teepee changed the topic of #openscad to: OpenSCAD - The Programmers Solid 3D CAD Modeller | This channel is logged! | Website: http://www.openscad.org/ | FAQ: https://goo.gl/pcT7y3 | Request features / report bugs: https://goo.gl/lj0JRI | Tutorial: https://bit.ly/37P6z0B | Books: https://bit.ly/3xlLcQq | FOSDEM 2020: https://bit.ly/35xZGy6 | Logs: https://bit.ly/32MfbH5
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<Guest27> hello, i am new to openscad and i was wondering if there is a portable edition
<Guest27> i built something to convert .scad to .stl on python but it needs the .exe path of the program so i was wondering if there's a portable version i could use to use it as path instead
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<teepee> Guest27: the zip package is pretty much portable I think, it tries to create a registry entry for the icon but otherwise should just run from everywhere
<teepee> I'm not sure how that relates to usage from python though
<Scopeuk> teepee I think he has something invokine an external exe
<teepee> well, yes. but a portable app is no different to an installed on in that view as far as I can tell
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<Scopeuk> true, unless your planning to package it and share?
<teepee> you can put it on a usb-stick and run on a different computer, that should work with openscad
<Guest27> i am going to try it rn
<teepee> openscad tries to resolve all the other files relative to the openscad.exe so as long as the folder is complete, it should be ok
<teepee> you can't just grab the exe alone though
<Guest27> it worked perfectly
<Guest27> i have another question
<Guest27> if i upload this to github, how do i give credit to the creators of openscad but keep my code under license?
<Guest27> is it okay if i upload the whole thing that i am creating (it includes the openscad zip) without violating any law?
<Scopeuk> Guest27 I would suggest you provide a readme with instructions to download the openscad zip
<Guest27> instead of using it on the project?
<teepee> just calling openscad is not creating any requirements license wise as far as my non-lawyer understanding goes
<Scopeuk> perhaps I misunderstood the question. I thought we were discussing how to share a tool with openscad exe
<teepee> you can distribute even as binary, giving a pointer to openscad homepage or github somewhere in the readme should be enough to point people to the source code as required by GPL
<Scopeuk> teepee knows bettter than me on this
<teepee> I can't give official legal advice, but my understanding is that just packaging the exe will not cause your code to be under any specific license
<teepee> I believe it would be different if there would be a libopenscad that would be compiled into and used by a python package
<Guest27> i mean, yes, you are right, since the tool creates a .scad file to be converted to .stl then yes, it is needed to convert it
<Scopeuk> purely from a personal perspective I would normally look to reference to the latest release zip and provide instalation instructions. but you are not required to do so
<Guest27> you didnt misunderstood
<Guest27> is there a way to link the source code instead?
<Guest27> i am just worried about using something that is not mine
<teepee> that's a good thing to clarify but *using* the openscad binary is fine, using the unchanged binary and point to the official source code should be plenty good in all license areas
<teepee> it's pretty much how linux distros operate too
<teepee> what license do you want to put your script under?
<teepee> just curious, as I said before, I don't think it changes anything in regard of using openscad.exe
<Scopeuk> building on top of an opensource project for more opensource projects is generally the whole idea
<Guest27> Apache-2.0 license
<teepee> so it's even more liberal than GPL, and as far as I know both are perfectly compatible too
<Guest27> so having the openscad folder on the project its fine?
<teepee> but yes, I see no issue whatsoever (license wise) shipping an openscad folder with the exe and just adding a link to the source code / github page somewhere in the readme
<Scopeuk> Guest27 purely out of curiosity what does your project do?
<Guest27> translates from spanish to braille and generates the .stl file so you can 3d print what you translated
<teepee> putting *.exe files into a github repos might not be ideal from git management perspective but with the low frequency of releases and not too big binaries that's probably also not a huge deal
<Scopeuk> very nice
<Guest27> do you guys know if openscad has a discord community?
