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<gog>
you have no idea how quickly i reverted that to full width
<gog>
icon tasks are good tho
<gog>
that was the one change in taskbars that i liked
<gog>
everything else is perfect the way it is
<zid>
I hear you can't ungroup on w11
<zid>
so I refuse to install it
<gog>
i've never tried to
<gog>
but that's valid
<gog>
and i support you
<heat>
i like the icons
<heat>
im relatively tidy in the desktop anyway so
<gog>
i don't even look at my desktop icons ever
<bl4ckb0ne>
is simpleton a design pattern somewhat close to the singleton?
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<gog>
idk but it must be the one god followed for me HA
* gog
sobs
* bl4ckb0ne
pats gog
* gog
prr
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<heat>
im bacc on operating systems development baybeeeeeee
<heat>
yesterday i started a ck3 tuscony/italy campaign but man crusader kings is so laborious to play until you get primogeniture
<heat>
my heir is even the only non-genius (tbf, quick) child
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<bl4ckb0ne>
is he going to be a singleton
<heat>
no cuz then my dinasty is fucked
<heat>
i had like 8 children tho
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<GreaseMonkey>
finally doing something on-topic for this channel, currently making a 32-bit x86 kernel in Zig and i have one complaint: @ptrFromInt(&some_thing) isn't available at comptime
<GreaseMonkey>
anyway, making use of qemu's multiboot 1 support
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<sham1>
Well of course, some_thing probably doesn't have a pointer at that point yet
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<mjg>
any nerds on the channel
<mjg>
what's a modern day console mua
<Mutabah>
`alpine`?
<Mutabah>
Not exactly modern, but it's what I use when I need one
<mjg>
brah
<mjg>
are you larping beeing a boomer?
<mjg>
i tried neomutt, but despite being kind of active in development it keeps using obsolete stuff
<mjg>
kind of a bsd of muas
<Mutabah>
No... but then again, I use screen+irssi
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<mjg>
you are mentally a boomer mate
<mjg>
even most diehards ditched screen for tmux
<mjg>
i do use irssi, but it's mostly because i can't be arsed to learn anything else
<mjg>
i tried weechat but it had some annoying differnces i could not be bothered to even up
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<sham1>
GNU Screen is GPL and GNU while tmux is OpenBSD and thus pessimal. The choice is clear
<mjg>
shit all you want, user-facing openbsd is pretty decent
<froggey>
asking for a "console mua" and calling people boomers lol
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<mjg>
hey it's the lisp guy
<froggey>
*gal
<froggey>
sup
<mjg>
oh?
<mjg>
apologies
<froggey>
np
<mjg>
look mate, boomer is the /old/ stuff
<mjg>
today even genz recognizes usefulness of cli
<froggey>
old stuff like email?
<mjg>
i mean of all companies microsoft released powershell
<mjg>
that should tell you something
<mjg>
i know, e-mail is for password recovery
<mjg>
and spam
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<sham1>
And git patches
<mjg>
so i hear you can somehow *commit* through github webpage(???)
<mjg>
that is one genz idea if i ever heard one
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* gog
hands froggey a bagel
<GreaseMonkey>
does anyone have any clue whatsoever on how to make an always 32-bit-wide jump in at&t syntax on the LLVM assembler
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<GeDaMo>
Try putting {disp32} before the jump instruction
<zid>
I use C99 if I feel the code is improved by designated initializers
<zid>
and C11 if I want anonymous unions
<zid>
but otherwise stick to C89
<mcrod>
for what it's worth, MISRA also recommends avoiding VLAs last I remember
<mcrod>
some of the rules are pretty questionable, but overall it's not a bad guideline
<mcrod>
C99 is useful because variadic macros, otherwise you have to do ugly things
<mcrod>
e.g., maybe you have a macro like ZID_LOG_INFO("SNDLSNDLFN %s %s", gravelord, nito);
<zid>
C89 has variadic macros
<mcrod>
no it doesn't
<zid>
oh
<mcrod>
go try to use (...) or __VA_ARGS__ in C89 in a macro
<zid>
til
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<zid>
I tend to just use gnu mode, rather than locking myself to C89, so I've not ran across it, and forgor
<gog>
C23
<gog>
get with the times
<zid>
C23 adds nothing I give a shit about, as usual
<zid>
"Let's break realloc" was an interesting call
<nortti>
isn't that because there are existing implementations that do two different incompatible things on that, and nobody wanted to change how they do it?
