<church__>
InPhase: they perfectly understand that. But they need reason for more lock-in, and "security" often helps being such reason. They just got unlucky with customers having a bit more clue and being vocal about this :)
<church__>
And even though most customers of bambu are not too tech savvy and might not notice easily issues brought by change, they also are easily influenced by more experienced people views, and almost no-one from those stayed quiet about it :)
<InPhase>
church__: Which was the most predictable thing in the world here... The company also showed enough community savviness starting out to have had the ability to predict this.
<InPhase>
So I remain baffled as to how they went from point A to point B. Maybe they just figure it's worth it, don't care if they anger the informed hobbyists, and figured they'd just do their best to cover it with a PR attempt. But that sure seems like an unwise move.
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<church__>
InPhase: decision probably was made my not some engineers but from marketoids/higherups, that didn't picture well backlash. LOL, but they probably started to understand mess they got into when 95% of influencers started posting articles/videos with lines "i won't be buying any more BL printers and so shouldn't you" :). after that some weak PR damage control, but in general i suspect that their future sale prospects by this are halved
<church__>
it won't kill business, after all, BL chose well target customer of casual home user that wants headache free print, not tinkering, and many of those are ok even with "locked down iphone with no 3rd party apps and no extra functionality by them"
<church__>
but large share of printfarms and more tech savy users may move on, especially as many successful design bits and even better pricing now is not rarity among competitors. BL became less "sufficient overall choice worth staying brand-loyal for and pay premium"
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<teepee>
is it in upstream mxe yet?
<guso78k>
doubt so. however manually adding it into ~/openscad_deps/mxe/src has greatly helped me to redo the MXE dependencies.
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<teepee>
sure, we can do that, it would be nicer to reduce the differences, but that takes more effort
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<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
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<church__>
hmm, text()'s length is measurable in simple way?
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<InPhase>
church__: I can't imagine it being engineer originating. "Let's make it innovatively rely on an authentication cloud service" is typically the sort of thing that comes from higher ups who are trying to direct business direction.
<InPhase>
church__: I do suspect they will still be able to find a market segment to market to. But they just hard-turned from a top recommended brand to a "do not buy" from most of the trusted people who are out there recommending things. Which is going to make marketing their stuff a whole lot harder, and more restricted. It seems to me like throwing money away.
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<InPhase>
As I see it, if you let customers tinker with your stuff, it becomes highly recommended by experts, and then tons of normals buy it, and the vast majority won't tinker and you can sell them whatever value-adds for convenience that you want. But if you lock your stuff down, you lose those recommendations, and you are stuck squeezing a smaller market share for profit.
<InPhase>
Variations of these two patterns have repeated over and over again in the tech industry.
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<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
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<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
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<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal edited pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
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<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
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<stealth_>
does openscad not have spellchecker?
<stealth_>
It would also be nice if OpenScad would change preview depending on which open file you select.
<ali1234>
i would like the opposite: lock the preview to a specific file for when i am editing an include
<stealth_>
maybe "Automatic Switch Preview" option would be nice, accounts for both cases.
<gbruno>
[github] kintel pushed 2 modifications (Apply script/beautify.sh (#5643) A previous PR that was merged before was not having its code source clean with the script. This make the code generating much more conflicts that it should. So apply the beautify.sh script now.) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/commit/dd7286bf8321acfda1fca39b3b951800efbb66aa
<buZz>
amazed a aliexpress item would come with such drawings , nice
<buZz>
but its utter shit
<buZz>
:D
<buZz>
for starters , it doesnt match the device they currently sell, maybe a newer revision
<buZz>
but also superdumb stuff, like mixing metric and imperial , without any signifier
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<gbruno>
[github] damienmarchal synchronize pull request #5630 ([UX] Add of the "Jump to..." navigation method and clean the "Window" menu of its duplicated elements) https://github.com/openscad/openscad/pull/5630
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<pa>
InPhase, any genai more competent at OpenSCAD?
<InPhase>
Not to my knowledge.
<pa>
i suppose not that much to train from
<InPhase>
All chaos and failures of different flavors.
<InPhase>
The chaos and failures are gradually improving though. Syntax is more right than it used to be early on.
<pa>
right, and then openscad is in fact pretty error prone
<pa>
i suppose genai could easily make a mess
<InPhase>
Designs that render or almost render are slightly closer to a valid shape, rather than total spatial randomness. As if there's a whiff of thought behind it now.
<InPhase>
Nothing though seems to be even in the ballpark of usable.
<teepee>
try a dice, placing the numbers on the faces seems almost impossible
<pa>
actually being able to produce sensible openscad should be a valid metric for these models
<InPhase>
pa: Yeah. I was saying the other day that if we wanted the models to be good at it, we should just create and distribute a scoring metric for models that relies on their openscad ability as a proxy for spatial reasoning, and try to get model evaluators to use it. :)
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<ashafq>
Does OpenSCAD rendering need optimization? I can probably offer some help.
<teepee>
I suppose that would need some more details
<teepee>
rendering is also a bit overloaded as term in openscad
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<ashafq>
rendering the model to STL, which seems slow for some reason.
<ashafq>
I can probably take a crack at it using the GPU or something.
