qhong has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
qhong has joined #commonlisp
lottaquestions has joined #commonlisp
lottaquestions_ has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
lottaquestions has quit [Client Quit]
lottaquestions has joined #commonlisp
X-Scale` has joined #commonlisp
Brucio-61 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
Bike has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
Brucio-61 has joined #commonlisp
X-Scale has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
X-Scale` is now known as X-Scale
qhong has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
qhong has joined #commonlisp
livoreno has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Lord_of_Life has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
Lord_of_Life_ has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
Lord_of_Life_ is now known as Lord_of_Life
akoana has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
akoana has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
tyson2 has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
notzmv has joined #commonlisp
igemnace has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
igemnace has joined #commonlisp
livoreno has joined #commonlisp
atgreen has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
atgreen has joined #commonlisp
<jeosol>
phoe: ok, thanks for the info. I'll get to work on it over the next few weeks. What's a typical duration?
<beach>
We have had anything from 20 to 90 minutes.
<beach>
More than 1 hour is a bit too long in my opinion.
<jeosol>
beach: ok, thanks for that. No, I will be shooting for 45 mins max. With last 15 minutes for a demo or something
<beach>
Sounds good.
<jeosol>
I agree, more than 1 hour will be too much. Perhaps if I add some background of my problem space, then 1 hour should be enough with the last section being a demo
<jeosol>
I will plan for 1 hour max
<beach>
Great!
<hayley>
The longest was 81 minutes, and I had felt my own "Techniques and utilities for farming objects on the Net" was too long at 65 minutes.
pranavats has joined #commonlisp
akoana has quit [Quit: leaving]
<jeosol>
hayley: I can't beat that, haha. I am afraid, I may bore them. I will try to strike a good balance. Mine would mostly be an application - use of CL for building the backend service
<jeosol>
lately, I have been trying to improve speed, remove dead code and unnecessary complexity.
lottaquestions has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
atgreen has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
hineios1 has joined #commonlisp
hineios has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
hineios1 is now known as hineios
aeth_ has joined #commonlisp
aeth has quit [Quit: ...]
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
aeth has joined #commonlisp
aeth_ has quit [Quit: ...]
pranavats has left #commonlisp [Error from remote client]
aeth_ has joined #commonlisp
aeth has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
pranavats has joined #commonlisp
pranavats has left #commonlisp [Error from remote client]
aeth has joined #commonlisp
aeth_ has quit [Quit: ...]
masinter has joined #commonlisp
Major_Biscuit has joined #commonlisp
azimut has joined #commonlisp
prokhor_ has joined #commonlisp
ttree has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Cymew has joined #commonlisp
azimut_ has joined #commonlisp
azimut has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
cosimone has joined #commonlisp
igemnace_ has joined #commonlisp
igemnace has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
random-nick has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
<Josh_2>
Good morning COOOO people :sunglasses:
<jackdaniel>
what is a recommended library to parse and generate xml files? cxml? xmls? something else?
shka has joined #commonlisp
Th30n has joined #commonlisp
<jackdaniel>
after brief examination xmls seems like a better fit for my task (mainly because it does not validate)
scymtym has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Brucio-61 has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
mrcom has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
mrcom has joined #commonlisp
igemnace_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Brucio-61 has joined #commonlisp
OlCe has joined #commonlisp
mrcom has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
mrcom has joined #commonlisp
Brucio-61 has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Brucio-61 has joined #commonlisp
mrcom has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
mrcom has joined #commonlisp
mrcom has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
mrcom has joined #commonlisp
Ikarus has joined #commonlisp
<Shinmera>
jackdaniel: I like Plump :)
pranavats has joined #commonlisp
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
prokhor__ has joined #commonlisp
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
prokhor_ has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
rogersm has joined #commonlisp
Spawns_Carpeting has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
notzmv has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
Spawns_Carpeting has joined #commonlisp
<splittist>
chiming in late, but I'm a confirmed plumpist (and the plump-adjacent libraries like lquery)
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
Th30n has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
attila_lendvai has joined #commonlisp
Th30n has joined #commonlisp
tedwing has joined #commonlisp
pillton has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Major_Biscuit has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
scymtym has joined #commonlisp
rodicm has joined #commonlisp
tedwing has quit [Quit: leaving]
igemnace has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
atgreen has joined #commonlisp
causal has quit [Quit: WeeChat 3.5]
yauhsien has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
tyson2 has joined #commonlisp
notzmv has joined #commonlisp
