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<c0rnelius>
The patch should really be applied to all meson64 using mainline u-boot from what I can tell. I've tested it on s905y, s905x, s905x3 and s922x.
<c0rnelius>
anyway. unless there is something else flawed in the patching for the n2 that should stop the random lockups and reboots.
<nekomancer[m]>
then, should I submit a PR? if nobody more smart did it...
<c0rnelius>
nekomancer[m]: yes sir.
<nekomancer[m]>
ok. thank you for save my N2
<c0rnelius>
ur welcome :)
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<nekomancer[m]>
c0rnelius: how to "@" you on github?
<c0rnelius>
I'm `pyavitz` on github.
<nekomancer[m]>
done
<c0rnelius>
k
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> you're doing well. that was one of many patches I hunted down last year. please read through the commit message here https://github.com/armbian/build/commit/956c1606de8c457f5bb18eea7eaeef7d44e59b71 it explains the rework principle, that patch and many others, done for 5.10; the same general principle applies to 5.15 as well, just needs doing. (and some research with the UHS stuff).
<TRS-80>
I think c0rnelius is doing great, I keep trying to recruit him. :)
<c0rnelius>
I saw that when you did it, but then you deleted the odroid specific reboot patches. Which as far as I know are needed for the C4/N2.
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> yeah, but if you read through the commit is is explained there...
<c0rnelius>
yeah I read it
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> CONFIG_DRM_MESON=y fixes the order of shutdown callbacks, allowing it to reboot without patches
<c0rnelius>
I'm just saying that I don't know if thats true. But in fairness I didn't test that part of the commit.
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<c0rnelius>
As I use tobetter's patch set. I'm lazy :)
<c0rnelius>
I have seen people complain about it not working on the forum.
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> Yeah, that's not fair comparison though; tobetter's has the reboot "driver".
<c0rnelius>
I think its like two patches?
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> it's a .c function full of hacks, and a dts binding to it
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> now, if you say that solves the UHS problem, I won't disagree
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<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> but that "driver" requires reverting stuff that breaks other meson64 to make actually reboot more than half the times
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<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> so it's 2 reboot patches, plus a huge revert, plus never-ending madness
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> it gotta stop, HK gotta learn to do it right. every other vendor does
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* TRS-80
wouldn't give a fig for the simplicity on the near side of complexity
<archetech>
Machine: Type: ARM Device System: Hardkernel ODROID-N2Plus
<c0rnelius>
I would have to look into it again but I think he reverts a shutdown function edits the Kconfig, Makefile and creates odroid-reboot.c.
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> so anyway, the fun part about this rework for 5.15 is gonna be the UHS stuff. if that does not work, then I'd split a meson64-odroid kernel, built directly from tobetter's tree and be done with it
<c0rnelius>
Maybe more to it then that I would need to investigate again.
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> Cheers. Any help is very welcome.
<c0rnelius>
archetech: why you on that old LTS for?
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> damned images for N2+ man, it's shameful
<archetech>
yeah wth
<archetech>
its what the download page gave me
<archetech>
2 choices this and a desktop
<c0rnelius>
ah shit happens
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> yeah sorry for that. I am figuring out where to change that for next build
<archetech>
so I take it I didnt get the new release
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> targets.conf I'm pretty sure, but how it gets to actual download page is beyond me
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> nah, 5.10.102 is recent enough. It's just the userspace that's old
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> old userspace = old mesa = no panfrost goodness
<c0rnelius>
keep it interesting :)
<c0rnelius>
Linux odroidn2 5.16.11 #1 SMP PREEMPT Wed Feb 23 07:11:45 EST 2022 aarch64 GNU/Linux
<c0rnelius>
wtf you want me to do? made my case. vednro u-boot sucks. move on.
<c0rnelius>
can't type either. v e n d o r
<archetech>
made your case? ok ill let that stay broke and install a DE w/ panfrost/mesa-git
<c0rnelius>
I don't use that board as a desktop. I thought this was about the random lockups and reboots? What panfrost issues are you having?
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<archetech>
none guy earlier upgraded his desktop install and it wouldnt boot might be gpu idk yet
<c0rnelius>
I can't be sure; but I think thats u-boot and kernel related.
<c0rnelius>
that fella's prob anyway. sounded like it.
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<archetech>
this cli updated 8 pkgs no kernel and its ok so far
<archetech>
reboot is broke now
<archetech>
maybe it was from start
<c0rnelius>
probs
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<c0rnelius>
I know what that fix is too and so do you. Add back tobetters patch.