<teepee>
a) check nightly version -> enable "Manifold"
<stealth_>
ashafq, what version of openscad are you using? cause it might already be fixed
<teepee>
b) that engine is a separate project, but you could talk to pca006132 here
<teepee>
they dropped CUDA support as it did not help performance wise
<ashafq>
stealth_: 2021.01... why is flatpak version so old?
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<teepee>
because that's the last release version, flatpak beta is very recent
<stealth_>
ashafq, that explains it, there isn't an official new release yet (soon). you can get the latest version as teepee mentioned.
<ubuntourist>
Where can I find documentation on what new features are available in the nightly build? And how to use them?
<teepee>
ubuntourist: well, I was just typing a reply for the mailing list :P
<ashafq>
stealth_: Thank you very much! Btw, I like all sort of optimizing tasks. So if you need some volunteer, let me know. :)
<ashafq>
I will test out the nightly version as well.
<ubuntourist>
teepee, Ah. Thanks. I'll wait for it there. ;)
<teepee>
ashafq: there are likely many places that could use a good look
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<kintel>
ashafq I think the main driver for contribution (apart from motivation) is what your skillset is. I feel like most optimization opportunities in OpenSCAD are relatively involved projects, but there are probably some pockets of opportunities here and there, mostly for specific scenarios, but I don't have a list handy right now
<InPhase>
ashafq: There's a low hanging fruit of optimization that I tried to get started on way back, but then got so distracted that the brief start I had on that is basically just trash by this point.
<InPhase>
Let's see if I can find that issue.
<teepee>
ahh, good old recompute on library calls?
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<InPhase>
teepee: lol, yeah.
<InPhase>
There we go. It was so far back it was hard to find.
<InPhase>
ashafq: The solution is simple... We reprocess things on the use<> call, and then do not use anything reprocessed!
<InPhase>
ashafq: So the answer is stop doing that. ;)
<InPhase>
ashafq: In some cases it's inconsequential. In other cases the performance difference is staggering.
<InPhase>
ashafq: This is actually a serious issue, despite laying dormant for 10 years. BOSL2 for example ended up restructuring the entire library to make use of "include" instead of "use" because of this issue, even though "use" would have been much cleaner and more efficient, because they could not get comparable performance with use as the library expanded.
<InPhase>
ashafq: It was made trivial to fix after restructuring about 4 years ago, but no one has taken the second step of tracking down where this happens and turning off the massive wasted time, and then testing to make sure nothing is broken.
<ashafq>
stealth_: Thanks I will take a look at the open issues.
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<InPhase>
ashafq: In general I think it's a good plan to start with an issue around that difficulty level for someone experienced with C++ but new to the project. It's a bite-sized bit to chew on and easy to finish up, but you'll get some familiarity with project internals while doing it. That'll set you up better for subsequent stuff. :)
<ashafq>
InPhase: Thanks for sharing. I did a lot of audio and HPC work. That's why I thought I look into openscad, since I have been increasingly using the program.
<InPhase>
And the issue has a simple success/fail testcase that I added for the problem some time back.
<teepee>
for classic 3d printing, or one of those awesome crazy other use cases?
<teepee>
I think the best so far is printing sheets controlling a knitting machine :)
<ashafq>
teepee: for 3D printing, mainly.
<InPhase>
teepee: Heh. gcode for audio is fun, but trying to use OpenSCAD to do audio would be an interesting challenge.
<ashafq>
teepee: I also sometimes use it as a graphing calculator.
* InPhase
ponders.
<teepee>
cool, that still seems to be the biggest share by far
<teepee>
knitting?
<ashafq>
yea, I don't know how I will use openscad for audio. an interesting problem tho.
<InPhase>
That function plotter library is dated, and needs to be updated to use function literals... But still works!
<ashafq>
One thing I may want to ask for is probably sinPi and cosPi function. sin(PI) yields 1.0e-17 or something like that since IEEE754 can't really encode M_PI.
<ashafq>
But, it's probably OK. :)
<teepee>
?
<teepee>
OpenSCAD does degrees
<teepee>
with some special checks for things like 90 deg to not do that floating point thing
<ashafq>
oh ooops :)
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<teepee>
:)
<InPhase>
ashafq: I have an unpublished trig library for the others: https://bpa.st/FTHA
<InPhase>
mini-library
<buZz>
eh, am i tripping balls, everytime i try to use<> or include<> a file thats in the same directory, i get WARNING: Can't open library
<InPhase>
buZz: Which are you failing with, snap or flatpak?
<buZz>
debian nightly
<InPhase>
buZz: Is this a new error for you?
<buZz>
do i need to give it the full path? :)
<InPhase>
No, it should search the file's directory...
<buZz>
WARNING: Can't open library '"/home/buzz/openscad/powerbank-pcb.scad"'. in file powerbank-v2.scad, line 8
<buZz>
not even that works
<buZz>
oh
<buZz>
should i drop the ""
<buZz>
:)
<InPhase>
Oh. :)
<buZz>
derp :)
<teepee>
yep, too-many-quotes-error
<InPhase>
""off by one"" error.
<InPhase>
Which I guess would be off by two, but that seems appropriately mislabeled.