<Jesu79>
Hi! I have a quick question. Normal media buttons on my river init don't work on my laptop, how can I use them riverctl? I checked the buttons with "showkey --keycodes" so I know the numbers for those buttons.
<Jesu79>
oh and almost forgot, how can i activate tap-to-click on river (might not be directly related to river though).
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<tiosgz>
Jesu79: bind the media buttons like other keys. there are volume buttons bound in the example config
<tiosgz>
re tap-to-click, riverctl input <input-name> tap enabled
<tiosgz>
may i add to the distro talk that setting up alpine as a secondary system (which may or may not be a good idea but i've recently made use of it) wasn't fun at all cos for some parts the setup scripts were the best docs available
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<ifreund>
yeah, I do recall the alpine installation experience being a bit scuffed
<ifreund>
chimera has pretty good docs and I found installation to be quite straightforward
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<guison>
is window swallowing something that would be merged if a pr for it was made? or is this out of scope for river currently
<ifreund>
guison: I'd consider making that UX possible to be in scope for river but I don't think it makes sense to work on until the initial river-window-management protocol is finished
<guison>
i see, thanks. I was thinking about giving this a shot since it is something i am lacking in my daily use of river, although I haven't really used zig before, so it'd take some learning.
<guison>
iøll keep an eye on the pr and see how it progresses
<Nickli>
other than DWM i'm not aware of any other WM having swallow
<guison>
hyprland has it, but i'd prefer not to touch hyprland, sway has it through ipc, many x11 wm's have it either built in or through external scripts
<ifreund>
guison: I think it should be possible to implement it outside of river in the window manager once the river-window-management protocol is complete
<ifreund>
if not, we can expose the necessary information to make it possible
<guison>
alright, thanks, I'll look into it at some point
<Nickli>
one thing i have wondered, is it possible to set windows to open in determined places like this in main and next 1,2,3 place in stack
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<leon-p>
regarding live theme switching; dark/light switching is likely the most we'll ever get cleanly
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<leon-p>
I'd love a general theme switching mechanism, where I can just choose whatever theme I feel like on a given day and everything adapts, but that's unlikely
<leon-p>
interestingly, GTK isn't even the issue, I think you can change some of its CSS stuff on the fly with gsettings / dconf and all open windows will update
<leon-p>
but for things like foot, mako, all the various bars it's more annoying, because then you get into the teritory of auto-rewriting configs and reloading programs which is pretty ugly
<leon-p>
a general purpose XDG Theme spec would be lovely, but that will never happen ;_;
<leon-p>
but I really want more than just a light/dark switch
<vyivel>
ah i see
<leon-p>
think CDE or oldschool window-maker, where you could just choose a theme and all desktop widgets and all windows using the native toolkit (at that time basically your entire desktop) switch to it instantly
<leon-p>
I too am a bit tired of writing endless lines of config files just for eye-candy, so something like that would be my ideal setup
<dnkl>
leon-p: simple - you just have to write a new toolkit and make everyone use it
<leon-p>
arguably writing the toolkit is the easy part
<leon-p>
with the caveat that base16 themes aren't very good
<leon-p>
I am reasonably sure that programmatically generated themes do not work in general
<dnkl>
writing the toolkit is definitely the easy part
<leon-p>
eh, I'll just iniclude all desktop widgets I need in my WM directly so that part is covered. Emacs can be remotely instructed to switch themes as well. Firefox does whatever it wants anyway. So only thing left is foot
<Nickli>
meanwhile, i managed install my favourite ugly cursor theme :P
<Nickli>
...hacked-green
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<dnkl>
I'm _almost_ considering adding a [colors.alternate] section to foot.ini, with keybindings to switch between them...
<vyivel>
USR1 handler to reload config maybe
<jetpackjackson>
Nickli: dwl (wayland version of DWM) has swallow too, and that's the one thing I miss from river (well, that, plus the hide-behind-monocle patch lol)
<Nickli>
what does "hide behind monocle" do?
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<jetpackjackson>
Basically it makes it so that if you have a transparent window (like a terminal) in front of a solid window (like a browser) you don't see the browser in the background, you only see the program in the front
<jetpackjackson>
Which is really nice when you use a transparent terminal background
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<pinpoxIRC>
vyivel: leon-p
<pinpoxIRC>
> I am reasonably sure that programmatically generated themes do not work in general
<pinpoxIRC>
Interested to hear your opinion on this. Why I don't use the base16-universal-manager myself anymore, I still use generated themes throughout my system and have been doing so for years now.