<teepee> there's none, well no official one :)
<teepee> J1A84: did some braille scripts too a couple of days ago
<Guest27> cool
<Guest27> i am using pyqt for the interface
<Guest27> its very user friendly
<teepee> if you have a release and want a short article published on the openscad home page, let me know
<Guest27> thats very cool
<teepee> I'd love to support this kind of usages more
<Guest27> add me on discord so i let you know when i am done with it
<Guest27> i still need to wait until i go back to college so i can use their 3d printers and see if everything works properly
<Guest27> laura#5939 btw
<teepee> is it possible to link to people without a common discord server?
<Guest27> yepyep
<teepee> ah, I think I found it :)
<teepee> I like IRC :)
<J1A84> discord is a proprietary central system (afaik)
<Scopeuk> J1A84 correct
<teepee> irc is pretty central too
<Scopeuk> centralised servers but open clients and protocal
<Scopeuk> we did the whole death of freenode thing recently
<J1A84> it was very decentral in the beginning .. and still you can have your own server
<teepee> but I like the freedom regarding running my local proxy and integration
<teepee> I suppose we'll see if matrix will take over eventually :)
<J1A84> is there any connection to diaspora or mastodon?
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<teepee> J1A84: yeah, you can have your server, but you can't connect that to other networks, except some of the "strange" ones, not going to name names
<teepee> I guess it's basically the service packages and management/moderation causing that
<J1A84> sound like it would be possible to have VM server for every network and then have a hub to connect them Ü
<teepee> connection? mastodon is more twitter than irc I think?
<Scopeuk> A chat application is only as good as the avaliability of the right participants
<teepee> J1A84: in theory yes, but I'm pretty sure no normal irc network will allow linking your server just so you can access it
<J1A84> XMPP was nice until the big companies stopped supporting it
<teepee> also I think server linking is pretty implementation specific, so you need to run a very similar version
<teepee> yep
<J1A84> i like the simple times where you could take paper and simply write an address on it ..
<teepee> probably only Twitch which has still some sort of IRC support, everything else is dropped by now
<teepee> haha, you can still do that
<J1A84> but i don't have any addresses  ..
<teepee> that's solveable though
<teepee> the bigger issue might be finding someone who actually will respond ;-)
<Scopeuk> Guest27 if you do want anyone to look over stl's etc to see how well they are likely to print there are plenty of people here with access to printers and years of experience generating things in openscad and printing them with different technologies
<Scopeuk> as a secondary point you can use /nick <<your prefered name>> to change your displayed name if you wish
<J1A84> there is a e-mail to mail and mail to email service
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<laura> oh rip
<laura> someone already has laura taken lol
<teepee> yeah finding user names is a problem nowadays
<J1A84> laura  use 3mf not stl  Ü
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<laura__github_ju> dayum
<laura__github_ju> i am struggling lmao
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<laura__gh_jungby> ill leave it like that for now
<laura__gh_jungby> why 3mf tho, i thought stl was the most popular one
<teepee> it is, but like 30 years of tradition, but it's an ancient format that has some issues
<J1A84> is that a hamster [_] ?
<teepee> it basically just defines huge bunch of triangles and software is supposed to match those up into objects
<teepee> J1A84: hamster? where? what?
<teepee> ahh, the logo
<laura__gh_jungby> ohhh nono hahaha otter
<J1A84> otter space Ü
<laura__gh_jungby> otters are cool
<J1A84> like all living things
<J1A84> 3mf is much smaller and has some other nice features
<teepee> I'd take otters over a bunch of fruit flies though
<laura__gh_jungby> ohh, like what?
