<ali1234>
the view menu has front, back, left, right, and i don't think they are correct
<ali1234>
suppose you are designing a car and you click "left" view, which do you expect to see, A or B? https://i.imgur.com/RyMueD0.png
<dTal>
I could argue it either way easily
<ali1234>
i suppose a car is a special case because you naturally imagine yourself inside it
<dTal>
not very special; you can argue either "from the left" or "towards the left"
<ali1234>
well, if you select "front" view, do you expect to see the front or the back of the car?
<ali1234>
that's pretty unambiguous
<dTal>
hmm
<ali1234>
in openscad, if "front" shows you the front of the car, then "left" shows you view A above - which i would consider the right side of the car
<ali1234>
because it's the right side from the point of view of the driver
<ali1234>
but for objects that you don't normally get inside, it's less clear what left/right actually means
<dTal>
this is an interesting question which I am too tired to properly consider right now
<ali1234>
suppose i'm modelling a person - which openscad is not good at, to be fair - but i would expect "front" to show their face, "left" to show their left arm/leg, "right" to show right arm/leg, "back" to show... well, their back
<ali1234>
but currently it's flipped
<ali1234>
this is audience left/right vs stage left/right
<t4nk_fn>
isn't that dependent on the way it is modeled? if you draw a halfway upside-down inside-out head.. you can't expect openscad to show you the left side of the head
<t4nk_fn>
aren't those terms relative to openscad's world, and not yours?
<ali1234>
there's literally no way in openscad to model a person such that "front" shows their face, "left" shows their left arm, and "top" shows the top of their head
<ali1234>
you can pick two, and if you pick "front" and "left", then you have to model them upside down
<ali1234>
"front" and "top" are rather unambiguous, regardless of the object being modelled
<ali1234>
they clearly refer to the object being modelled, rather than the viewer
<ali1234>
left/right are less clear, but if we assume the same context, they are wrong, in my opinion
<t4nk_fn>
if you model a person so that they are looking at you... the left view is always supposed to show the right shoulder
<t4nk_fn>
from the person's view
<t4nk_fn>
and clicking right should always show their left shoulder
<ali1234>
then why does front show the front?
<ali1234>
it should be labelled "forwards" and show the back, to be consistent
<t4nk_fn>
no I don't think it does :)
<ali1234>
no, it doesn't
<ali1234>
but it should
<t4nk_fn>
another misconception there then.. 'I don't think it does' means 'no it shouldn't ;)
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<t4nk_fn>
but if it bothers you so much.. there's really nothing standing in the way of you changing it?
<ali1234>
blender has everything set up the same, so i will accept that this is by convention
<t4nk_fn>
yeah, I think it's just the way it's supposed to work
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<J24k49>
ali1234 if you use the 2024 version you have the lables as -x and x or -y or y which is if you look onto the cartesian axis the left or right or front (towards you)
<J24k49>
If you model a person you probably model it facing to you which means "their" left side is your right side - so looking at it from the right ( +X) will show their left side
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<t4nk_fn>
that's what I said
<t4nk_fn>
and also; "<ali1234> "front" and "top" are rather unambiguous, regardless of the object being modelled" isn't true either, because the nose could be pointing in any direction ;)
<t4nk_fn>
- front
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<ali1234>
J24k49: it also means their front side is your back side
<ali1234>
yet the front and back views aren't reversed in the same way left and right are
<ali1234>
i'm using nightly btw
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<J24k49>
ali1234 that is why it is labeled +Y and - Y the hint that -Y is front is just because most people design things with the front towards you not away - so you have a mirrored object (by label)
<ali1234>
people design so that front view shows the front of the object because why would you do anything else?
<J24k49>
this is independent from the label
<J24k49>
if you look into a mirror you see your front - but from the position it would be the back
<ali1234>
i'm not looking into a mirror
<ali1234>
if i was, all writing would be backwards
<J24k49>
no it wouldn't be - there are YT videos that explain that mirror does not make writing backwards - it stays the same, you just look at it from the backside
<ali1234>
right
<ali1234>
this is why front view shows the back of the object if left view shows the left of the object - it is mirrored
<J24k49>
this has nothing to do with the object
<ali1234>
mirrors flip exactly one axis, reversing chirality
<ali1234>
oh, well then what does "front" refer to? the front of what?
<J24k49>
the -y axis that is towards you .. as you would see the front if you design something looking onto the front of it
<ali1234>
then why does left show the right under the same conditions?
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<pa>
is something like difference() { $foo=false; mymodule(); $foo=true; mymodule(); } supposed to work?
<pa>
or do i have to wrap those two inner blocks in 2 modules?
<pa>
ok wrapping works
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<Scopeuk>
Or pass it as a parameter
<Scopeuk>
$ feels weird here, the first one is trying to set one variable to two values
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<J24k49>
ali1234 https://imgur.com/a/sQ2V6Lo this is used in most CAD software because you don't face a "back" When you put a bock in front of you did you see the front or the back? - the front - then you can look from the right and left - it will just confuse less people naming it that way but you can swap back and front as you like because
<J24k49>
they are arbitrary names - Also top and bottom if you have a sphere it doesn't matter anyway
<ali1234>
back and front are not "arbitrary names" they are literally hard coded into the software with a specific meaning
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<ali1234>
the same as left, right, top, bottom
<J24k49>
pa you would define $foo and overwrite it as they are in the same scope
<J24k49>
ali1234 the labels on the button are the axis so there is no confusion
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<ali1234>
even those don't make any sense
<ali1234>
each one says the exact opposite to the direction the camera points if you click it, lol
<J24k49>
they do make sense - obviously just not for you
<ali1234>
huh, why have you labelled the left side of the cube as "right"?
<J24k49>
not me that is autodesk - feel free to argue with them
<J24k49>
it is the side you will see - as i tried to explain it, it is like you see something in a mirror in front of you
<ali1234>
yes, except that no text is reversed
<J24k49>
Having the default orientation named "back" wouldn't be practical
<ali1234>
why would it be named back?
<ali1234>
front already shows the front
<ali1234>
it's left and right that need to be renamed
<ali1234>
so that left shows the left, and right shows the right
<ali1234>
like how front shows the front, back shows the back, top shows the top, and bottom shows the bottom
<J24k49>
if i see a cube that is red on the right (my right) and i want to see the red in front of me - i click "right" even if it would be the left if you imagine you are the cube - but it is not about the cube but about the viewer
<J24k49>
Let me ask you with how many CAD software have you worked?
<J24k49>
the labels of the cube have no connection to your model - if i make a car standing on the rear (for printing) then top would show the front
<J24k49>
so it is not i want to view the right side of the cube but i want to see it from my right
<ali1234>
you keep saying it doesn't matter, but it does, any coordinate system is either left handed or right handed
<ali1234>
this cannot be changed, no matter how you rotate the model
<J24k49>
it is a gizmo
<J24k49>
and there are coordinate systems that are completely mixed up - some change Y with Z and reverse X
<ali1234>
there are only two coordinate system, all others are rotations of them
<J24k49>
But this does not change the gizmo for orientation
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