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<leon-p>
pinpoxIRC: the short version: if you wish to programmatically generate a colourscheme from an arbitrary starting colour, there are constraints like ensuring good contrast between text and background (base16 actually fails this more often than not) which effectively limits how good the theme will look
<leon-p>
in a theme which was designed rather than calculated, more care can be taken to ensure both usability and that it looks pleasing
<leon-p>
the problem really is the arbitrary starting colour. you could of course limit the set of possible starting colours to ensure good results, but that's just designing a theme with extra steps
<leon-p>
also base16 has way to few colours to actually work with rich applications
<pinpoxIRC>
Hmm ok, starting from a specific color is an extra requirement that might make it more diffecult
<leon-p>
f.e. green text on dark bg, green text on light bg, green text on highlighted dark / light bg, green bg (dark, light, highlighted, not highlighted) are all different greens
<leon-p>
I am reasonably certain the modus-operandi theme for emacs has more greens than base16 has colours in total
<pinpoxIRC>
My main concern when randomly generating themes is that I want certain things to always be "red" e.g. errors, but you are right, not all colors will have good contrast. In practice I don't actually have that many combination that have to work I think. Most terminals only have 16 colors anyway, so there is not that much room for different greens
<pinpoxIRC>
Thanks for the link, sounds interesting!
<pinpoxIRC>
To be fair, my themes are not completely randomly generated. It's more of a picking a set of colors and then the themes get templated from that
<leon-p>
terminals are very limiting indeed, I have grown quite disillusioned with the terminal as an application platform
<pinpoxIRC>
I kind of enjoy the restriction. Maybe it's stockholm syndrom
<pinpoxIRC>
I've even played around with different monochorome or very slightly colored themes and found them less distracting
<pinpoxIRC>
didn't stick with them tho
<leon-p>
totally! I used to use no syntax highlighting for a while, worked well for me. only switched it back on because when I switched to emacs the modus themes were designed well enough that syntax highlighting didn't distract me anymore
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<pinpoxIRC>
Are there quality ports of those for other applications?
<leon-p>
no idea
<pinpoxIRC>
I'm most picky about the theme of the editor, so a different approach I thought about was setting a well-designed pre-made colorscheme for that and picking the colors from it programatically for other applications. But I bet you'll run into all kinds of other problems
<leon-p>
you can get reasonably far with just text fg/bg and a few highlight colours for most desktop widgets and such. It's rich applications that are the problem
<pinpoxIRC>
True.
<pinpoxIRC>
Maybe it's possible to encode all stylistic requirements like contrast between specific colors as "unit tests" to run against possible themes.
<leon-p>
eh, all requirements you can check automatically are mathematical properties. you encode them as boundary values and "calculate" the theme via smth like wavefunction collapse
<leon-p>
however I don't think you can encode the proper "does my git diff view look good / is usable IRL" into either math or code
<leon-p>
*property
<leon-p>
and that is the ultimate problem
<pinpoxIRC>
The question is what property is actually responsable for "gif diff looks good"
<leon-p>
visually pleasing, undistracting, immediately obvious, good contrast (order depends on subjective values)
<pinpoxIRC>
I'll have to do some more research on this. I bet there have been studies on design topics that put stuff like that into numbers
<LarstiQ>
there remains a subjective element
<pinpoxIRC>
Yes, that is the part I would leave to random generator
<pinpoxIRC>
The idea being you can generate technically "good" themes and pick the one you subjectively like
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<leon-p>
I was about to post of a screenshot of what I think is the gold standard as far as a usable git diff view is concerned (magit with modus-operandi), however somehow my screenshot got a bit truncated
<tiosgz>
i believe river is a bit weird considering that layout is a positional argument and everything else is behind a flag (which, in river, have to go in front of the positional arg)
<tiosgz>
also, i recommend that you get used to looking at man pages (run "man riverctl" in the terminal). some software has all information in the wiki, some has all info in man pages
<tiosgz>
(dunno if that last comment wasn't completely unnecessary. apologies if it was)
<leon-p>
maybe every page on the wiki should start with a blurb about reading the actual documentation first and the wiki just being for tips and tricks
<tiosgz>
anyway. how come i always (or almost always) miss the time interesting talks happen here? i wanna add my own definitely absolutely relevant opinions :D
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<leon-p>
it only counts as necrobumping if it's older than a day :)
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<leon-p>
ifreund: if wayland-protocols!355 makes it, do you think we could integrate that with the WM protocol? F.e. have one (or no) tray objects per output which are exposed as render nodes so that the WM could place an arbitrary surface beneath for decoration
<leon-p>
because I am wondering if it could be used to implement dock-apps without needing anything custom
<ifreund>
leon-p: yeah, I'm sure we could integrate it one way or another
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<Nickli>
think i handled keyboard layout and toggle in 2 different lines
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