ChanServ changed the topic of #kisslinux to: Unnofficial KISS Linux community channel | https://kisscommunity.org | post logs or else | "An idiot admires complexity, a genius admires simplicity." -- Terry A. Davis
midfavila-laptop has joined #kisslinux
<midfavila-laptop>
>terry quote
<midfavila-laptop>
based
<midfavila-laptop>
although I feel like a number of people have said such things. anyway what are you dweebs up to
<dilyn>
discovered that the chromium snap disables wayland support and doesn't support pipewire so it doesn't have access to webrtc's pipewire capture feature
<dilyn>
so i'm going to build my own snap...
<dilyn>
so i'm setting up qemu with ubuntu kekw
<midfavila-laptop>
>ubuntu
<midfavila-laptop>
>snaps
<midfavila-laptop>
why do you forsake the true path dilyn
<midfavila-laptop>
ebay is recommending me veggietales after buying euler's elements of algebra
<midfavila-laptop>
i feel personally attacked
<noocsharp>
imagine paying for a book written by a dead person
<midfavila-laptop>
i prefer owning physical books.
<midfavila-laptop>
no bully.
<noocsharp>
fair
<noocsharp>
probably a good idea to have physical copies for when civilization collapses
<midfavila-laptop>
implying i'm not going to hand-wire a Z80-based computer with access to plaintext copies of every known cultural and scientific work of mankind via a decentralized peer-to-peer radio network
<midfavila-laptop>
but yes physical books are very convenient
<midfavila-laptop>
i'd like to spend more time reading, but alas, i'm in the midst of moving, so all my textbooks are packed
<midfavila-laptop>
and it's a royal pain to do my usual exercises on my tiny laptop screen
<noocsharp>
unfortunately decentralized peer-to-peer radio networks require peers
<dilyn>
how safe do you imagine libraries would be in an apocalypse...
<dilyn>
:thinking:
<midfavila-laptop>
i mean
<midfavila-laptop>
probably fairly
<midfavila-laptop>
depends on the construction of your library but I imagine they'd be easily defensible
<midfavila-laptop>
large enough to house a decent number of people, grow a small amount of food, etc
<midfavila-laptop>
and it's mundane so I don't think most people would be interested in shakespearean literature when they're trying to find the world's last twinkie
* midfavila-laptop
shrugs
<dilyn>
if my high school experience taught me anything, most surviving teens would burn it for the lulz and because 'reading is dum'
<dilyn>
:'(
<midfavila-laptop>
that's disappointing.
<midfavila-laptop>
I've always figured that the first places I would go in the event of societal collapse would be a museum followed by a library.
<noocsharp>
we should launch a bunch of satellites containing important books, and put them into orbits that have a high chance of colliding with earth in 10000 years
<midfavila-laptop>
>tfw your last hope for preserving human culture lands in the middle of the ocean
<noocsharp>
maybe it'll float to land
<midfavila-laptop>
also there's the slight assumption that people are still literate
<noocsharp>
include that thing they put on voyager that explains how sounds correspond to letters
<midfavila-laptop>
man all these fucking soydevs on github steal my totally cool and original program names
<midfavila-laptop>
this is bullshit
<noocsharp>
and a dictionary
<noocsharp>
like what?
<midfavila-laptop>
i was going to write a text editor and call it scribe
<midfavila-laptop>
i'm still going to write a text editor but now it will probably not be called scribe
<noocsharp>
tbh it's your fault for not expecting scribe to already be taken
<acheam>
oh hi midfavila-laptop
<midfavila-laptop>
i didn't entirely expect it to not be taken
<midfavila-laptop>
there's like 1500 text editors on shithub
<midfavila-laptop>
hi acheam
<acheam>
thank you for calling my quote choice based
<acheam>
scribe is a good name
<midfavila-laptop>
it would be more based if it was a terry original
<acheam>
oh?