<archetech>
Im willing to fix some stuff if I get respectful give n take so far you're swearing (wtf) and projecting your ideas onto me about what I know
<archetech>
that hostility will get ya nothing
<c0rnelius>
everything I know is what I found or created in my repo
<c0rnelius>
I don't work here
<c0rnelius>
These people know way more than more. I'm sure. I hope.
<c0rnelius>
I enjoy sharing information and investigating.
<archetech>
why compare?
<archetech>
ya know more than avg user
<archetech>
so good news xterm runs here
<c0rnelius>
always plus there.
<c0rnelius>
what do you use the board for?
<c0rnelius>
desktop stuff I assume?
<archetech>
yes I build the main de's most use not the obscure ones like sway
<archetech>
so I wont bore ya with the details if you're a headless horseman
<c0rnelius>
Yeah I don't mess to much with it. Been playing with the radxa zero using openbox and media players. ssh; DISPLAY=:0; see how it behaves. Not as savvy as CE does I'll say that much.
<c0rnelius>
Not to disappointing though. Basic Debian install not bad.
<c0rnelius>
x265 is shit
<archetech>
if my de/browser plays YT im good :)
<c0rnelius>
I find yt runs better in mpv
<archetech>
see how semi-plain kde does
<archetech>
on wayland ofc
<c0rnelius>
I'll give it a whirl. I usually start with a simple ifupdown install and all these desktops screw it up.
<c0rnelius>
everyone loves fancy networking guis
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<Armbian-Discord>
<NicoD> Could anyone give a short explenation of what the problem is with the N2(+)? I read something about it not booting after upgade. Also when you freeze the kernel? And what image should then be used? I'm preparing a video where I test Armbian 22.02 images on different boards (Jetson Nano, VIM3, M4V2, HC4, N2+, PineH64 and PBP). I'll see what's wrong, but could save me time if I already know...
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<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> there is one jira on the topic
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> Also, recording of last meeting, there I explained in detail.
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<Armbian-Discord>
<NicoD> There are no images for the PineH64B, RockPro64, Pine64, Orange Pi Win / Plus, Nanopi Neo 2 and Helios4.
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<IgorPec>
NicoD if we have a maintainer for them, but they are missing, file a bug
<IgorPec>
i also found a few missing, but couldn't do anything yet
<Armbian-Discord>
<NicoD> Ok.
<buZz>
burn it to the ground
<buZz>
:D
<buZz>
IgorPec: also , go buy a xe503c32 , archlinuxarm is soooo shiiiiiiiiiiiit :D i want a decent distro on it ;)
<buZz>
hehe
<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> i wish i would have time for that
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<Armbian-Discord>
<Tonymac32> Lol
<Armbian-Discord>
<Tonymac32> I haven't gotten my RK3288 Chromebook up and running yet. 😢
<Macer>
Are there any decent arm based boards that can be run as a file server?
<Armbian-Discord>
<Tonymac32> Depends on your needs. Quite a few RK3399 ones support PCIe in some form, some have SATA hats/etc
<Armbian-Discord>
<Tonymac32> It can also be less intense: I used a USB3 RAID tower for years with an Odroid XU4, for example
<TRS-80>
Macer: There are many, many boards which meet the basic requirements of that. I am still running an old cubietruck which works fine. But you could do a lot better nowadays, as Tonymac32 hinted at, something with PCIe or HAT opens up possibility of doing ZFS, etc.
<Macer>
Yeah. That was what I was really wondering about.
<TRS-80>
I still have some HDDs attached via USB as well. To an XU4 in fact. :)
<Macer>
I just can’t do usb drives lol
<TRS-80>
how much you want to spend and how important are things like ZFS to you?
<TRS-80>
to be clear I meant USB ot SATA adapters
<TRS-80>
good ones, recommended by tkaiser
<Macer>
zfs on a file server nowadays is probably necessary heh.
<Macer>
I honestly can’t imagine using anything else.
<TRS-80>
I see you are a man of distinction, like myself :)
<TRS-80>
I agree
<TRS-80>
OK so in that case I like ROCKPro64 a lot, as it has regular PCIe slot
<TRS-80>
there are other RK3399 but those require special snowflake HATs which you may or may not be able to get either now or in the future from board maker
<TRS-80>
we have a thread discussing this, lemme find it
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> Macer: i've many NFS/SMB/Ceph on a few ODROID HC4, double SATA, much sweet. wouldn't know about ZFS.