<laura__gh_jungby> i never heard of it until now
<laura__gh_jungby> i am very new to this so it makes sense if its popular, excuse me for that
<J1A84> i would eat a flyburger  rather than an otter burger
<teepee> it's slowly taking off now, I'd say. STL is probably still more widely used, but things are moving and some of the newer 3d printing sites, specifically Prusa supporting it quite openly
<teepee> oi! I was not talking about eating
<J1A84> stl is only mesh without unit ..  3mf  is a (zip) container  where you could put in everything
<teepee> it does have a number of cool features, not much supported by OpenSCAD yet at this point
<teepee> it supports color, multiple objects, additional attributes (like slicing parameters for 3d printing) and even some extensions I have never looked into what they even are
<laura__gh_jungby> ohhhh, i think i understand
<teepee> but even for just plain meshes, it stores a point list and then the geometry connecting those, like most newer formats, so it's in theory much clearer what a given geometry is supposed to mean
<teepee> not just the random triangle list STL has
<Scopeuk> in any case its one small change to the openscad command line to switch so you can work with whichever (or infact both). stl is used everywhere, 3mf is the future (and fairly well supported)
<laura__gh_jungby> the thing rn is that, i would like to do so many things and now you are giving me ideas for those but i dont think i have enough knowledge to make them possible
<J1A84> with the dev snapshots you can even get a 3mf button
<J1A84> knowledge comes with doing it
<Scopeuk> from a personal opinion get one thing working (if not finished) then play with the next and if stuck just ask, here is a great place to do that for openscad
<J1A84> and by asking (eg. here)
<laura__gh_jungby> yeah, i think i am going to keep working with stl
<laura__gh_jungby> as the 2nd version of my project
<laura__gh_jungby> then i'll come up with the 3rd version using 3mf instead
<teepee> that's fine, just keep in mind that if you get some issues with processing STL files, there might be something to try
<laura__gh_jungby> its more reasonable since i haven't even finished the one i am working on rn
<laura__gh_jungby> btw, how do i ask someone from here to try my stl file
<teepee> ah, that's a very good skill, getting something finished
<teepee> I wonder if the bot knows about that already
<teepee> side-projects?
<laura__gh_jungby> yepyep
<laura__gh_jungby> this would be my 1st finished project tho
<laura__gh_jungby> i always end up getting distracted or interested in something else and rip the project
<laura__gh_jungby> now i am decided to finish this one yes or yes
<teepee> :)
<teepee> trying to find that comic we had in office
<Friithian> xkcd is the best
<teepee> I think I found the original
<othx> teepee: Okay.
<laura__gh_jungby> lmao
<teepee> yes, xkcd is awesome, the best one about programming is a different one in my opinion but I think they stopped creating new ones sadly
<teepee> static?
<othx> static is a bad idea when it comes to variables... https://geekandpoke.typepad.com/geekandpoke/2012/04/simply-explained-gv.html
<laura__gh_jungby> btw, i just tried with 3mf instead
<laura__gh_jungby> i have a problem
<laura__gh_jungby> it generates properly the model but in the wrong position
<teepee> oh, that's strange
<J1A84> probably the origin is now in the file
<teepee> ahh, right, with the multi object that could be
<J1A84> stl often use relative position when display
<laura__gh_jungby> i tried to see it using cura
<teepee> IIRC cura imports STL centered but 3MF ends up somewhere outside the build plate
<laura__gh_jungby> that's what happened
<J1A84> yes i love that .. so you can generate objects on certain position of your bed
<laura__gh_jungby> the z position is the most messed up one
<J1A84> is your model base on Z0?
<J1A84> translate([110,110,10])cube(20,true);   //should give you a centered cube (on a 220 bed)
<J1A84> else right click an center object in cura
<teepee> looks like it's really intended to behave that way
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<J1A84> huge benefit for multi material .. so  you can filament change and print another 3mf onto without headache of position
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<laura__gh_jungby> how thick should be my plate for make it resistable but not too thick
<laura__gh_jungby> resistible*
<J1A84> plate?  .. bottom?  top? wall ? bed?