<midfavila-laptop>
like the bird quote
<acheam>
eh
<acheam>
he still said it maybe
<acheam>
i found it on some blog
<midfavila-laptop>
i feel like it was actually einstein
<midfavila-laptop>
smh my damn head
<midfavila-laptop>
not even attributing quotes properly
<acheam>
for program names, I just call mine really genericly
<midfavila-laptop>
i like to anthropomorphize mine in some manner, or name them after tools
<acheam>
and just assume that people will refer to it as "acheam's calendar"
<acheam>
or something
<midfavila-laptop>
for example, I intend to write a system tray called Platter
<acheam>
i like that
<midfavila-laptop>
because Platter serves icons promptly
* midfavila-laptop
nods
<acheam>
i guess for my thing to work well, you need a unified online persona
<dilyn>
> scribe
<acheam>
not the many names by which I go
<midfavila-laptop>
you need a *brand*
<dilyn>
rename it scribd
<acheam>
lmao
<midfavila-laptop>
scribeded
<acheam>
be fancy and use some french word
<acheam>
good way to test your poonicode support
<midfavila-laptop>
just because I'm canadian doesn't mean I speak french
<midfavila-laptop>
smh my damn head
<acheam>
your not just canadian
<dilyn>
sxribe
<acheam>
your /east/ candadian
<midfavila-laptop>
figured you would be above stereotypes acheam
<dilyn>
has an x, must be french
<cumin[m]>
"smh" means shake my head...fyi
<dilyn>
i think tha'ts the yoke
<midfavila-laptop>
wow thanks cumin I didn't know that
<midfavila-laptop>
your commentary is so insightful
<cumin[m]>
midfavila-laptop: I'm not trying to flame you
<cumin[m]>
I was just trying to let you know
<midfavila-laptop>
- w-
<midfavila-laptop>
anyway yeah I've been thinking of a bunch of tools I want to try and implement as side-projects. i've been thinking of trying to write a simple replacement for curl called courier, for example. a session manager would also be nice
<midfavila-laptop>
just little things.
<noocsharp>
tfw musl is missing syscall numbers
<midfavila-laptop>
would also be nice to write an sftp client for dropbear
<acheam>
midfavila using sftp?
<midfavila-laptop>
i know
<midfavila-laptop>
a scandal
<midfavila-laptop>
but it's true
<acheam>
but hwhy
<acheam>
seriously though, whats the point of sftp
<midfavila-laptop>
the ssh->scp workflow is legitimately a pain in my ass
<acheam>
rsync
<midfavila-laptop>
no
<acheam>
yes
<midfavila-laptop>
imagine actually thinking I would do something sane
<acheam>
openssh upstream has already made sftp a part of the scp command
<midfavila-laptop>
i don't have any interest in using openssh
<acheam>
(because screw unix philosiphy, amirite)
* midfavila-laptop
shrugs
<midfavila-laptop>
i'm slowly but surely mutilating my fork of the KISS repos from a while back
<acheam>
nice
<midfavila-laptop>
so far we've only increased the base install size by a factor of around fifteen :^)
<dilyn>
that's gnu for you
<acheam>
we need a middle ground between openssh and dropbear IMO
<midfavila-laptop>
the only GNU is sed and like
<midfavila-laptop>
binutils and gcc
<acheam>
something thats openssh-key compatible, but much less bloated
<midfavila-laptop>
if I used -box style executables it'd be a lot smaller but size isn't my primary concern
<acheam>
for the average user, who doesn't need X11 forwarding and other random stuff
<midfavila-laptop>
"bro just don't use it bro"
<acheam>
the sed landscape is sadly barren
<midfavila-laptop>
it really is
<dilyn>
sed is hard
<midfavila-laptop>
once I work through some of my textbooks I intend to write my own complete userland
<midfavila-laptop>
including sed and such
<acheam>
yeah I wouldn't want to work on implementing it
<acheam>
okay, i'm off for the night, got a big standardized test tomorrow
<midfavila-laptop>
my autism cannot be quelled
<midfavila-laptop>
my righteous fury against GNU will be known
<acheam>
this is the first time i've logged off before seeing testuser[m]'s "hi" :(
<midfavila-laptop>
have fun with your multiple choice quiz acheam
<midfavila-laptop>
and all the fancy book lernins
<acheam>
why thank you, midfavila-laptop
<midfavila-laptop>
i'm sure it's very educational
<dilyn>
good luck acheam!
<noocsharp>
is it SAT time already?
<midfavila-laptop>
what even is the SAT anyway? there's nothing like it in canada
<midfavila-laptop>
i vaguely recall it has something to do with getting into post secondary.
<dilyn>
just a competency test basically
<dilyn>
english math bla
<midfavila-laptop>
pretty cringe.
<dilyn>
a lot of west-coast post-secondary education requires an SAT score
<dilyn>
not so much on the east-coast
* midfavila-laptop
shrugs
<dilyn>
(they want an ACT tho, roughly similar but different)
<midfavila-laptop>
that reminds me I need to see if I can challenge the entry requirements for my local university
<noocsharp>
schools require it less and less nowadays
<dilyn>
that's good
<dilyn>
sat should be phased out
<dilyn>
same with act. my score was amazing, and i got nothing for it :'(
<dilyn>
no scholarships and a blazingly fast acceptance letter to a mediocre state school. wooooooo
<midfavila-laptop>
i'd rather go to my provincial university than the private college I'm at now
<midfavila-laptop>
every day makes me want to shoot myself. it's so bad.
<midfavila-laptop>
like, last week, right, the instructor just... didn't show up. at all.
