root shouldn't be extracting anything at all
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<van2022> hi
<asdfhjkl> I have /home/asdf/cache/.cache/kiss/proc/646100 getting in to my manifest
<asdfhjkl> what's up with that
<asdfhjkl> hi
<asdfhjkl> Merry Christmas
<van2022> I am currently in the process of installing the system. I have interrupted my attempt to install/build the system for several weeks and don't know how to proceed properly. when I stopped I wrote "exit" and copied the contents of mnt to another folder. how to continue?
<asdfhjkl> cd in to the location the rootfs is and `bin/kiss-chroot .`
<asdfhjkl> pick up where you left off in the instructions
<van2022> asdfhjkl, I only have this termbin.com/ciuv
<asdfhjkl> Hey I have no idea what any of that is
<asdfhjkl> but if you're installing kiss i recommend following this page https://kisslinux.org/install except when it comes to cloning the various mentioned repos, get them from here: https://codeberg.org/kiss-community
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<midfavila> jfc my toughbook is starting to die
<midfavila> i thought i'd found laptop mecca but no
<noocsharp> starting to die how?
<phoebos> a toughbook dying!
<phoebos> asdfhjkl: interesting. can you provide the build script and a full log
<asdfhjkl> Honestly phoebos i'm dealing with autohell packages and I don't want to bug you guys with it unless i'm pretty sure it's a kiss bug
<phoebos> we're always interested to help out :)
<asdfhjkl> at this point, i'm tracing it
<asdfhjkl> lmao
<asdfhjkl> friggin strace on kiss
<asdfhjkl> i've found that right before kiss creates the tarball, it goes and tarballs this location:
<asdfhjkl> in pkg_tar
<asdfhjkl> cd "$pkg_dir/$1"
<asdfhjkl> and it tarballs is
<asdfhjkl> so i go and look there right
<asdfhjkl> that equates to:
<asdfhjkl> /home/asdf/.cache/kiss/proc/731412/pkg/automake
<asdfhjkl> it contains my autoshit package
<asdfhjkl>  /home/asdf/.cache/kiss/proc/731412/pkg/automake/usr
<asdfhjkl>  /home/asdf/.cache/kiss/proc/731412/pkg/automake/var
<asdfhjkl> and ...
<asdfhjkl>  /home/asdf/.cache/kiss/proc/731412/pkg/automake/home !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
<asdfhjkl>  /mnt/home/asdf/.cache/kiss/proc/731412/pkg/automake/home/asdf/.cache/kiss/proc/731412/build/automake/doc/amhello/amhello-1.0/_inst/
<asdfhjkl> so that's insane
<asdfhjkl> so then root goes and installs in to my $HOME
<asdfhjkl> and then it tries to clean it up after it descalates privs, as my regular asdf user
<asdfhjkl> and that's permission denied
<asdfhjkl> LMAO
<asdfhjkl> Here'/s a build file, right. it's shitty because i'm using an gnu provided 'bootstrap' script to generate a configure file on this package, because they don't store configure in the git version of automake
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<sad_plan> hi
<asdfhjkl> phoebos http://ix.io/4jy8/bash
<asdfhjkl> that builds w/o issue because of the nasty workaround on the last line.
<asdfhjkl> here's the manifest from that https://paste.rs/jkw
<asdfhjkl> Now if I remove that rm -rf from the last line and install again, take a look at this
<asdfhjkl> build output http://ix.io/4jyb
<asdfhjkl> manifest http://ix.io/4jye/text
<asdfhjkl> phoebos ^
<phoebos> seems like prefix and destdir are getting messed up
<phoebos> what's your KISS_TMP and tar provider
<asdfhjkl> busybox
<asdfhjkl> how do I find KISS_TMP
<asdfhjkl> I'll echo it out from a build attempt?
<phoebos> if you haven't set it dw
<phoebos> i'll try to reproduce
<asdfhjkl> i dont think you'll reproduce it unelss you build from source
<asdfhjkl> i'm suspecting its the configure file options might need setting surroudning this 'doc' amhello functionality
<asdfhjkl> phoebos here's the relevant options i can see available in ./configure for this http://ix.io/4jyh/bash
<asdfhjkl> check out `42   --docdir=DIR            documentation root [DATAROOTDIR/doc/automake]`
<asdfhjkl> I've tried setting `--docdir=/usr/share \` to no avail
<asdfhjkl> Do I need to set DATAROOTDIR somehow?
<asdfhjkl> hmm nope
<phoebos> i can't reproduce
<phoebos> run sh -x /bin/kiss b automake 2>&1 and post the xtrace