<laura__gh_jungby> the way it looks on cura makes me think i made it too thick but if i reduce that then i am worried about it still, since it can break if its too thin
<J1A84> .6mm  with infill   else  depends on the size
<J1A84> if you wanna show what the problem is you can paste?
<J1A84> paste?
<laura__gh_jungby> give me a moment
<laura__gh_jungby> please ignore the �'s, those are accents used in spanish
<laura__gh_jungby> https://bpa.st/MRCA
<J1A84> i would move it up 3.. so it is not in negative Z ..  3mm is fine  cura will fill this with infill (e.g 15% ) and a  ~ .5 top and bottom
<J1A84> you can make 100×100 plates with just 1mm
<J1A84> with PETg you can make .25  (if your bed is level and even)  and get a flexible plate
<teepee> for enclosures / boxes I usually use 2mm which is not totally rigid, but pretty solid with PLA
<teepee> yeah, thin PLA tends to get bendy surprisingly, like 2 layers gives neat bookmarks
<J1A84> (not everybody uses 200μm layer)
<teepee> heh, my flickr account still exists https://www.flickr.com/photos/96851846@N05/9436219164/
<teepee> uff, that's almost 10 years old now. that is just crazy
<J1A84> 1.5mm  is great for braile  boards  around 5cm
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<J1A84> you can also print thin plates and then thermoform them after using hot water
<teepee> hum, maybe I should not have used a smiley as wlan SSID. how do I put that into an Arduino sketch :D
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<Scopeuk> teepee hex value?
<teepee> looks like copy&paste from terminal works
<Scopeuk> I wonder if their compiler supports it however
<teepee> I know the code point but not the binary hex value
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<teepee> uff, that just worked. how did that even get an IP address. software is scary ;-)
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<laura__gh_jungby> dayum, it takes way more to convert if i add one more line to translate
<laura__gh_jungby> from 13 secs rendering to 1 min
<J1A84> sound strange .. translating a union should not have that impact
<J1A84> btw using code tables could make your code much smaller
<J1A84> e.g. you could use ord()
<laura__gh_jungby> i have never used that
<laura__gh_jungby> let me take a look
<ali1234> i tried to write an exhaustive description of convexity: https://bpa.st/R4SQ
<J1A84> ali1234  watertight is often used .. and  a cube has 8 pints that are inside and outside  at  the same time ..  not  sure what you mean with inside and outside
<ali1234> Note: we can ignore points that lie exactly on the surface for the purposes of understanding convexity.
<ali1234> mathemtically, any object has an infinite number of points that lie exactly on the surface
<J1A84> maybe easier to use "faces"   - i think that definition of infinite points is very confusing  in regards of polyhedron points in oSCAD
<ali1234> convexity isn't just for polyhedrons
<J1A84> a triangle has 3 points ... so how are these not inside and outside points?
<ali1234> they are on the boundary, and so they are ignored
<ali1234> i dispute that they are simultaneously inside and outside. i say they are neither inside nor outside
<J1A84> maybe use "arbitrary selected  point"
<J1A84> if this text is for the wiki .. i think i user will have problems to understand what you want as  the points you have in your code are the ones you ignore in the text
<ali1234> what code?
<J1A84> polyhedron/polygon
<ali1234> this would be a whole new page on the wiki
<ali1234> it wouldn't have any code on it
<ali1234> and again convexity is not just for polyhedrons
<J1A84> again POLYGON
<ali1234> okay, it is not just for polyhedrons and polygons
<ali1234> it can be invoked with extrude
<J1A84> which is a polyhedron
<ali1234> except when it isn't
<J1A84> which extrude is not a poyhedron?