<midfavila-laptop>
just... because.
<noocsharp>
tf kinda private college is that
<midfavila-laptop>
a shitty one.
<noocsharp>
why is linux giving me syscall not implemented
<midfavila-laptop>
the thing that drives me up the wall the most about it though is that they take vendor-neutral tech and then only teach the MS version of it
<noocsharp>
i have to use discord for a class :<
<midfavila-laptop>
my college makes me use discord >.>;
<midfavila-laptop>
on a issued chromebook no less
<midfavila-laptop>
i should have taken my grant and studied independently
<noocsharp>
they let you do that?
<midfavila-laptop>
in my case I was offered three choices
<midfavila-laptop>
1) apprentice as a lab assistant at a local lab
<midfavila-laptop>
2) study for four years independently
<midfavila-laptop>
3) attend post secondary education
<midfavila-laptop>
i wanted the first, but then muh coof happened
<midfavila-laptop>
and at that point I had less than a week to either apply and be accepted into a college or develop a four-year curriculum for myself
<dilyn>
noocsharp: that seems self-evident
<midfavila-laptop>
so for once in my life I took the advice of my elders and just went to college
<midfavila-laptop>
and i've regretted it ever since
<midfavila-laptop>
fucking millenials
<midfavila-laptop>
smh
<noocsharp>
so it goes
<midfavila-laptop>
fortunately I was told that if I can't find a job out of college and spend the four months between this year's funding ending and the next beginning studying effectively, they'll fund independent study
<midfavila-laptop>
and since literally nobody in my city is hiring unix administrators
<midfavila-laptop>
kind of a lucky break I guess
<midfavila-laptop>
...well, except the military and a nuclear facility.
<rio6>
aren't those kind of jobs usually remote?
<midfavila-laptop>
some of it can be remote, but if you're administering a machine and a hard drive fails or what have you, it helps to be on-site
<noocsharp>
that's what robots are for
<dilyn>
that's what apprentices, assistants, and junior admins are for
<midfavila-laptop>
i'm just fucking dreading the four-month placement I have to do as part of my coursework
<midfavila-laptop>
they're probably going to dump me at a windows shop and I'm gonna look like even more of a dumbass than usual
<rio6>
I had to use windows to code at my work, and after some time I found myself writing code using vim and mingw
<midfavila-laptop>
i just hate how windows is a) slow as fuck and b) wants everything to be done in some special Windows Way:tm:
<midfavila-laptop>
like, no, I'm not using your vendor-specific technology when standardized stuff works better and is easier to set up and use. fuck off redmond
<noocsharp>
are all the packages considered implicit dependencies documented somewhere?
<midfavila-laptop>
i would assume core/ is implicit
<midfavila-laptop>
i'm *still* cleaning up after people who listed fuckin' curl or libressl as deps in their packages in my fork...
<noocsharp>
libressl is not implicit
<noocsharp>
nor is openssl
<midfavila-laptop>
i don't particularly care about the current state of kiss. note when I said *my* fork. it was of an earlier set of KISS repos.
<noocsharp>
well i was providing a counterexample to your assertion that core is implicit
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<dilyn>
noocsharp: i've said it a few times, I had it written down somewhere
<dilyn>
assumed dependencies are things like make, musl, binutils, gcc, busybox
<rio6>
I really need a repology watcher script to notify me
<dilyn>
toolchain things, basically. unless a specific toolchain thing is required (excluding make)
<dilyn>
so for instance, if it REQUIRES llvm to build (mesa), specify. make is special because most everything requires make, at the very least everything else on that list requires make :)
<dilyn>
busybox is a weird one because it is just a stand-in for "core unix utilities" so sbase/ubase/toybox/awk/sed/grep/etc are allowed to be assumed, UNLESS you require a specific implementation (gnu patch, bash)
<dilyn>
rio6: i feel yah; i've basically orphaned almost all of my community packages
<dilyn>
you could use cron to populate a list once a week
<dilyn>
you can assume pigz because it only provides a gzip utility, but you can't assume bzip2 and xz because they provide libraries
<dilyn>
(and zlib)
<rio6>
does repology not take community repos? I forget if that was the reason why it was removed from it
<dilyn>
grub can't be assumed (obviously), openssl because libcrypto can be provided by at least two things, linux-headers because it's only ever a make dep, bison/m4/flex because lexer et al aren't special (byacc vs bison, for instance); baseinit/baselayout aren't dependencies of anything (except a bootable system but... well...); curl is a dep of kiss;
<dilyn>
git is just a stand-in for generic vcs
<dilyn>
repology stopped tracking KISS repositories because of the change dylan made to the package format
<dilyn>
it was never supposed to track community maintained repos, just official ones
<dilyn>
(official in that it was maintained by dylan for KISS)