<zid>
not very user friendly, but that's what it does
<heat>
oh I know about that panic
<heat>
a classic
<geist>
I’m on a boat!
<heat>
good shit
<heat>
i'm on my chair
<clever>
zid: but not if you have an initrd
<geist>
On a boat
<geist>
Booting without initrd without modules is some hard core stuff
<zid>
I never use initrd
<geist>
Makes you feel powerful, like you have the power
<zid>
I'm too lazy to set it up
<zid>
I just build ext into the kernel, everything else am module
<heat>
do you have to manually assemble the initrd in gentoo
<heat>
because that sounds very gentoo
<zid>
I never don't want ext4 loaded
<geist>
Yah gentoo has that option. My gentoo install i just disable modules and build everything in
<heat>
what if you switch to zfs though!!!!
<zid>
I am rebuilding the kernel at that point anyway?
<clever>
zfs/lvm/luks cant be done purely in kernel
<geist>
And then i sit back, satisfied, arms crossed, hand in a Power Glove
<clever>
they need some userland tooling to parse the metadata and create devices
<heat>
sayw hat
<heat>
late stage filesystems are something very funny
<heat>
gimme mah god dang block based filesystems
<geist>
That’s lame
<geist>
Well FWIW btrfs works fine with just in kernel stuff
<heat>
i want my unix filesystems like the kings of old
<clever>
lvm kinda isnt even supported in-kernel
<geist>
Though if you want to mount something other than the root fs within it you need some extra sub volume args, etc
<clever>
the kernel just has device-mapper, which can be configured to map sub-sections of a virt device to sections of another device
<clever>
lvm then deals with all of the metadata, and configuring DM
<geist>
Well it’s more complicated with some of the higher level features of LVM
<geist>
Like COW, thin provisioning, etc
<geist>
But possible it still needs a user space process to do thes canning to set it up
<clever>
ah, those didnt exist when i used lvm
<geist>
Yah was fiddling with proxmox the other day and it leans on a bunch of those LVM features for backing VMs
<geist>
Also for snapsnotting, etc
<heat>
i'm starting to think filesystem development isn't real anymore
<CompanionCube>
geist: iirc btrfs also needs the userspace bits with multi-device fses
<geist>
Not sure. I think you just point mount at one of the volumes and it finds the other
<geist>
*but* that might be in mount.btrfs
<geist>
Good point, maybeyoucan’t linux kernel root off a multi device fs
<geist>
I think there are issues with grub too
<CompanionCube>
ah, seems there's a workaround: 'If you don't have an initrd, or your initrd doesn't perform a btrfs device scan, you can still mount a multi-volume btrfs filesystem by passing all the devices in the filesystem explicitly to the mount command. A suitable /etc/fstab entry would be: '
<geist>
Aaah, so then the question is what about in root= command line?
<CompanionCube>
geist: it also says that works
<geist>
Okay, makes sense.
<geist>
I haven’t looked how that works but i assume that each device has a duplicate piece of metadata that lists all the other devices’s UUIDs
<clever>
zfs does do that
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<rwxr-xr-x>
Yo yo!
<rwxr-xr-x>
How is everyone?
<heat>
how do you do fellow kids
<heat>
lets listen to the hip hops
<rwxr-xr-x>
we are on IRC
<rwxr-xr-x>
fellow kids is as far from the truth as possible
<rwxr-xr-x>
how are you doing heat?
<heat>
fine
<heat>
hbu
<rwxr-xr-x>
im chillin
<rwxr-xr-x>
podcasts and development
<rwxr-xr-x>
not bad
<rwxr-xr-x>
and vacation from work
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<rwxr-xr-x>
make
<heat>
make clean
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<clever>
heat: i dont think this is capable of compute
<heat>
it may just be faster anyway
<sbalmos>
it might be able to compute your grocery bill
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<zid>
damn, sha512crypt is slow
<zid>
I'm getting like 4333 guesses a second
<clever>
yep, thats the point! :D
<zid>
(with 12 threads, and avx)
<heat>
is that literally sha512crypt?
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<zid>
it's still not done, but I don't wanna give up :(
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<cyao>
How do I test if there is a device on the ATAPI bus? Is it the same as ATA PIO? (Check if bus is floating)
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<rwxr-xr-x>
good morning/afternoon/evening all
<rwxr-xr-x>
how's life?
<kof123>
hello. you need a sticky bit chmod +t rwxr-xr-x
<rwxr-xr-x>
lol
<rwxr-xr-x>
people like the nick is what i've noticed
<rwxr-xr-x>
drwxr-xr-x
<rwxr-xr-x>
i feel like the way i have it now is the catchiest one
<rwxr-xr-x>
rwxr-xr-xt is less so, and rwxrwxrwx is eh
<FireFly>
why the executable bit?