<ali1234> linear_extrude() difference() { any two things that are not polygons; }
<ali1234> such as rectangles and circles for example
<J1A84> those are polygons
<ali1234> polygons are created with polygon()
<J1A84> circle and square are just module names for specific polygons
<ali1234> that is an implementation detail
<ali1234> users should not need to know that
<J1A84> yeah but you started with "points" that are not existing in scad
<ali1234> yes, because this is a mathematically explanation of convexity
<J1A84> if you want to explain convexity and need more than 2 lines of text -  you can not transport the knowledge to a user
<ali1234> it references points in the sense of the set R3
<J1A84> if the default convexity would be 5  - no normal user would ever think about this
<laura__gh_jungby> okay, stl is def giving me problems with the conversion from scad to stl T-T
<laura__gh_jungby> i will try using 3mf since you told me its smaller
<laura__gh_jungby> it took it 6 mins to convert
<laura__gh_jungby> and its not thaaaaaat big tho
<J1A84> laura__gh_jungby  oh yeah the 2021 version has a bug .. please use the 2022 dev version Ü
<laura__gh_jungby> oh? where can i find that one
<laura__gh_jungby> nvm i think i found it
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<J1A84> ali1234   sounds good ..  i wonder if a tangential would count as intersection else there shouldn't be an intersection with less than 2 crossings
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<ali1234> for the purposes of understanding what the convexity number *means*, it is best to assume that tangents are not intersections
<J1A84> coordinate for position would also be possible i think
<ali1234> that is an arbitrary choice anyway (just like the choice of whether boundary points are inside or outside)
<J1A84> "the number of any line crosses the surface  or perimeter from outside to inside"   -   do we really need more?
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<ali1234> yes, because that is ambiguous and everyone gets it wrong
<ali1234> see: every previous attempt to document it
<J1A84> if the documentation is wrong Ü  ..  i just don't think we solve this with more text
<ali1234> the documentation isn't just wrong, it is confusing because it is not carefully worded
<laura__gh_jungby> hey, can you help me out with something? for some reason my w is not working https://bpa.st/Q7MA
<J1A84> sure lets find a better wording without making it longer
<ali1234> why?
<J1A84> laura__gh_jungby the letter "w"?
<laura__gh_jungby> yep
<laura__gh_jungby> module w(){
<laura__gh_jungby>      letra(0,1,0,1,1,1);
<laura__gh_jungby> should be ⠺ but it doesnt show anything
<ali1234> if you want a "simple" explanation, it is best to do it with images
<ali1234> text will only ever support that
<ali1234> it is impossible to explain this concept in one sentence without a lot of images
<J1A84> laura__gh_jungby  that is strange let me check
<laura__gh_jungby> tysm
<ali1234> and nothing says there can only be one explanation in the docs
<J1A84> laura__gh_jungby the module w is working
<laura__gh_jungby> do you see the 3d preview?
<J1A84> line 418 there is no call for w or W
<laura__gh_jungby> ohhh, i missed that then
<laura__gh_jungby> oopsie
<laura__gh_jungby> thank you
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<J1A84> laura__gh_jungby  maybe have a look  here https://bpa.st/ZSJA
<J1A84> just for the next time
<laura__gh_jungby> oh wow
<laura__gh_jungby> that pretty organized
<laura__gh_jungby> i can try editing the one i have
<laura__gh_jungby> i just dont know how to make more lines
<J1A84> here is a version that uses the 64 possible combinations to call the pattern https://github.com/whosawhatsis/braille-openscad
<J1A84> more lines ..  either break after a certain length (% mod)  or add  more variables for each line
<J1A84> (or use a variable that can hold multiple strings txt=["hallo","line2"];
<J1A84> and add another for loop to go through the strings
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<ali1234> nice
<laura__gh_jungby> does anyone wanna spend unnecessary filament to let me check how does it look like after printing?
<Friithian> how many grams approx?
<laura__gh_jungby> let me check
<laura__gh_jungby> i need to open the door first brb
<J1A84> a braille sign  should not exceed 5g
<J1A84> (if it is not over 20 character)
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<J1A84> saw someone making blender render that traces the slicer to get accurate rendering of 3D prints
<J1A84> (gcode render)
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