<teepee>
nope, it's the slicer InPhase mentioned earlier, original work by juri_ to continue the Haskell based tool chain started with implicitcad
<teepee>
and with that, I'm saying good night :)
<teepee>
only 1 hour too late today, \o/
<InPhase>
teepee: Progres! :)
<InPhase>
Progress too
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<JordanBrown>
(ignore this)
<JordanBrown>
Is there a web-based IRC client that integrates a log with an IRC client so that it just seamlessly restores the channel history, as if you'd been watching all along? (For those familiar with Slack, I mean a UI like that.)
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<aiyion>
JordanBrown: I think 'thelounge' does that.
<Scopeuk>
JordanBrown seconding the lounge, that's what I use. If configured to do so it will also support drag and drop file share, you have to host it though
<Scopeuk>
I don't know if matrix does replay, a lot of people seam to like it
<fancsali[m]>
What's wrong with matrix?
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<Scopeuk>
Nothing that I know of. If your using matrix (I think that's what the[m] postfix means) does it support chat replay when you reconnect?
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<Friithian>
gawd damn ABS is annoying to work with
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<linext>
so hslice works on my PC, but not the server. IceSL shows an error saying that OpenGL 4 is required, even at the command-line
<J1A8484>
teepee what do you think about showing the error log when hidden and errors occur (not warnings or other)
<J1A8484>
i think this is already a great "popup" tool - we just need to ensure it is not hidden
<teepee>
no, popping up windows the user has disabled is very unfriendly, although we could have something similar to the compile errors that show the notification marker in the view port
<teepee>
so some sort of temporary info bubble instead of those annoying "it did not work, click that tiny close button of the small windows that showed somewhere"
<InPhase>
Popping up would be bad, but bringing the tab to the foreground of that tab list wouldn't be too bad.
<InPhase>
Many IDEs do that.
<teepee>
right, that might be ok, would not help that specific user though
<teepee>
also which one to pop up, console or errorlog? :)
<InPhase>
I wasn't following the issue.
<teepee>
the issue just said "pdf export does nothing" because console was hidden
<InPhase>
Error log was meant to be a clearer summary. Although personally I just use console because I'm comfortable with it.
<teepee>
so the notification could have both links just as the compile error and following that would actually even unhide the windows
<teepee>
but it's doing that based on explicit user click
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<teepee>
oh, talking of hopefully good news, InPhase did you see the issue created before?
<teepee>
not so much the content but the user posting it :)
<InPhase>
Nice. :)
<teepee>
everyone crossing fingers please
<InPhase>
He does amazing work.
<teepee>
indeed, very much so
<teepee>
really diving deep into the complex stuff
<teepee>
currently I have hardly enough time to update the website and retweeting some cool stuff :/
<JordanBrown>
Note that for an export, you are *expecting* a window to pop up - a "save as" window.
<teepee>
true, but small error windows are still annoying
<JordanBrown>
I've never really understood the point of the error log; I just read the errors in the console. But separating errors from rendering noise from program output might be worthwhile.
<JordanBrown>
Is the "current tab has been modified since its last render" box a "small error window"?
<JordanBrown>
Admittedly, it's a little different since it offers you a choice.
<teepee>
yes, and that's massively annoying when I hit that F4 accidentally going for F5
<teepee>
that said, yes, it does give a choice
<JordanBrown>
Not that I'm sure that that choice is valuable.
<JordanBrown>
But you can also dismiss it with Esc.
<teepee>
considering I never clicked yes.. :)
<JordanBrown>
Exactly, "yes" is a pretty questionable response to that popup.
<JordanBrown>
But not unimaginable.
<JordanBrown>
But a message in some random small pane that might be hidden is not exactly an expected response to a user error.
<JordanBrown>
And if you hit F7 when you were aiming for F6, and it gave you an unobtrusive error message, and you went and got a cup of coffee while waiting for your render to complete, you might be kind of annoyed when you got back and found that it hadn't started.
<JordanBrown>
To be fair-ish, I run with everything undocked so the message is even more unobtrusive and even more likely to be hidden.
<InPhase>
This though is incorrect user behavior: "Anyway, yes, that's what the console shows. I don't usually use it so it's hidden."
<InPhase>
But perhaps there is something we could do to make its importance clearer.
<JordanBrown>
If it is incorrect user behavior to hide the console, why do we let them hide it?
<InPhase>
To someone familiar with an IDE the console's importance would be immediately obvious, but we have a lot of non-programmer users.
<InPhase>
Well there are times when you want to really maximize the display window size.