Ikarus has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Oddity has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
pvalenta has left #commonlisp [Leaving]
surabax has joined #commonlisp
Brucio-61 has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
cosimone has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Brucio-61 has joined #commonlisp
rodicm has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
cosimone has joined #commonlisp
cosimone has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
cosimone has joined #commonlisp
cosimone has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
GreaseMonkey has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]
waleee has joined #commonlisp
greaser|q has joined #commonlisp
cosimone has joined #commonlisp
frgo has joined #commonlisp
frgo has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
frgo has joined #commonlisp
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
rodicm has joined #commonlisp
jmdaemon has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
attila_lendvai_ has joined #commonlisp
attila_lendvai has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
Bike has joined #commonlisp
rodicm has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
Bike has quit [Client Quit]
jmes has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
Bike has joined #commonlisp
attila_lendvai_ has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
waleee has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
attila_lendvai has joined #commonlisp
Bike has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Bike has joined #commonlisp
Bike has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Bike has joined #commonlisp
Bike has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Bike has joined #commonlisp
scymtym has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
MajorBiscuit has joined #commonlisp
Brucio-61 has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
azimut_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
azimut has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
yauhsien has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
attila_lendvai has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
attila_lendvai_ has joined #commonlisp
cosimone has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
cosimone has joined #commonlisp
attila_lendvai_ has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
alendvai__ has joined #commonlisp
alendvai__ has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
kpoeck76 has joined #commonlisp
kpoeck76 has quit [Client Quit]
rodicm has joined #commonlisp
attila_lendvai has joined #commonlisp
Th30n has quit [Quit: WeeChat 3.5]
Furor has joined #commonlisp
Colere has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
d4ryus has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
d4ryus has joined #commonlisp
rodicm has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
Cymew has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
Brucio-61 has joined #commonlisp
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
tyson2 has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
Brucio-61 has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
Brucio-61 has joined #commonlisp
cage has joined #commonlisp
livoreno has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
saura has joined #commonlisp
saura has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
attila_lendvai has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
cosimone has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
grawlinson has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
cosimone has joined #commonlisp
vassenn has joined #commonlisp
vassenn has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
nijj has joined #commonlisp
<nijj>
Can I have different versions of quicklisp, and switch as I wish without re-downloading all of of CL systems?
morganw has joined #commonlisp
<nijj>
When I try to pull an older version of quicklisp, I receive the following error: "A dist named "quicklisp" is already installed."
<yitzi>
nijj: not unless you make a completely separate quicklisp folder. Otherwise you probably want qlot.
tyson2 has joined #commonlisp
orestarod has joined #commonlisp
ttree has joined #commonlisp
<nijj>
Got it! That's why qlot shines.. have heard about it for a while. Guess I'd also be benefited with using Roswell too. Do you recommend it?
jeosol has quit [Quit: Client closed]
jeosol has joined #commonlisp
<yitzi>
I have used Roswell in the past, but I don't use it anymore. Its fine, I just don't find it super useful. Then again I don't use qlot either.
karlosz has joined #commonlisp
karlosz has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
karlosz has joined #commonlisp
grawlinson has joined #commonlisp
kpoeck has quit [Quit: Client closed]
<nijj>
Got it.
yauhsien has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
mixotricha has quit [Quit: Client closed]
mon_aaraj has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
mon_aaraj has joined #commonlisp
karlosz has quit [Quit: karlosz]
MajorBiscuit has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
yauhsien has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
<rendar>
can we say that the simple assign `a=b` in lisp is impossible? it should be (= a b), like lisp use prefix operators..
attila_lendvai has joined #commonlisp
<jackdaniel>
(setf a b) ;?
<jackdaniel>
= is a number equality predicate, just as it should be :)
atgreen has quit [Quit: Leaving]
<rendar>
well, yes
<dlowe>
what do you mean by impossible?
<rendar>
dlowe, that the syntax a=b is not contemplated at all
<dlowe>
rendar: it's fairly trivial to write a parser that will take "a=b" and return the form (setf a b)
<rendar>
let me explain: I'm studying both lisp and haskell, and in haskell i can do x=2
<jackdaniel>
you can use an infix notation (nobody uses that though): https://www.cliki.net/infix, and you may create a package with = symbol shadowing cl:=
<jackdaniel>
so if you really want to work against the language, then you can!