<[TheBug]>
Use RockPro64 or RockPi 4c/4B+ but ROckPro64 will be best because you won't need an m.2 to pcie adapter
<[TheBug]>
through an 6-10 port sata card in it
<[TheBug]>
use atx power supply
<[TheBug]>
molex to DC jack for power
<[TheBug]>
off to the races
<[TheBug]>
s/through/throw
<ArmbianHelper>
[TheBug] meant to say: throw an 6-10 port sata card in it
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> oh wow. and all that behind 1gbit/s ?
<[TheBug]>
HC4 is the same as useing USB, its just a fancy built in JMicron Sata to USB chip
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> you're very wrong there
<[TheBug]>
I have some on 1Gbit but others with r8156b 2.5Gbit USB nic attached
<[TheBug]>
I have one sitting on my desk
<[TheBug]>
pretty sure thats the case, though I am a bit tierd and have too many boards, so maybe I am confusing
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> HC4's SATA is actually an also-IDE compatible PCI adapter, there's no USB involved.
<[TheBug]>
ill take your word for it instead of arguing atm cause I could be wrong
<[TheBug]>
I still say RockPro64 is your best for a NAS
<[TheBug]>
well something more than 2 disks I guess
<TRS-80>
I like it because you can use cheap/dump PCIe to SATA adapter which are readily available and cheap
<TRS-80>
no need to rely on vendor special HAT, nor adapters, etc.
<[TheBug]>
yes,
<[TheBug]>
I use both RockPi 4c and RockPro64 in this case
<[TheBug]>
I have a 10 port sata card in RocPro64 and 10x3Tb in raid5
<TRS-80>
for XFS especially you want a 'dumb' adapter card
<TRS-80>
ZFS, sorry
<[TheBug]>
I have RockPi 4c with 8 port sata card and 7x3TB raid 5
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<TRS-80>
nothing with any 'smarts', let ZFS do all that
<[TheBug]>
ive just used mdadm raid5 and been pretty reliable
<Armbian-Discord>
<rpardini> makes sense, using pcie as standard of course makes sense. it's just that 2 disks (say, 1 ssd, 1 hdd, bcachefs) already saturate 1gbit networking so i just stick with 2-disks, 4gb, 4 cores machines and have many of them. scale out, not up
<TRS-80>
Personally I am less concerned about speed and more about (cheap, but reliable) volume of storage
<TRS-80>
Macer: So, lots of different ways to go here, depending on what you want to do. :)
<TRS-80>
@rpardini I never paid much attention to HC4 before, thanks for mentioning it. It's good to know the PCI is 'native' (not going through USB)
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<TRS-80>
Macer: What file system you like will dictate topology I guess. I like ZFS and disks are cheap so I go that way with zpools in mirror configuration. @rpardini is going another way, HDD + SSD (cache) for speed. And maybe using Ceph or whatever.
<[TheBug]>
TRS-80: then good new, order refurb 3/4TB HGST drives from goharddrive.com and a nice 6-10 port sata card and a RockPro64 and your good to go
<[TheBug]>
those refurb drives have about 50k hours on them usually w/ 1-3 year warranty on them and have over 50k hours left on them
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<[TheBug]>
you can build out full storage solution cheaper than single larger drive
<[TheBug]>
use a little more power though..
<[TheBug]>
and goharddrive.com stands behind their warranties, when you get each driver perform extended offline read test, if it fails ask them for mailing label and exchange, if it passses put into array
<TRS-80>
[TheBug]: Aah, good to know. Do you know if they support, I forget the setting, it's required for ZFS. TLER I want to say? Time Limited Error Recovery? i.e., you can set them to just fail quickly instead of keep trying to read a dodgy bit
<[TheBug]>
the HGST driver they refurb are enterprise so a good change answer may be yes
<[TheBug]>
though I do not know that off top of my head
<TRS-80>
[TheBug]: Sounds like you had good luck with them. You ever actually use the warranty? Or just heard good things?
<[TheBug]>
at least isn't sounding familiar
<TRS-80>
I would suspect so, but will double check of course.
<TRS-80>
it is common on enterprise drives, not so much on homeowner jobbies
<[TheBug]>
well have 50+ spinning as we speak 24/7... so..
<[TheBug]>
not talking out my ass, lets put it that way
<TRS-80>
OK, I'm sold. :) At least I will look at them, for sure. :)
<[TheBug]>
and yes, I use their warranty
<TRS-80>
XFS really opens up possibilities of doing things like that, too.
<[TheBug]>
if you do order and have issues let me know, I know the CS guy there I can tell you to reach out to
<TRS-80>
ZFS rather, bah
<TRS-80>
just keep some spares on hand
<[TheBug]>
to have best experiance
<TRS-80>
This could be a good topic for a forum post, actually.