<InPhase>
It's oddly coupled to things like image size outputs, so I make it bigger when doing high res animations. :)
<JordanBrown>
Eh, mumble. I think of there being two layers: the GUI editor/viewer, and the language compiler/executor. I expect GUI errors in popups, and language errors in a log.
<InPhase>
JordanBrown: We also have "No top level geometry to export" or something like that with stl outputs.
<JordanBrown>
Yes, exactly the same concern there.
<InPhase>
I've thought of that as a content issue in the model rather than a gui issue.
<JordanBrown>
hmmmmmm
<InPhase>
In the svg / pdf case, the user in question is more confused because that's a side-workflow which isn't really well documented. But it's analogous to the stl not having anything to put in it.
<JordanBrown>
it's certainly a mismatch between what the model does and what the user is expecting, which could be an error on either side.
<JordanBrown>
But it's in direct response to a GUI input, rather than being part of "run the program".
<InPhase>
Here's a suggestion. Maybe the "Export as" should say "Export preview as" and "Export 3D as" and "Export 2D as"
<InPhase>
They could say what they're actually doing!
<JordanBrown>
Is that allowed?
<InPhase>
I've kind of memorized all the ones I use by now, but it was a little obscure when I first encountered them. We could, like, use words.
<JordanBrown>
That would make disabling them be less mysterious.
<InPhase>
They wouldn't even need disabling if they just said what they're doing. Failure would be more obvious.
<InPhase>
Although they could also be disabled, and then it would not be mysterious. I do concur.
<InPhase>
Make 2D, you get all the 2D ones enabled, etc.
<InPhase>
In fact, I think this is probably a very good idea.
<JordanBrown>
Does "export preview" get disabled if you just did an F6?
<InPhase>
I think it doesn't function at that point, so yes.
<InPhase>
Oh, it does function.
<InPhase>
So that one should not say Export preview, but "Export image as png"
<JordanBrown>
yeah, I was just experimenting too. Is it basically just a screen shot?
<InPhase>
Yep.
<JordanBrown>
which is of course a different kind of wrong.
<InPhase>
Well it's hugely useful for sharing things.
<InPhase>
Bug reports and such.
<JordanBrown>
Sure. (Though I use Edit/Copy Viewport Image for that).
<JordanBrown>
But if I really want to export a PNG, it seems like I would want to control the size of the PNG, either to make it larger or smaller.
<InPhase>
I never even saw that entry before. I don't use anything other than Edit Preferences.
<InPhase>
I usually do a screenshot with prtsc.
<InPhase>
Then I crop in gimp.
<JordanBrown>
... but controlling the PNG size doesn't really interact well with wanting to control the view angle and framing. In some ways, you'd want a separate window that lets you set up a camera shot. Huge rats nest, not going there.
<JordanBrown>
I use Copy Viewport Image because usually I don't want to include the controls.
<InPhase>
Makes sense.
<InPhase>
I might use it in the future if I remember it's there. :)
<JordanBrown>
Usually it starts with shrinking the window to nearly its minimum size, since it's rare that I really want to show details.
<J1A8484>
hm undocking windows might also change that .. i never have controls in images
<JordanBrown>
You get controls in images if you use PrtSc.
<JordanBrown>
Not if you use Copy Viewport Image or Export Image.
<JordanBrown>
But probably the biggest reason that I use CVI over Export for sharing is that it's just copy-paste and I don't end up with directories cluttered with images.
<J1A8484>
using cntrl+shift+c give you only the image
<JordanBrown>
Ctrl+Shift+C is Edit/Copy viewport image.
<JordanBrown>
but I don't use it *quite* often enough to have memorized the keyboard shortcut.
<J1A8484>
yes right ..
<J1A8484>
win+shift+s let you crop what you want copied (windows)
<JordanBrown>
Going back to the Export 2D/3D question... I don't know whether menus can have inline section titles (especially in a cross-platform application). If they can, then having "export" lead to a three-section menu with "screen shot", "2D model", "3D model" would make the behavior fairly obvious.
<JordanBrown>
Having three "export" options at the top level would wo
<JordanBrown>
The two buttons labelled STL and SVG.
<teepee>
yes, but if you look at the image from J1A8484, there's 4 entries in preferences
<teepee>
those in section console don't make sense
<JordanBrown>
oh, yeah, sure looks like an oops
<JordanBrown>
I just looked at the highlighted area and didn't look at the larger context.
<JordanBrown>
I thought it was just a question about what the options meant.
