Tartarus changed the topic of #u-boot to: SOURCE MOVED TO https://source.denx.de/u-boot/u-boot.git / U-Boot v2023.10, v2024.01-rc2 are OUT / Merge Window is CLOSED, next branch is OPEN / Release v2024.01 is scheduled for 08 January 2024 / Channel archives at https://libera.irclog.whitequark.org/u-boot
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<rfs613> marex: i'm not quite ready to accept it as "pure chance" that the old version worked.
<rfs613> and yet I can't figure out what is happening...
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<marex> rfs613: you can always try and artificially grow one of the sections (data/text/bss)
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<milkylainen> morning.
<milkylainen> Q. itb external vs internal data. preference? future? equality?
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<f_> milkylainen: wdym?
<milkylainen> f_: In general or regarding images? :)
<f_> >itb external vs internal data. preference? future? equality?
<f_> What did you mean?
<milkylainen> f_: fit in it's image incarnation can payload data externally and internally. Asking about preference for image type, if any format is going away and if they're considered equal (Ie, u-boot supports them both in all cases: compression, encryption etc).
<f_> I'd use what's currently available.
<milkylainen> Both are available. Doesn't really answer the question. :) External data probably exists because of alignment and zero-copy style ideas. Unfortunately that idea goes away when doing any sort of image manipulation.
<milkylainen> So I'm also questioning the need for a external data payload style.
<milkylainen> Probably some constricted machine.
<milkylainen> mkimage per default creates internal data. iirc.
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<milkylainen> sjg1: Maybe you can shed some light on my fit image questions?
<Tartarus> marex: Does common/usb_hub.c fall under your part of USB?
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<sjg1> milkylainen: I'm not quite sure what you are getting at here. There are some notes about the motivation here: https://docs.u-boot.org/en/latest/usage/fit/source_file_format.html#external-data
<sjg1> milkylainen: For SPL in particular we didn't want to load the whole thing just to parse the metadata
<sjg1> milkylainen: For mkimage I believe making the data 'internal' is now supported too...one disadvantage of external data is that mkimage cannot add things to it (at least it didn't used to be able to)
<sjg1> milkylainen: Yes, for image manipulation, the data should not be external, since it just makes things hard. It is easy to do a 'mkimage -E' step afterwards
<marex> Tartarus: yeah
<marex> Tartarus: what other part of USB is there ?
<marex> Tartarus: oh wait ... there is gadget with matthijs, of course
<Tartarus> marex: it's re common: usb-hub: Reset hub port... and I just wanted to make sure you saw it / commented at some point, I think that's why the author is cc'ing more people
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<milkylainen> sjg1: Does u-boot transparently support both formats or do I need to poke anything beforehand?
<milkylainen> sjg1: Trying to make images load on multiple bootloaders. So the source format and governance being external is preferred (I guess). found https://github.com/open-source-firmware/flat-image-tree
<milkylainen> Barebox doesn't seem to support carrying data externally (-E).
<milkylainen> mkimage does internal data per default? If one doesn't add -E on cmdline that is.
<marex> milkylainen: dont use downstream forks
<marex> Tartarus: I wasnt CCed on the initial patch, I got CCed only in one of the follow up rounds, but I am aware of the patch
<Tartarus> OK
<milkylainen> marex: I don't care that much. It's a bootloader. Not the be-all and end-all.
<milkylainen> If the image format is supposed be somewhat coherent across users and usages (for whatever purpose), there is going to be questions.
<milkylainen> Not about the other bootloader per se, but in this case how the image format looks upon external and internal data.
<marex> milkylainen: if everyone was like that, we'd be using windoze
<sjg1> milkylainen: Does barebox support signature verification? Loadables? Perhaps we should introduce a minimum standard for supporting FIT?
<milkylainen> sjg1: signature verification yes. I use that without any issues.
<milkylainen> sjg1: Sounds like a good idea to me.
<milkylainen> I haven't used loadables in barebox.
<milkylainen> sjg1: I guess that would fulfill the end goal for me. Ie, dragging an image from de-facto upstream mkimage to other parsers and know that if they adhere to some sort of minimum standard choosen by mkimage I'll get my image through.
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<Tartarus> I mean, yes, if FIT is going to be standardized and used in a true multi-project fashion, some of the features that are in U-Boot might well need working and submitting to other projects too
<milkylainen> I'd be fine with a baseline, some sort of generation that adhere to it and a validation suite of sorts?
<milkylainen> Maybe a versioned spec. And as a shortcut you could choose the version in mkimage, letting you know if you're within the spec or not when using various features.
<milkylainen> I'm just fabulating and dreaming here. :)
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<Tartarus> Well, my point right now is that we shouldn't start out with declaring that only FIT as U-Boot has it today is the valid multi-bootloader spec and similar to other broad specs start out with what's most widely supported and then update other projects and bump min requirements
<sjg1> milkylainen: You could perhaps doa PR at https://github.com/open-source-firmware/flat-image-tree ?
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<milkylainen> sjg1: oh. I didn't know. :) Will check it out.
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<milkylainen> sjg1: I'm assuming you mean the validator in the one and only PR? :)
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<sjg1> I don't mean try that PR, I mean add one with your edits :-)
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<milkylainen> sjg1 :)
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