<TRS-80>
To give some perspective, as things have changed over time and there are so many options.
<TRS-80>
So I guess in my mind, choice of filesystem would be first, as I said that will dictate topology.
<TRS-80>
also I try and not allow tkaiser saltiness to get to me, he is quite knowledgeable :)
<TRS-80>
but be warned lol
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<Macer>
Yea it would / does.
<Macer>
But I mean realistically zfs is pretty much the safest and cheapest and most well developed.
<Macer>
imo of course
<TRS-80>
I agree, but your question have prompted me to begin writing an up-to-date overview on this topic, which I plan on giving some (historical and other) background, linking to some other posts, etc.
<Macer>
i thought btrfs raid5/6 equivalent was still broken
<Macer>
i havent looked at btrfs since oracle bought sun and stopped bothering with it
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<Macer>
i honestly didnt even know that solaris is on its way out in favor of oracle linux... didnt even know oracle linux existed.
<buZz>
solaris is stil the #1 commercial unix
<buZz>
oracle linux is mostly not-unix
<Macer>
TRS-80: why do you mention btrfs being the free software and zfs being the open one? btrfs is closed or not gpl?
<TRS-80>
BTRFS is GPL while ZFS is a more permissive license (not sure which offhand)
<TRS-80>
follow link to 'problem with open source' at FSF if you are unfamiliar with this (small but important) distinction
<Macer>
cddl
<TRS-80>
oh wait
<Macer>
but i would call it more restrictive afaik
<TRS-80>
yeah
* TRS-80
scratches head
<Macer>
given its incompatibility with gpl which im not sure if that is still a thing
<TRS-80>
oh it is lol
<TRS-80>
OK so I probably phrased that wrong.
<TRS-80>
thanks for heads up
<TRS-80>
might need to edit
<Macer>
also.. with regard to zol... not sure what LLNL did but i know a major focus was common code ase across operating systems (bsd/linux mostly)
<Macer>
so zol had to get up to snuff
<Macer>
but that was quite a while ago... nowadays zfs is way more stable on linux
<Macer>
*base
<Macer>
used to be OI too but i think that can be mostly written off as a developer fetish nowadays
<TRS-80>
yes earlier on LLNL focus was on ZoL, which eventually became OpenZFS but I guess my point was that Linux probably saw (and continues to see) more development than the BSD part of 'OpenZFS' as Linux are what LLNL use
<Macer>
well now it is all the same (mostly)
<TRS-80>
but by now it's a bit of a historical curiosity, as you say
<Macer>
same code base for both afaik
<TRS-80>
I would still wager that Linux is better supported, but this sort of thing will only show up on obscure edge cases likely
<Macer>
i would kind of disagree
<TRS-80>
that's OK, I can be wrong :)
<TRS-80>
found the BSD guy :p
<Macer>
because of years of being ahead of the curve the fbsd et al people are usually spot on with the zfs devs
<Macer>
theyre like drinking buddies lol
<TRS-80>
ok cool, sounds like you follow it even closer than me
<Macer>
bsd is a great os. only thing i hate is that it does not have smb.cifs and i just refuse to use fuse :)
<Macer>
mount_smbfs is ancient andonly supports ntlmv1(smb1)
<TRS-80>
I am lucky, no longer need to support any Windoze machines, so I just use NFS
<TRS-80>
in fact it's amazing how everything 'just works' when all your boxen are running F/LOSS OS using open, standard protocols ;)
<Macer>
i do agree with you about the major data blunders
<TRS-80>
I mean, I suspected you would, just trying to share another perspective
<Macer>
id still argue that btrfs is not production worthy and realistically i do not see a use case for it
<Macer>
(since zfs is available for it and better)
<Macer>
maybe arc reliance on ram?
<TRS-80>
I like you, you can stay :p
<TRS-80>
a lot of RAM is only needed for de-duplication, but probably you know that
<TRS-80>
ZFS needs a lot of RAM is a bit of a myth that won't die however
<Macer>
it still helps for arc
<Macer>
so performance (in theory) should beimproved
<Macer>
buti guess anything caches
<TRS-80>
yeah I suppose so, you can also use a dedicated SSD for that as well, orf RAM is faster
<TRS-80>
like a lot of things I suppose it depends on your workload
<Macer>
sometimes
<Macer>
l2arc isnt worth it sometimes
<Macer>
since it still needs to address to ram so takes from faster arc
<TRS-80>
for me at home, typical serving files and media, it's plenty good enough; if you are doing CAD or rendering movies or whatever, well different story maybe
<Macer>
yeah lol. same here. but waiting on 4K movies to copy tho
<Macer>
who wants that?
