beneroth changed the topic of #picolisp to: PicoLisp language | The scalpel of software development | Channel Log: https://libera.irclog.whitequark.org/picolisp | Check www.picolisp.com for more information
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<beneroth> pablo_escoberg, not sure if you read the log, but if you do: check out +Mis in reference documentation :)
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<pablo_escoberg> Yup, read the log.  Thanks for the goto.
<beneroth> welcome :)
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<pablo_escoberg> hi abu[7], I think the permissions for the demo app are broken as well.  Tried to d/l from here:  https://software-lab.de/doc/app.html#minApp and got a "Forbidden" page.
<abu[7]> Hi pablo_escoberg! Indeed!
<abu[7]> Note, however, that this file is no longer maintained
<abu[7]> (and was never completed)
<pablo_escoberg> oh!  OK, I was trying to d/l the ERP demo; guess I ended up in the wrong  place
<abu[7]> The ErP demo is fine, just not this doc file
<pablo_escoberg> Getting "forbidden" for this, too: https://software-lab.de/doc/app.html
<pablo_escoberg> I think there's a link to the demo in there, but can't reach it.
<abu[7]> It is the same file. I change to 644
<pablo_escoberg> ah, thanks.  But I was wrong.  There is no link to the demo app there.  Can you please save me some searching and pop the link in here?
<pablo_escoberg> (just trying to figure out how you handle dates there so I don't reinvent the wheel)
<abu[7]> Do you mean demoApp.tgz?
<pablo_escoberg> yes, and thanks.
<abu[7]> ☺
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<razzy> hello, how to run penti from command line? what is penti name?
<razzy> trying waydroid with linux
<abu[7]> I think there is no way to run it from the command line
<abu[7]> It is a System Servis
<abu[7]> Service
<abu[7]> A so-called InputMethod
<abu[7]> InputMethodService
<razzy> abu[7]: I can run preinstalled calculator with command waydroid app launch com.android.calculator2 no problem
<razzy> abu[7]: "waydroid app launch com.android.calculator2"
<abu[7]> A calculator is a normal App
<abu[7]> But Penti is a Keyboard
<razzy> abu[7]: penti seems installed correctly. but does not show as app
<abu[7]> It *is* not an app
<abu[7]> In Linux keyboard drivers reside deep in the Kernel
<razzy> ahh f*
<abu[7]> You have to install it somehow there
<abu[7]> I had Penti originally on Linux as a kernel driver
<abu[7]> using Numpad keys
<abu[7]> It was a mess
<abu[7]> I tried very hard to get a custom keyboard running on Linux in *user* space
<abu[7]> Did not find a way
<abu[7]> Perhaps now there are better ways
<abu[7]> I even looked at Ubuntu Touch
<abu[7]> but nobody could tell me a way
<abu[7]> So I abandoned Linux on Phones and used LineageOS
<abu[7]> (it was CyanogenMod back then in 2015)
<razzy> abu[7]: there are virtual keyboards written in C for linux. what do you think about doing one with just 5 keys
<razzy> i mean I will rewrite one to look like penti
<abu[7]> I think it is a very good idea
<abu[7]> Penti uses 6 keys though
<razzy> yes, but you get the idea
<abu[7]> I would like to know how to do it
<abu[7]> on Linux
<abu[7]> Not sure
<razzy> abu[7]: this seems sipmlest https://github.com/jjsullivan5196/wvkbd
<abu[7]> Seems it works only in Wayland?
<abu[7]> I don't understand the principles behind those keyboards
<abu[7]> Do they work in user space?
<abu[7]> What mechanism on the Linux level?
<razzy> abu[7]: no idea yet. should i try?
<abu[7]> Sure! This is very interesting
<razzy> abu[7]: florence seems to work as app https://www.xmodulo.com/onscreen-virtual-keyboard-linux.html with transparency included
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<abu[7]> Yes, seems to be started in user space
<abu[7]> But I don't know what it does
<abu[7]> How to write one's own?
<abu[7]> What are the Linux hooks for that?
<razzy> plan: backup system, install florence, look at plorence code what and how it does, than decide if modify penti or florence.
<abu[7]> Is it necessary to backup anything? I thought it is a normal user space program (?)
<abu[7]> The question is how it interfaces
<abu[7]> udev?
<abu[7]> What is possible in modern Linux?
<abu[7]> Too bad I did not look at Linux for many years
<beneroth> I suspect (don't know) that mouse & keyboard input on a Linux system is handled by the desktop system, e.g. X or Wayland. This entry also suggests that: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/639183/why-does-the-x-window-system-handle-keyboard-input
<beneroth> so well possible that the way to do that is hugely different between X and Wayland
<abu[7]> yes, this was my impression too
<abu[7]> So these are not really "keyboards" in the mechnical sense, where the system gets key strokes at the lowest level
<abu[7]> As far as X is concerned, I solved the issue here with "xdotool"
<abu[7]> I drive it from my phone via Penti
<abu[7]> But this is not a keyboard
<abu[7]> I posts X events
<abu[7]> also mouse movements and clicks etc
<abu[7]> (we discussed it here a while ago)
<abu[7]> The nice thing on Android is that it allows you to write a keypoard like Penti, which is a real keyboard in any aspect
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<razzy> tried many ways. penti not on waydroidu. onboard keyboard limited sucess.
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<abu[7]> I was afraid so
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