<JordanBrown>
Never mind :-)
<JordanBrown>
Maybe F7 should do the default 3D export or the default 2D export, as appropriate for the model.
<teepee>
no worries, I have the advantage that I have implemented that, and I was slightly confused first too
<teepee>
but those GUI XML descriptions are very difficult to maintain once there are merge conflicts
<teepee>
I'd say, no more fixed key shortcuts, we need to get the config gui in :)
<teepee>
plus also adding a toolbar config
<JordanBrown>
I can believe it, though thankfully I haven't looked at that stuff. Maybe a long time ago when I tried (and failed) to get you to accept a no-tabs option.
<teepee>
sadly there's no support in Qt directly for that, that's an awesome feature in gtk (at least for the menu items)
<JordanBrown>
Maybe no *fixed* key bindings, but *default* ones seem desirable.
<JordanBrown>
It's useful to be able to talk about F5 and F6 and have everybody agree on what those mean.
<J1A8484>
i mean could be fun if exportSVG will only render 2D objects and export them
<JordanBrown>
2D export could automatically project.
<JordanBrown>
But I suspect that would be more confusing than valuable.
<InPhase>
We just need to add some code to lock up the buttons on J1A8484's keyboard when svg export is disabled.
<J1A8484>
also auto render when export could be but might also help with multi tabs
<JordanBrown>
If render wasn't so slow, or was easy to abort...
<J1A8484>
(having a blank TEK keyboard which is programmable too)
<JordanBrown>
I'm not personally much for keyboard or GUI customization, because then when I sit down at somebody else's computer I'm lost.
<J1A8484>
but if the F7 would export 3D if 3D is rendered and 2D if 2D is rendered would be nice ( which default format could be set in preferences)
<JordanBrown>
yes
<JordanBrown>
I especially avoid keyboard customization because the whole point of using key bindings is to program features into muscle memory, and then it's really hard to override when the computer doesn't have the bindings installed.
<J1A8484>
also the toolbar button could switch depending on render content .. makes it bit more tidy
<JordanBrown>
yes
<teepee>
yes, that default export is mentioned in one of the issues I believe
<J1A8484>
only the thing in that issue where someone sees "export2D" or SVG could make him curious and he learn that SCAD also can do 2D Ü
<JordanBrown>
But as much fun as it is to chat with you folks, I should really pretend to do stuff that I get paid for. Later.
<J1A8484>
I hate these windows ribbons that always change and you search something until you find out you need to do something special to see that button
<JordanBrown>
Got bored with paying stuff, back here for just a moment.
<JordanBrown>
Yes, that's exactly why in the original Macintosh UI they went with disabling rather than hiding.
<JordanBrown>
But it does still leave it mysterious why it's disabled and what you have to do to get it enabled.
<JordanBrown>
And now back to paying stuff...
<teepee>
there's code somewhere to export 3d stuff to SVG, like isometric view, so menu items separating 2d/3d might not be ideal
<teepee>
as noted in the issue, I think Qt supports toolbars for menu items, so that could explain why it's disabled
<teepee>
there might be other options, like giving a message in the status bar
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<pa>
Hi folks!
<JordanBrown>
But the more I think about it... when I say "export", I *expect* a popup dialog, the save dialog. *Not* giving me a dialog of some kind is surprising.
<linext>
i found a weird bug in PHP trying to write 3dpartprice.com v2
<linext>
opening the process using proc_open()
<peepsalot>
linext: wrong channel?
<linext>
i wrote in PHP, nobody wrote back
<peepsalot>
oh you are opening openscad process?
<linext>
not yet
<linext>
once i finish v2 of 3dpartprice.com, i'm going to work on a customizer
<linext>
powered by openscad
<peepsalot>
pa: yeah looks like you are pretty much there! i'm guessing the only remaining fix is to remove that odd notch in the top?
<linext>
my point is, if you are trying to launch several processes from php and you use proc_get_status()['running'], it will return false before you can collect the data from stdout
<pa>
peepsalot: yea, but now that you told me, i got to fix the shape
<pa>
i guess that's why opencsg messes it up big times
<linext>
Cura outputs print time and material usage at the very end of stdout, so you need the end of stdout. so is_resource() is better
<linext>
is_resource() makes its possible to get the entire stdout, while proc_get_status()['running'] == 0 will trigger before you can collect the entire stdout
<peepsalot>
i don't do php so no idea about its handling of io streams, but maybe you could redirect them to a file then read that after it exits
<linext>
the point is to launch a bunch of programs at once and monitor stdout at the same time