<dlowe>
I'm interested in the explanation :p
<rendar>
jackdaniel, oh, that's interesting but too advanced for me, for now
<dlowe>
x=2 defines a constant in Haskell, no?
<rendar>
the truth is i'm designing a very minimal language, and i wish it to be a lisp-like mini lang
<dlowe>
if you're interested in lisp-like languages, you may prefer #lisp instead
<rendar>
dlowe, oh, right thanks
<jackdaniel>
and you want this lisp-like language to work with infix notation (i.e like dylan)?
<rendar>
just to finish the conversation here, then i'll go there: in ObjC you can do x=[something], lisp doesn't contemplate of course x=(someting)
<rendar>
jackdaniel, i'm undecided yet
<rendar>
ObjC takes something from dylan, right/
<jackdaniel>
this is a matter of syntax, I think that you are confusing things
<dlowe>
I think you've missed the fundamental aspect of lisp
X-Scale` has joined #commonlisp
<dlowe>
which is that the lisp language isn't the text tokens
<rendar>
dlowe, enlighten me! i'm here for that
<rendar>
can you elaborate?
<dlowe>
the tokens are turned into data structures of objects in trees of 2-tuples (cons cells), and that's the language
<rendar>
hmm
X-Scale has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
X-Scale` is now known as X-Scale
<dlowe>
so all this fussing about what an expression looks like is really not very interesting. It's whatever you want it to look like, as long as it presents the lisp forms to the compiler properly
<rendar>
the tokens in `(setf a b)` are turned in 2-tuples, ['setf', 'a b'] ?
<dlowe>
(setf . (a . (b . nil)))
<rendar>
oh!
<dlowe>
(setf a b) for short
<rendar>
now i got the key, thanks
<rendar>
so, everything we write in lisp, internally is represented by a tree that has only 2 leaves, for left and right children
<dlowe>
think of it as a structure with a field named car and a field name cdr
<dlowe>
lisps almost all use uniform references, where objects without an intrinsic value are passed and bound by reference.
<rendar>
an intrinsic value?
<dlowe>
numbers, characters, symbols
<rendar>
right
<dlowe>
you can mutate a string to have different contents, but mutating a character means ending up with a different character
<rendar>
but if a node is composed by a tuple, 'setf'.another-node <- in this scenario, nodes are called tuples, how are called elements of the tuple? symbols? so 'setf' is an instrinsic value symbol here
<dlowe>
In this example (setf a b) is a linked list (via cdr slot) containing three symbols (using the car slots)
<rendar>
what is the main *practical* advantage that the entire language will be parsed such as that?
ttree has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
<dlowe>
It means that you can write functions that run during compilation (called macros) that can gracefully generate code based on its arguments.
pseigo has joined #commonlisp
attila_lendvai has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
attila_lendvai has joined #commonlisp
<rendar>
yeah, code which generates other code
<dlowe>
Not just generates. It means that many language features can be added robustly to the syntax.
<rendar>
hmm i think i need a practical example to grasp this, i'm too new
<rendar>
one thing: what we referred to be [node0: 'setf', node1], etc.. is basically the IR (Intermediate Interpretation) of lisp, right?
<dlowe>
No!
<dlowe>
That's the primary representation of lisp
<rendar>
ok
<dlowe>
The parenthesis and text are secondary
<dlowe>
lisp compilers convert lisp to an AST form and then generate an IR internally for codegen
<rendar>
ok, i see now
<dlowe>
One of my favorite macro libraries is positional-lambda, which adds a macro called plambda
<rendar>
why do you like it so much?
<dlowe>
it searches its body for keyword symbols that look like numbers, and generates a function with arguments corresponding to the found symbols
<dlowe>
loke: yeah, well, that's your opinion, man
<rendar>
interesting
<loke>
The problem is that there is no reliable way to do code walking in CL, so it's bound to be unreliable.
<dlowe>
loke: if there's no reliable way then how do we have CL compilers
yauhsien has joined #commonlisp
nijj has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
<dlowe>
anyway, if you are injecting a huge block of code into a plambda form, you are definitely holding it wrong and should be giving it a name. It's very convenient when you just have a short operation.
<jackdaniel>
is it conforming to assume that :1 will be a read as a symbol?