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<alekksander>
so im trying to setup armbian focal on hc4. first thing i noticed it that armbian-config firmware update is likely broke, as typing update and upgrade commands found new packet versions
<alekksander>
second, despite installing „default” (desktop plus browser and extras) xfce environment is not started automatically, but rather i'm left with terminal. start xfce4 does nothing. likely xfce wasn't installed at all
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<alekksander>
i'd love to provide some background logs, but the noob inside me is still too powerful to overcome
<alekksander>
now after reboot lightdm couldn't start. i think it's reconfiguring packages (again)
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<alekksander>
yes, it reconfigured. after that all worked fine and booted to ubuntu automatically. and wow, how fast!
<alekksander>
i also removed that petitboot. it was definitively a good decision to get rid of it.
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<alekksander>
same on bullseye. it fails to start lightdm
<archetech>
whats the error
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<alekksander>
i reinstalled desktop from armbian-config second time and now it worked. can't get that error anymore
<archetech>
next!
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<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> alekksander: support for what you will do as a user, can't help. lxde is not our work
<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> we are sure premade XFCE works well. Others are already questionable.
<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> bullseye itself is full of bugs, which we can't fix
<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> full is perhaps overrated, but ... you can easily bump into them. We have plent of work elsewhere - to make hardware, that is otherwise not working well, operational
<Armbian-Discord>
<IgorPec> lanefu: how much work is with that ?
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<alekksander>
so what's best to use, focal or bullseye?
<alekksander>
by the way i wasn't trying toinstall lxqt. i'm good with xfce. described problems were regarding default xfce installation
<alekksander>
focal seems more mature, but isn't it more bloated?
<Werner>
Not really. cloud-init can be removed and snap isn't even included by default IIRC
<IgorPec>
default XFCE is downloading prepared desktop image
<IgorPec>
install from CLI could have issues
<IgorPec>
Focal. Bloated with what?
<c0rnelius>
I think headless they aren't much different than each other. Desktop wise though Focal and Ubuntu in general is a bloat machine.
<IgorPec>
we assemble them from sources and packages
<IgorPec>
both (Debian and Ubuntu) are more or less identical
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<IgorPec>
there should be nothing Ubuntu specific in those assemblies
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<c0rnelius>
The Ubuntu firmware package alone is something like 600MB installed? Debian though breaks the firmware into bits making for a less bloated install. Just talking basics across archs.
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<IgorPec>
we have small and big firmware package, small is default
<c0rnelius>
IgorPec: I'm just talking in general terms.
<IgorPec>
tl; dr; it is really unnecesary to be affraid from Ubuntu when Armbian is in control ;)
<c0rnelius>
and then there are stupid snaps which suck calls :)
<c0rnelius>
balls*
<IgorPec>
snapd is disabled by default
<c0rnelius>
Thats good
<IgorPec>
yeah. we are very much aware of Ubuntu junk and we don't like it ... but more matured packages from ubuntu are something good to use, better then Debian. that's why
<c0rnelius>
I agree. I have Ubuntu installed on a few arm boxes. For me its a use case thing. One problem with Bullseye is they dropped python2 for the most part, which kinda sucks if you use some related python stuff.
<IgorPec>
next ubuntu will probably also drop it
<c0rnelius>
Next LTS they will.
<IgorPec>
yes
<c0rnelius>
They might have even done so with Impish? I haven't checked though.
<IgorPec>
me neither. not much relevant for what i do
<c0rnelius>
Yeah Impish seems pointless. They should have just extended the EOL of Hirsute.
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<steev>
python2 went EOL in 2020. of course it was dropped in bullseye.
<steev>
if you haven't updated your python2 to python3 script in the almost 2 years since EOL, that's on you... or whatever shitty dev is still using python2
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<c0rnelius>
Unfortunately I'm not a python dev. I can edit basic code, but yeah. That's as far as it goes. Doesn't change the fact it sucks :)
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<steev>
well that's what happens when stuff goes EOL
<c0rnelius>
One of the problems with python. They change so much shit that the old code base isn't compatible with the new. I also found not everything was actually moved to python3? So that left me scratching my head a little.
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<c0rnelius>
In the end its left to just search for other solutions.
<c0rnelius>
Screw python :) basically
<c0rnelius>
These damn pesky python devs not keeping with stuff.
<c0rnelius>
keeping up*
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<BeachyHead>
Hi All, can someone explain to me the consequences of the helios64 being a CSC board. I understand that it is not officially supported anymore. I just want to understand how long i can operate my helios64 relatively safe without being too worried about having an outdated piece of hardware/software in my network.
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<Armbian-Discord>
<NeonFetch> Does helios use mainline or legacy kernel?
<Armbian-Discord>
<NeonFetch> There is at least one build with legacy kernel. Maybe that will work great forever? Or maybe mainline but freezing any kernel upgrade will do the trick??
<Armbian-Discord>
<NeonFetch> @lanefu
<Armbian-Discord>
<NeonFetch> I would use the second option
<Armbian-Discord>
<NeonFetch> Mainline, with freezed updates (its an option on armbian-config)
<BeachyHead>
I just upgraded a few weeks ago and i am on mainline rockchip 64 build with the 5.10.63kernel. :-) For sure i can freeze the kernel updates for some time
<steev>
c0rnelius: in python2 developer's defense... the announcement that python2 was going EOL happened in 2008, so they really haven't had a lot of time to move their code bases to python3
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<c0rnelius>
steev: I'm gonna assume that's sarcasm? Anyway, I only had one personal project in which I only really used for myself. When bullseye came out I looked into modding the python code and found in the end that the whole of python2 wasn't actually completely moved to python3. So yeah... Lucky for me Focal still supports both.
<steev>
yes it's sarcasm. developers have had *12* years to update their shit, and if they still haven't.....
<c0rnelius>
Yeah I agree. Kinda garbage on their part.
<steev>
just a wee bit
<c0rnelius>
By the way I updated the NEO Plus2 bluetooth patches for 5.10. If ur still stuck on that and wanna try it. I haven't tested it my self, but I see no reason it wouldn't work? Its really just an adjustment of the dts, the rest still stands the same.
<steev>
i'm trying to find some free time to do that :)
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