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<muhammadnaqdi>
Sorry guys I know this is not relevant: Where can I discuss a new stack-based muchine that I've designed?
<mps>
muhammadnaqdi: I have no idea, but curious what type of stack machine you designed. forth?
<muhammadnaqdi>
mps: Yeah, It's based on retro forth. It's a VM for embedded.
<mps>
interesting
<mps>
I like to play with forth when I have free time
<muhammadnaqdi>
mps: ty. yeah, forth is such a beautiful machine.
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<mps>
muhammadnaqdi: did you put your design somewhere on the net
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<muhammadnaqdi>
mps: yeah but it needs translation.
<muhammadnaqdi>
mps: I can hit you when it's on GitHub.
<mps>
muhammadnaqdi: ok. when you make it please share, I would like to look
<muhammadnaqdi>
mps: sure.
<mps>
muhammadnaqdi: thanks
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<muurkha>
we need more cool hacking projects that aren't in English
<muurkha>
but I admit I won't be able to say much of interest myself if all the project documentation is in a language other than English, Spanish, or French
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<lagash>
What about Esperanto? :)
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<gordonDrogon>
My hovercraft is full of eels.
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<muurkha>
I haven't tried reading a virtual machine description written in Esperanto but I imagine I would have a lot of difficulty
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<dh`>
esperanto is just warmed-over francospanglish, it's not interesting in that connection
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<mps>
old latin would be better or even sanskrit. esperanto as all 'artificial' langs is useless
<muurkha>
I finally found a non-vulgar way to say this: Esperanto is much better at helping you meet cool people when you travel than old Latin, Sanskrit, and usually even French, Spanish, or English
<muurkha>
because Esperantists, like Bahá'ís, form a relatively well-connected community that is very widely distributed
<mps>
good languages are those which evolved for long time and no constructed ones
<mps>
s/no/not/
<muurkha>
if you write a virtual machine description in Esperanto or Lojban there are people who will read it simply because it's in Esperanto or Lojban. not very many, but more than the number of people who will read a virtual machine description simply because it's written in French or English
<muurkha>
even though there are enormously more people who *could* read the French or English one, most won't bother
<mps>
/o\
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<muurkha>
on seeing the reaction to Ramsey Nasser's Qalb I suspect Arabic might be more like Esperanto in this sense, though somewhat less so for *meeting* people while traveling
<muurkha>
Latinists and Sanskrit scholars are not quite as cohesive as Esperantists
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<mps>
muurkha: I'm talking about qualities of languages, not how much people understand them
<dh`>
running into someone who speaks Latin when traveling is going to be highly rare, but for that reason probably also highly effective
<dh`>
but there's no real computer terminology in latin
<dh`>
(yes, I know, if you search the internets you can find some but it's crap)
<muurkha>
it's easy to find people who speak Latin when traveling, the Roman Catholic Church has personnel in I think every country in the world, and they generally publicly announce themselves
<muurkha>
but if you aren't yourself a Catholic monk, nun, or priest, you don't share the same sort of in-group bond with them that Esperantists or Arberesh-speakers share with each other
<mps>
latin was taught in schools till about 30 years ago
<muurkha>
yeah, but you can't learn a language in school
<mps>
nowadays it faded away
<muurkha>
intrinsic qualities of languages are fairly insignificant above a certain minimal level for communication; Esperanto or Glosa might be easier to learn or harder to express certain things in than Guaraní or Hakka, but that's relatively unimportant in practice
<muurkha>
similar to RISC-V vs. ARM, it doesn't really matter that much whether code density is higher on one or the other
<muurkha>
what matters is which chips implement the architecture
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<muurkha>
and how good they are
<muurkha>
and how people feel about them, and things like legal restrictions
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<mps>
I agree on this with you
<lagash>
mps: Esperanto has been around for over a century and is the most successful constructed language by far
<muurkha>
depends on what you mean by "successful"
<muurkha>
languages aren't agents so they don't have desires or goals
<muurkha>
but there are maybe 100k Esperantists, and I've met a native speaker
<lagash>
dh`: Neo-Latin has some computer vocabulary, but it's been awhile since I cared about that - I moved onto Esperanto, as you might have guessed
<lagash>
I mean, what would even contend against Esperanto? Ido? Lojban?
<muurkha>
contend for what purpose?
<muurkha>
what's your ranking criterion?
<lagash>
Pretty much anything except linguistic "purity" which would be hard to define..
<lagash>
Popularity? Check. # of original books published? Check. # of translated works? Check. # of native speakers? Check. So on and so forth.
<muurkha>
Esperanto has the most current speakers, Volapuk is oldest, Lojban is most rigorously defined (and maybe has the most intellectual meat), Toki Pona is the most lighthearted, Ithkuil is the one with the most interesting Sapir-Whorf angle, Klingon has the best cosplay, lots of conlangs are easier to learn than Esperanto (I mentioned Glosa but there are numerous others)
<muurkha>
modern Hebrew has the largest army
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<muurkha>
Tolkien's two Elvish tongues have the prettiest script, though zbalermorna is a very respectable entrant here
<muurkha>
I think Esperanto probably has the warmest-hearted community
<mps>
lagash: your keyword is 'constructed' which in my thinking about languages means bad
<muurkha>
bad for what?
<mps>
for any communication
<muurkha>
for communication what matters most is that both you and the person you're speaking to know the language
<mps>
long ago I started to learn esperanto and very fast found it as nonsense
<muurkha>
(modern Greek is also older than Volapuk but it's debatable whether it's actually a conlang)
<muurkha>
if you both know it, Esperanto is definitely a workable vehicle for communication, as are all of the ones I mentioned except Toki Pona and possibly Ithkuil
<muurkha>
and I don't think it's even an especially clumsy one
<lagash>
On a related note, In the Land of Invented Languages (Okrent) is a good read.
<lagash>
It made a serious dent in my aspirations of creating a philosophical language when I was a kid..
<muurkha>
how come?
<lagash>
A good one, that is.
<lagash>
Because if Leibniz failed, I sure wasn't going to succeed! :P
<mps>
well, english is one of the worst langs I learned to some degree but I use it :)
<muurkha>
haha
<muurkha>
for a little while the Volapuk Wikipedia was bigger than the Esperanto one
<lagash>
There's a nice Latin WikiPedia I know..
<muurkha>
they're still the only two Wikipedias in conlangs that are over 100k articles
<lagash>
I got like, a dozen different links to different WikiPedia homepages, ha
<muurkha>
the Esperanto Wikipedia is more than twice the size of the Latin one
<muurkha>
actually I guess the modern Hebrew Wikipedia is almost as big as Esperanto
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<dh`>
the modern church latin that the catholics use is not super comprehensible if you learned classical latin
<dh`>
it's not _incomprehensible_, but then, neither is italian
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<muurkha>
the vocabulary and grammar is the same, which isn't true of Italian, it's just different pronunciation