<ixelp>
Daniel Jay Haskin: "Udate on the 2024 Common Lisp Community Survey: …" - Universeodon Social Media
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<beach>
skin: That page is very confusing to me. I don't see the results of the survey, and clickable links seem to be to the survey form to fill in and to some other unrelated stuff.
<beach>
Or I can create an account on something I don't want.
<skin>
I'm sorry to hear that
<skin>
page was designed to be useful to those who had a Google account and also to those who didn't
<skin>
if you didn't have a Google account you can send me an email using the instructions at that page.
<skin>
that is the page to fill out the survey not the results of the survey. the results will come out in August
<beach>
Oh, OK. I took "Update on the community survey" to mean the results so far.
<beach>
That explains it all. Thanks.
<skin>
sure
<skin>
well I'm here, I'm trying to find more places to announce the survey on. do you know of any important mailing lists I should consult?
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<beach>
The only one I know of is the Lisp Pro list that is somewhat active in bursts from time to time.
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<ixelp>
GitHub - sharplispers/clx: a fork of crhodes' fork of danb's fork of the CLX library, an X11 client for Common Lisp
<beach>
Yes, it is worked on from time to time.
<beach>
By jackdaniel for instance. But he is not very present right now.
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<beach>
rainthree: Is there a problem?
<rainthree>
adding #+windows(setf timeout 1) before this line https://github.com/sharplispers/clx/blob/master/input.lisp#L1024 "fixes" the CLX CPU high usage bug on Windows. (But when quickly clicking on mcclim presentations that change views for example, the cpu still goes a bit high and it takes 2-3 seconds until the view is changed the 2nd time. Only the 1st click is quick. After that, cpu usage again drops down and the next click on presentations will be
<rainthree>
quick)
<ixelp>
clx/input.lisp at master · sharplispers/clx · GitHub
<rainthree>
also it seems to me that the form (unless (symbol-value current-event-symbol) ...) at line 1014 in the above link doesn't respect the LUV slides
<beach>
Right, SYMBOL-VALUE does not return a Boolean.
<Th30n>
Morning all! For what it's worth, I've tried cl-csv yesterday on my ~60MB file... and only counting the rows is slower than doing it in Python :(
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<beach>
It seems you have found yourself a project to work on.
<beach>
Could it be that "doing it in Python" is not really doing it in Python, but in C code?
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<Th30n>
Lemme check
<Th30n>
IT
<Th30n>
It's the standard csv module, partly written in C.
<Th30n>
Time to beat C with CL :)
<ecraven>
aren't all Python modules at least partly written in C? :P :D
<beach>
Yes, good luck!
<Th30n>
The file parsing is in C, the higher level dict building of the parsed row is in Python.
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<mrcom>
Category: Is this Really Helpful? CLHS "TYPEP" : type-specifier---any type specifier except values, or a type specifier list whose first element is either function or values.
<bike>
what ar eyou asking about the helpfulness of
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<mrcom>
I'm just complaining about the sins of the fathers.
<mrcom>
Not an earth-shattering problem.
<mrcom>
When it comes to the type-definitions spectrum "it's a hint for compiler optimization" vs. "it's a *spec*!", I'm definitely a radical "spec" person.
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<bike>
it's definitely pretty messy. if i recall correctly, it's not totally clear whether function types are even contravariant in parameters like they oughta be
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<dlowe>
mrcom: Have you looked at coalton?
<dlowe>
the common lisp type system promises much and delivers little
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<mrcom>
Dlowe: No I haven't...
<dlowe>
mrcom: it might be kind of what you're looking for
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<ldb>
I have a question regarding NaN, should (zerop 1d+-0) raise floting point exception?
<mrcom>
"Let a thousand flowers bloom, but only if properly permitted, in the assigned staging areas, and cllassified by species and cultivar."
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<bike>
ldb: IEEE 754 says that qNaN == 0 is just false.
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<ldb>
bike: it does allow the compare to set exception flag, no?
<ldb>
it is a strange setting for common lisp raise exception for nan
<yitzi>
You are using a quiet nan, not a signaling nan.
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<ldb>
so I'm afraid Clozure CL is using compareSignalingEqual
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<ldb>
unfortunately I don't know much x86 assembly, failed to find why the excepption is raised
<yitzi>
So are you expecting it to raise an exception or not? I am confused.
<ldb>
The origin of problem is (the double-float 1d+-0) raise the FLOATING-POINT-INVALID-OPERATION because it ended up calling (not (and (floatp m) (zerop m))) on the value
<ldb>
A easy fix would be use ccl::nan-or-infinity-p to protect it from raising exception, but I think it would be an abstration leak and curious should zerop raise invalid-operation to nan at all
<yitzi>
I tested on SBCL and it seems to respect quiet versus signaling NaN. CCL's 1e+-0 is a quiet NaN. I manually made a signaling NaN and CCL signaled an exception for both the quiet NaN and the signaling NaN. So it looks like they don't pay attention to the "quiet" bit.
<ldb>
Then to be able to fix that, it needs some digs into the assembler
<yitzi>
nan-or-infinity doesn't distinguish between quiet and signaling nans.
<ldb>
yitzi: that is right, but that gives excpected since signaling nan should also been able to be declared type using THE
<yitzi>
Where do you see that CCL detects the difference between quiet NaN and signaling? I haven't seen that in CCL yet.
<ldb>
I'm afraid CCL does not handle the quiet nan concept, and just respects x86 floating point behavior
<yitzi>
Yes, that is what I said earlier.
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<ldb>
The ccl::nan-or-infinity-p uses (eq 2047 (%double-float-exp n)) which just tests the exponent
<dlowe>
who
<dlowe>
oops. mischan
<yitzi>
ldb: To determine NaN or infinity that is the only check needed.
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<mwnaylor>
Is there a tutorial or set of guidelines for using the defpackage macro?
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<mwnaylor>
I have bookmarked the url.
<mwnaylor>
I managed to get a simple defpackage form to work. I may have fouled things up when trying to implement a (:shadow …) form.
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<dlowe>
shadowing symbols: almost never worth it
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<mwnaylor>
If no shadow, then ignore warnings of duplicate symbols?
<dlowe>
I tend to not :use anything but the common-lisp package
<dlowe>
ymmv
<mwnaylor>
If you need something, then you import explicitly?
<mwnaylor>
Or use fully qualified names?
<bike>
local nicknames, usually
<bike>
so qualified, but with pretty short qualifiers
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<dlowe>
even before local nicknames I would qualify them if they were short enough
<mwnaylor>
Do knicknames apply to the whole package or to individual symbols within a package?
<dlowe>
although something syntax-y like & might be annoying
<dlowe>
nicknames are a property of a package
<dlowe>
local-nicknames are a property of a package, where when that package is *package*, the reader will use the nicknames to refer to another package
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<aeth>
I :use my own utility library, because I design it that way, but nobody other than me can probably safely use it.
<aeth>
Because names conflict all of the time for everything, you can't even use both alexandria and uiop
<aeth>
but ime if you really want to, you can USE one thing other than CL without issues... two and you start to run into name clashes on anything large enough
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