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<TRS-80>
I am still in 1080p boat :)
<TRS-80>
but by now I did upgrade Ethernet to gigabit, so maybe I should try
<TRS-80>
I have a gig switch, etc.
<TRS-80>
weak point seems to be my crappy crimping of connectors lol
<Macer>
ah. i have a 10gb switch and sfp cards
<Macer>
sfp+
<TRS-80>
Jimeny Christmas
<TRS-80>
you write the article! :D
<Macer>
i actually get slowed down by disk io more than anything lol
<TRS-80>
Macer: I clarified the license wording in the ZFS/btrfs article, thanks for your feedback!
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<lanefu>
TRS-80: always the dedicated wordsmith
<TRS-80>
quality effortposting
<TRS-80>
quality being subjective :D
<lanefu>
better than quality shit posting.. sometimes
<TRS-80>
:D
<TRS-80>
I enjoy both
<TRS-80>
Where do we define acronyms for forum? I see that HAT is not defined.
<TRS-80>
2 new applicants for Board Maintainer today, I approved both and invited them to #armbian-onboarding
<IgorPec>
great!
<IgorPec>
thank you!
<Macer>
TRS-80: oh. no problem. i honestly didn't realize there was an issue with it. i was just going off of what i understood as differences in opinion of the gpl and cddl for zfs
<Macer>
at a point there were some heated debates over it lol
<Macer>
i think fencing should be a requirement if you major in CS
<Macer>
4 full years of it
<Macer>
and when issues of open licensing comes up... whoever wins the duel gets to do what they want
<TRS-80>
Macer: No you were absolutely right, it was a bad analogy which I clarified. I really do appreciate it, I even appreciate the fact you even read things and pay attention, do you know how rare that is these days?! :D
<TRS-80>
I dunno, I am certainly GPL guy but sometimes I wonder...
<nekomancer[m]>
<Armbian-Discord> "<rpardini> makes sense, using..." <- rpardini you sayd `bcachefs`? on rockpro64? what kernel?
<TRS-80>
All the fencing I guess happens beforehand. I suppose it is up to authors what license to use. I just try and convince hackers to use GPL for the protection of the greater ecosystem.
<TRS-80>
Otherwise IMO you get like iOS using BSD and contributing nothing back.
<TRS-80>
Even worse, loking down the OS. Which I just find mind-bogglingly maddening.
<TRS-80>
But perhaps the best example I have of a cuckold license is probably Minix (BSD 3-clause) which became basis of Intel Management Engine. /facepalm
<lanefu>
bachefs.. madness
<lanefu>
my lanecloud server is using mdraid, lvm, dm-cache writeback, then xfs and btrfs :P
<nekomancer[m]>
lanefu: you have to.
<Macer>
TRS-80: it's a struggle. reading more than 1 paragraph of the news wears me down.
<TRS-80>
Oh I don't mean the news. I quit paying attention to that about 20 years ago. :D
<Macer>
lanefu: lol wow
<TRS-80>
I mean, any reading at all, in gereral!
<TRS-80>
lanefu: You are Doing It Wrong(tm) :p
<Macer>
no way. doing it 100% correctly.
<lanefu>
the synthetic benchmarks are pretty good..... nvme cache in front of raid10 rust
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<TRS-80>
but... btrfs on top of RAID? I mean, what am I missing here?
<Armbian-Discord>
<NicoD> I red it all and only can agree with it all. I'm just not sure if the Helios64 ever was stable. Maybe you could add short info about what to expect when having USB2 -> USB3 for sata adapter. Gigabit ethernet vs 2.5. And again when drives are not fast enough. 2.5 will not speed it up, it just gives more headroom for multiple drives. It is beginner info, but I get a lot of comments of people missunderstanding these
<Armbian-Discord>
things. I use a HC4 and an old OPi+2 as NAS. HC4 with OMV and OPi+2 with plain Armbian with XFCE. Why xfce. Just because when I reboot(2x a year) I need to manually mount my drives. So I first ssh into it, then start x11vnc. And mount the drives quickly from vnc. Would be simply fixed with 2 lines of code. But those 2 lines would take more time to do.
<TRS-80>
Put it in the thread! :) I agree with you about Helios, but that is one of things I considered but shied away from saying. But maybe I should if I am recommending people to look for them for sale on the forums. Or take that part out.