<zid>
It has some okay stuff, that we needed in C99, but it's too late now and we're all using workarounds for the absence for 40 years
<zid>
like, a lot of it is just.. useless
<zid>
great, C23 has [[]] to implement __attribute__ with
<zid>
only gnu is going to be a working C23 compiler *anyway*
<zid>
msvc will still need different codepaths
<zid>
so it just changes the #define NORETURN __attribute__((noreturn)) to #define NORETURN [[noreturn]] in the #ifdef GCC
<zid>
and the majority of C23 is stuff like this
<zid>
strdup is now C23, great, I was doing #ifdef strdup void strdup() anyway for windows, so.. nothing changes again
<nortti>
don't modern MSVC do C11? that gives you _Noreturn
<zid>
see!
<zid>
#ifdef MSVC NORETURN _Noreturn
<nortti>
or, you know
<zid>
the C23 change is irrelevent
<nortti>
#include <stdnoreturn.h>
<nortti>
noreturn
<zid>
what the fuck is that
<nortti>
C11 standard way to get the keyword "noreturn"
<zid>
no way
<mcrod>
i feel like we just killed zid
<zid>
I ignored most of C11 like I ignored most of C23, so it's possible he isn't lying, I guess?
<nortti>
zid: also, you can nowadays use "inline" too, you don't need to use __attribute__((inline))
<zid>
hmm?
<nortti>
teasing you a bit on how you're seemingly still using hacks that have been obsolete for years, because you never bothered to look at what compilers support now
<zid>
inline is C99
<nortti>
indeed, the joke is me implying you'd not know that
<zid>
nortti: bro, until literally a couple of years ago, msvc did not support any C99
<nortti>
I still doesnt'
<nortti>
*n't
<zid>
I heard they added C99 support, idk how *much* C99 support
<nortti>
no, it has C11 support
<sham1>
Just compile with clang, brah
<nortti>
code that's C11 compatible C99 can be compiled with that, but aiui there is no C99 support per se
<zid>
Anyway, back to stdnoreturn.h
<mcrod>
msvc is garbage anyway
<zid>
that's now deprecated, and [[]] supports more than just noreturn
<mcrod>
hard to believe that game developers use it
<zid>
so my original point is fine still
<mcrod>
it's just not something I understand
<zid>
This is like, the government is hands-off on industry for 40 years, all the businesses sort of vaguely standardize on a certain width of rail gauge
<zid>
then the government pops up out of nowhere and says "Oh yea, it's this other gauage nobody has ever used now, gl"
<zid>
Which both has obvious problems, and also happened in reality many times.
<zid>
:D
<sham1>
WG14 does weird decisions for C++ compatibility, yes
<zid>
Like, I don't wanna get into a chrome situation where the standard is "whatever gnu (google) says it is"
<sham1>
#c has more than enough material to rant about that stuff
<zid>
but they're *definitely* coming in too-late and it's very disruptive and bad
<zid>
compared to the rough consensus we already had
<zid>
This shit needed to happen 20 years ago
<mcrod>
i'm just a little appalled at how programming is going anyway
<zid>
We still don't have very basic things we've been macroing badly for 40 years, like length of an array, or endian of the host
<nortti>
recently rewatched the birth and death of javascript, and it's kinda funny how it predicted everything moving into the browser, whereas in the real world around the same time we started shipping just N copies of chrome and doing desktop apps with the tooling
<zid>
yea, chrome is just becoming the OS
<zid>
it has a printer spooler, windowing toolkit, event timers, etc etc
<zid>
process isolation, audio mixing
<zid>
accelerated 3d graphics
<zid>
javascript basically turning into windows 95 level winapi
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asymptotically_ is now known as asymptotically
<sham1>
Except worse
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<sham1>
Didn't think that would be possible, but I suppose that if you have enough Google money and Netscape's magic dust, you can do anything
<zid>
the future of computing is "chrome" and "javascript"
<zid>
those are your two options for writing software
<zid>
chrome developer, javascript developer
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<sham1>
Hey hey now, you also have HTML developers and CSS developers