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<rwxr-xr-x>
my nick has almost nothing to do with anything other than looks, rwxr-xr-x is easy for me to remember, people get it and like it, and it rolls off the tongue
<rwxr-xr-x>
mostly how I make nicks
<rwxr-xr-x>
755 would make more sense
<GeDaMo>
I don't think you can start a nick with a number
<rwxr-xr-x>
probably not
<rwxr-xr-x>
i've had a couple people here just call me 755 because its easier to type out than rwxr-xr-x
<GeDaMo>
rwxr-xr-x: rw<tab> is easy enough :P
<rwxr-xr-x>
Oh woah
<rwxr-xr-x>
I didn't know that existed LOL
<rwxr-xr-x>
that's cool
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<gog>
helo
<GeDaMo>
EHLO
<j`ey>
EL0
<gog>
200 OK
<j`ey>
it was an aarch64 joke, not a http one!
<gog>
yes i know :P
<j`ey>
ok good, youre just normally an x86 fiend
<gog>
yeh i know very little about ARM
<gog>
or any architecutre not x86
<gog>
i've thought about buying an rpi to play with tho
<sortie>
“A speed-up since 2020 has also made the issue more pressing, because for the first time, a leap second might need to be removed, rather than added.“ ← Oh jeez that's going to be a nasty XK-Class Time Loop Scenario
<mrvn>
Have you thrown some GPUs at it?
<mrvn>
zid: ^^
<mrvn>
sortie: Hey, we could build some big ass rockets and slow down the earth a bit.
* sortie
drops a slightly larger ice cube in the ocean solving it once and for all
<mrvn>
Why is the earth speeding up? I thought we had global warming. Heat expands and a rotating thing aslows down when the mass moves further from the center.
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<sortie>
probs a weird moon thing
<GeDaMo>
Melting ice reduces weight on the crust something something
<zid>
can we just wait until we have to add one next instead and have them cancel
<zid>
that seems easier
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<mrvn>
GeDaMo: that would make the mantel expand so the earth slows down. again, why does it speed up?
<mrvn>
I know, the moon is a mega construct and is misbehaving.
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<mrvn>
time we send someone up there again to fix it.
<bslsk05>
pub.sortix.org: Index of /sortix/release/1.0/builds/
<mjg>
so is that dead?
<sortie>
mjg, muhahaha one of us has an OS that's actually 1) installable 2) self-hosting by running make in /src out of the box 3) hosts its own website; and the one has the wonders of SMP and ACPI
<heat>
<sortie> Does Onyx install? :D
<heat>
why am i out here catching strays
<mjg>
guilt by association
<sortie>
mjg, releases are rare, it's more rolling on the master branch these days, use the nightly releases
<sortie>
mjg, or use the volatile release instead of nightly, for the experimental networking (comes with ssh and other goodies)
<mjg>
godo grief man
<heat>
sortix is a fork of openbsd in spirit
<sortie>
(curl too)
<heat>
manpages for everything
<mjg>
i'll try fresh nightly
<mjg>
but if anything goes wrong i declare sortix takes a huge L
<mjg>
no takebacks
* sortie
laughs heat in semantic markup
<heat>
mandoc is just a horrible format man
<sortie>
One of us has beautiful manual pages
* sortie
loves this jovial competition with heat
<heat>
i'll let you know my operating system is ✨self-documenting✨
<gog>
agile os
<gog>
never write a comment
<heat>
and by the grace of god all my utilties have a --help
<heat>
none of that bsd "what's --help" shit
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<gog>
all of my utilities have /?
<heat>
/votekick gog
<zid>
I use --?
<gog>
i dserve it
<sortie>
-? true option
<heat>
use either -help or --h
<zid>
--help=-?
<heat>
--what
<gog>
---help
<zid>
--nani-the-fuck
<heat>
--dashdashhelp
<sortie>
-long-option sends you to prison, --long_option sends you to the bad place
<heat>
--lc_corp_moment
<sortie>
heat, obey
<zid>
--pause -> --yamettekudastop
<mjg>
yo, sorts, why you participating in 3rd non-pertinent idle chhatter
<heat>
sorts?
<mrvn>
food
<heat>
it's mr. sorts for you
* gog
mews at food
<mrvn>
MacHeat
<heat>
MacHeat were the old macbooks
<heat>
not anymore due to super good very fast arm64 apple silicon
<gog>
m'heat
* gog
tips fedora
<heat>
h'eat
<sortie>
mjg, you a cop?
<heat>
worse, freebsd committer
<mjg>
emacs.tix.tar.gz
<mjg>
wtf sortix
<mjg>
do you even boot
<sortie>
Please it's xz
<mjg>
gcc 5
<mjg>
old school
<heat>
very haiku
<sortie>
It's a fine vintage
<mjg>
how to do any networking
<heat>
>x86_64-onyx-gcc --version
<mjg>
what nic do you support? virtnet ? ne2000?
