01:13 <Natris1979> wait, even zig isn't on debian. Wow

01:51 <waleee> it's because you can't bootstrap zig without the generated wasm-blob atm, which is a big no-no on debian

01:53 <Natris1979> oh, I see

01:54 <Natris1979> walee: is that wasm like webassembly?? I gotta be thinking of that wrong

01:55 <waleee> nope https://ziglang.org/news/goodbye-cpp/

01:56 <Natris1979> "After ten minutes of puzzled expressions, furrowed brows, and intense questioning..." you said it article

01:57 <waleee> you have the bit about debian under "Moving Forward"

02:01 <Natris1979> huh. I get the reasoning there. But that kinda sucks too

02:02 <Natris1979> now I have to figure out if I want to be principled and switch to sway, or be practical and keep river with it's zig dependency. hmm

02:03 <waleee> installing zig manually is esentially symlinking the static binary to somewhere on your path so not a massive hassle

02:05 <Natris1979> yeah. It's less the hassle and more about trust. But other distros trust that, so why shouldn't I, I suppose

02:23 <Natris1979> oof, gotta go back to river 1.x to build with debian's old version of wlroots :(

02:24 <Natris1979> maybe I should just take the time and effort to get arch running on this new machine

02:32 <waleee> there's a guided interactive script nowadays apparently

02:32 <waleee> *arch-install script

02:42 <Natris1979> oh it's not that. I've done arch installs on my normal machine frequently. But I have a MNT Reform on the way which is a rather bespoke open hardware thing, running on an SOC at it's core, so I was a little worried about getting arch going on it successfully. Peolpe have done it so maybe it'll be fine

09:12 <ifreund> The MNT Reform is very cool! Ive been eyeing it for a long time but its always been a bit too pricey for me

09:19 <Guest3> Looks interesting! I think the trackball is a little bit weird but interesting concept nonetheless

09:21 <ifreund> I personally think the trackball looks awesome, there's a trackpad option as well iirc anyways :D

09:22 <Guest3> the glas buttons look nice I admit

09:50 <ifreund> leon-p: yeah, I also wish for a non text-based status bar with a nice graphical cpu load display and whatnot

09:50 <ifreund> someday I'll write one once river's done xD

10:01 <novakane> ifreund: so what's your thoughts on chimera linux for now ? Your daily using it or not yet ?

10:14 <ifreund> novakane: yep, don't have any other linux distros on my machines any more.

10:15 <ifreund> It does require flatpak for proprietary shit like REAPER or spotify or steam of course, but it isn't bad to have those sandboxed even if I find flatpak itself quite distasteful

10:18 <ifreund> anyhow, dinit is great and I love not having to mess with as much config to get the things I care about working compared to void

10:19 <novakane> ifreund: oh cool, you don't encounter too much problems in daily use? I really need to try it

10:19 <novakane> I'm already use a lot of flatpak with musl anyway

10:19 <ifreund> running pipewire properly just happens out of the box on chimera for example, not so on void

10:20 <ifreund> novakane: if you're already running void musl I don't think chimera would be a big change in terms of software compatibility

10:20 <ifreund> the biggest downside currently is probably the fairly young package repositories though they are constantly gaining new stuff as users add what they need

10:21 <ifreund> the packaging tooling is really good too, python is so much better than bash

10:25 <novakane> alright you convinced me, I need to take some time to finally install it :P

10:42 <leon-p> flatpak is arguably the least distasteful in that niche

10:44 <ifreund> leon-p: they are adding paid apps lol

10:44 <leon-p> never mind...

10:45 <leon-p> still, the other two "solutions" to this "problem" are either partly proprietary or developed by someone who write multi-paragraph anti-wayland rants in github gists

10:46 <ifreund> yeah, I don't think it would be that hard to set up an arch linux chroot or similar if I need to drop flatpak at some point

13:40 <adamcstephens> the first laptop i spent a lot of time on had a trackball as its only pointer. it was actually pretty nice

13:42 <adamcstephens> https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F6y4dld7efvv41.jpg

13:43 <adamcstephens> that may date me a bit ;)

13:48 <leon-p> That's a nice one

13:49 <leon-p> trackballs do live on. I have a kensington one and it's really great

13:50 <ifreund> looks like a great keyboard too :)

16:47 <lordmzte> Just switched to river today, hopefully permanently!

