#commonlisp on 2022-10-22 — irc logs at libera.irclog.whitequark.org

2022-07-28 16:55 jackdaniel changed the topic of #commonlisp to: Common Lisp, the #1=(programmable . #1#) programming language | Wiki: <https://www.cliki.net> | IRC Logs: <https://irclog.tymoon.eu/libera/%23commonlisp> | Cookbook: <https://lispcookbook.github.io/cl-cookbook> | Pastebin: <https://plaster.tymoon.eu/>

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00:37 <sonny> How do I learn Lisp? I've done a bunch of other similar languages but they had (comprehensive) tutorials :P

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00:39 <kakuhen> pick a lisp and find some resources to learn it, i guess -- depending on the choice of lisp, this may be easy or really hard

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00:40 <kakuhen> Common Lisp, for instance, has various decent texts -- I'm biased in favor of Practical Common Lisp

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00:40 <sonny> sorry, I meant Common Lisp

00:40 <kakuhen> with that said there are attempts to "modernize" Practical Common Lisp but I wouldn't count on those being available (let alone, recommendable resource) any time soon

00:40 <sonny> I've learned Scheme and Racket already

00:41 <kakuhen> ah, in that case you may also benefit from quickly looking things up in https://lispcookbook.github.io/cl-cookbook/

00:41 <kakuhen> you might have a better time asking #clschool (channel that's dedicated to learning common lisp, as far as I understand it)

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00:42 <kakuhen> oh and don't feel intimidated by the common lisp hyperspec -- in many cases, questions about the language get answered there

00:42 <kakuhen> this is something I wish I took to mind when I started learning Common Lisp

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00:45 <sonny> thanks

00:46 <kakuhen> With that said, an equally interesting question is "what is NOT a good resource for learning common lisp?"

00:47 <kakuhen> I recommend avoiding "Land of Lisp" because of the numerous errors in the book. You can find a partial list of errors in http://metamodular.com/Books/land-of-lisp.html

00:47 <kakuhen> (there's a lot of them, despite the list being incomplete)

00:47 <sonny> well that's dissapointing lol

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00:48 <kakuhen> anyway, I hope this information helps you pick a resource you like

00:48 <kakuhen> and I guess one last time I want to emphasize is: feel free to ask any questions #clschool no matter how beginner they sound

00:48 <kakuhen> s/time/thing

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01:20 <tyson2> kakuhen:I noticed the errors in Land of Lisp, but I also has a problem with his lisp style, quite hard to follow

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01:20 <tyson2> I dropped it and am using Practical Common Lisp (and the tutorials from the Clog guy)

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01:21 <tyson2> I find the Clog tutorials on Common Lisp to be really good.

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01:21 <tyson2> https://github.com/rabbibotton/clog/blob/main/LEARN.md

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01:23 <tyson2> now if I could only find another ten hours a week to learn lisp properly

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02:10 <pdietz> I have enjoyed reading the CLHS.

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04:39 <aeth> is minion going to be broken all weekend?

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04:54 <beach> You can use Colleen for some of the functionality provided by minion.

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13:27 <Josh_2> Mornin :sunglasses:

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13:56 <Mrtn[m]> Josh_2: Who is *:sunglasses:*?

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14:24 <beach> Mrtn[m]: I think it is supposed to be an ASCII representation of an emoji.

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14:33 <Mrtn[m]> beach: Ah! That makes sense. 😎

14:37 <Bike> a lot of chat systems use ":foo:" to denote the emoji named foo

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14:48 <cel7t> Does anyone here know how to implement substructural types (specifically, affine and linear types) in SBCL?

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15:18 <Josh_2> Mrtn[m]: If you use ERC in Emacs there is a package called 'emojify'

15:18 <Josh_2> :smirk:

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15:42 <Josh_2> Time to map my lisp system to a database :sob:

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16:18 * contrapunctus hands https://cliki.net/ObjectStore to Josh_2

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16:54 <Josh_2> contrapunctus: yes I have used bknr in the past

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16:55 <Josh_2> I think allegro cache would be what I really want

16:56 <Josh_2> but I dont have the money for that

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17:02 <Josh_2> Time to learn all about databases and create my own :sunglasses:

17:04 <contrapunctus> Josh_2: what's unique about Allegro Cache?

17:05 <contrapunctus> * that's important to you?

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17:09 <Josh_2> A database that can be interacted with by the outside world would be nice

17:09 <Josh_2> rather than having to roll my own tools for interacting with a bknr datastore

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17:12 <contrapunctus> Josh_2: I haven't used BKNR, but doesn't it support serializing to XML?

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17:30 <Josh_2> This persistence malarkey sure is a pita :(

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17:38 <Josh_2> there is a lot left to be desired :(

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19:08 <Mrtn[m]> <Josh_2> "Mrtn: If you use ERC in Emacs..." <- Does it transform those into smileys?

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19:58 <Josh_2> Yes

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20:35 <pigeon_666> hey can someone help me understand some CLOS stuff?

20:38 <copec> pigeon_666: I would ask specific questions. Here is some reference if you haven't made you way through it: https://gigamonkeys.com/book/object-reorientation-generic-functions.html https://gigamonkeys.com/book/object-reorientation-classes.html

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20:39 <copec> historical ultimate book: https://github.com/lisp-books/lisp-books/blob/main/Art%20of%20Metaobject%20Protocol.pdf

20:40 <pigeon_666> copec: thanks I'll take a look

20:43 <Josh_2> You can ask questions

20:43 <Josh_2> CLOS is cool :sunglasses:

20:46 <pigeon_666> Josh_2: I think these docs have the answers i need but thx

20:46 <Josh_2> aww

20:46 <Mrtn[m]> Josh_2: That is interesting. I assume that is non-standard.

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20:54 <Josh_2> emojify?

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20:55 <Mrtn[m]> Josh_2: Yeah, ERC.

20:55 <Mrtn[m]> (Annoying nick to complete, btw).

20:55 <Josh_2> Whats wrong with my nick :(

20:56 <pve> Hi, is it ok to define a constant with a gensym value like this: (unless (boundp '+done+) (defconstant +done+ (gensym "DONE")))

20:57 <pve> I remember seeing another way to do it here earlier that didn't have the boundp check, but I can't remember what it was

20:57 <Mrtn[m]> Josh_2: Underscore is hard to type, and there is someone called JoshYoshi in here also.

20:59 <Josh_2> Yeh thats also me I think

20:59 <Mrtn[m]> I guess uppercase letters also doesn't make it easier.

20:59 <Josh_2> Just a fallback if I dc and can't reconnect with me

20:59 <Mrtn[m]> JoshYoshi: This is you also?

21:00 <Josh_2> Ye

21:00 <Mrtn[m]> Is +Yoshi+ Japanese for two or something?

21:00 <Josh_2> No it just came to mind :joy:

21:01 <Josh_2> I do not use this nick anywhere other than IRC, I've used it for 8 or 9 years, no need to change now

21:02 <Mrtn[m]> OK

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