<heat>
x86_64-onyx-gcc (GCC) 12.2.0
<heat>
e1000
<mjg>
no ifconfig
<sortie>
mjg, the cdrom boots of nightly are slow because the bios loads the live environment off the disk, but the hard-disk installations are lighting fast (been experimentally optimzing it down to like a third of a second)
<mjg>
not what i asked dawg
<mjg>
howto networking
<sortie>
The gcc is at 5.2.0 because honestly I have not had the time to update it, it's a bunch of work to upgrade the patches, and it's working fine enough
<heat>
do the qemu thing and give it e1000
<heat>
it should Just Work(tm)
<heat>
ping 1.1.1.1 for a quiq test
<sortie>
mjg, like I said, volatile has networking. You're using nightly which is not volatile. The networking is experimental and not merged just yet to master. That's my next task.
<sortie>
The volatile has all the goodies you'd want, networking, a basic GUI, ssh, curl, wget, etc.
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<sortie>
It's not fully stabilized and finished, but pretty close
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<mjg>
sortie: looks like it hung trying to create a partitin
<heat>
how u running it
<sortie>
What virtual machine?
<mjg>
virtualbox
<sortie>
VirtualBox's ATA implementation has a weird regression these days that cause corruptions
<mjg>
oh?
<sortie>
At least affecting Sortix. Unclear if it's my bug. It worked back when I made 1.0 and these days it tends to fail when making the initial installation early on
<sortie>
mrvn, wrote my own init system, proper dependency tracking with readiness, inspired by what systemd does right, done much simpler
<mjg>
sortie: i can ping it, but trying to connect to ssh gives me nothing
<mjg>
... and now it worked. looks ike some timeout
<mjg>
what's the password
<mrvn>
mjg: the password is secret, obviously
<sortie>
The live environment root user does not have a password set
<sortie>
You can set one by running passwd
<mjg>
i just did
<mjg>
still does not let me in
<mjg>
is root login allowed?
<mjg>
i don't see /etc/sshd
<mjg>
grep shows /etc/default/sshd_cnofig with root login disabled
<mjg>
is that what is being used?
<heat>
can't wait for the new openssh version
<heat>
login disabled by default
<heat>
no holes in the default install in a heck of a long time
<sortie>
mjg, this is standard sshd, by default password login for root is provided. To enable it, cp /etc/default/sshd_config /etc/sshd_config and change "PermitRootLogin prohibit-password" to "PermitRootLogin yes"
<mrvn>
heat: do you test creating the file each loop and working on an existing file?
<sortie>
mjg, I assume you tried with -KILL
<mjg>
i tried with -9
<mjg>
and no amount of ^ does the trick
<sortie>
Signal numbers may vary
<mjg>
^C even
<sortie>
Use -KILL
<mrvn>
mjg: cltr-\?
<heat>
mrvn, huh?
<mjg>
sortie: no dice
<sortie>
SIGKILL is the only thing that the kernel promises will definitely kill a thread
<sortie>
So if it doesn't kill it, you found a bug :)
<mjg>
sortie: rly, dirconc is designed to make shit bad
<heat>
dirconc is great for constipation in general
<mjg>
sortie: look, if you never ran dirconc on your os, it is virtually guaranteed it will cause a problem
<sortie>
Not surprised dirconc locked it up :)
<mrvn>
heat: openro1 creates a tmpfile for each thread/process and does open(path) + close on each loop: Is that (create + open) on each loop or create + (open on each loop) or both?
<sortie>
The tmpfs implementation is a bit old and the locking may not be perfect
<mjg>
sortie: messed up haiku as well :p
<heat>
mrvn, create + (open + close on each loop)
<sortie>
mjg, but the ext2 filesystem may work
<mjg>
i did my duty
<heat>
i'm fairly sure there are some other tests to test creation
<sortie>
(since it's a bit more top-level atomic)
<mjg>
bug reported with repro steps
<sortie>
Yeah typing up a bug
<heat>
ext2 will get dragged around in performance
<mrvn>
heat: should favour an LRU implementation in the FS heavily then.
<heat>
due to plain old filesystem access (although granted, cached) plus IPC
<mjg>
sortie: so you renumbered KILL to something else?
<heat>
mrvn, LRU of what?
<mrvn>
heat: path walking and file opening
<heat>
it heavily favours a proper cached walk, yes
<sortie>
mjg, looks like I did define it to 9, but no standard requires that
<mjg>
pretending to be unix does
<sortie>
That wholly depends on what I can get away with, mjg
<heat>
openbsd should scramble the signal numbers for the next release
<mjg>
heat: select their meaning at boot time at random
<heat>
LMAO
<mjg>
that will show it to these pesky people who use them
<\Test_User>
random for each run of *kill
<sortie>
I am a de-facto Unix-spirit system, I do some things differently as it makes sense, but ultimately it's about what the compatibility pressures makes possible/infeasible
<mjg>
matching signal num,ber for KILL sounds like a nobrainer dawg