16:47 <lordmzte> I've made a configuration in Zig :D

16:48 <LarstiQ> lordmzte: what does that look like?

16:49 <lordmzte> It acts both as a wrapper around river to set some environment variables and is also symlinked to ~/.config/river/init. There, it will connect to the wayland socket and run commands via the control protcol.

16:50 <lordmzte> I was getting a little bothered by the fact that a typical init script in shell opens a new connection to the wayland socket on every command.

16:50 <lordmzte> Here's the file that actually does all the work: https://git.mzte.de/LordMZTE/dotfiles/src/branch/master/scripts/mzteriver/src/init.zig

16:51 <lordmzte> All the code for connecting etc isn't all that bad, it's in the other files in that directory.

16:51 <LarstiQ> right, that's part of riverguile's reason for the control protocol too I think

16:52 <lordmzte> Neat! I prefer writing everything myself though.

16:52 <lordmzte> I'll probably write my own layout generator some day as well.

16:52 <LarstiQ> lordmzte: surely you draw the line _somewhere_ :)

16:52 <lordmzte> I'm currently working on a GUI engine which should also be flexible enough to turn into a layout generator

16:52 <LarstiQ> https://git.sr.ht/~leon_plickat/riverguile/ fwiw

16:53 <LarstiQ> lordmzte: code looks pretty nice indeed

16:53 <lordmzte> LarstiQ: You might think so, but I also configure my neovim in zig.... which is very much not intended. My dotfiles contain 7300 lines of zig.

16:57 <lordmzte> Is there anything new in the master version of river that isn't in the current release?

17:25 <lordmzte> I have 3 monitors arranged in a horizontal row, when I run the river command `focus-output next`, that focuses the output to the LEFT of the current one, although I would've expected it to focus the one on the right. The docs also don't seem very clear about what exactly "next" and "previous" do here. Could someone elaborate?

17:42 <tiosgz> lordmzte: there's a lot of stuff on master compared to 0.2

17:42 <tiosgz> wrt outputs, next/previous refers to the order in which river gets to know about them

17:43 <lordmzte> such as? I like to follow master versions of things, just wanted to know what I was missing out on right now.

17:43 <tiosgz> iirc there're also directional keywords on master

17:43 <tiosgz> maybe you better check the log, cos it really is a lot

17:44 <lordmzte> so I can't change the order there? alright. if i were to use `focus-output right/left`, would there be a way to get to vertically arranged outputs if there are any, or would that be impossible?

17:44 <lordmzte> directional keywords?

17:44 <tiosgz> directional == left/right/top/bottom or something like that

17:45 <tiosgz> or do they already exist on 0.2? i really don't know

17:45 <lordmzte> those are already used for a few commands in 0.2 if that's what you mean.

17:46 <tiosgz> well anyway i neither use these nor know the code, so your best bet is to inspect it yourself (or wait for someone who does know)

17:54 <lordmzte> I see, I'll probably update to master tomorrow.

17:56 <lordmzte> What about the problem with the output switching? I'd like to have some more consistent behavior than what I'm getting with next/previous, while also being able to reach vertically aligned monitors with the same keys.

18:53 <lordmzte> Is the `river-git` AUR package broken? It still invokes `zig` 0.10-style.

19:25 <lordmzte> I just had a lot of fun debugging an issue where xdg-desktop-portal-wlr would crash when attempting a screenshare thanks to nvidia. I had to apply the patch in this issue to fix it: https://github.com/emersion/xdg-desktop-portal-wlr/issues/190#issuecomment-1144287165 Is there something we could do in river about this?

22:23 <ifreund> I dont think so, that patch is not really a solution, just a hack

22:24 <ifreund> probably its nvidias fault, if not the relevant code is all in wlroots and xdpw