<lf94>
InPhase: you think overfill will fix the lines issue?
<lf94>
for it's worth, that's just white nail polish with a bit of nail polish remover on a paper towel I used
<lf94>
to remove the excess
<lf94>
I think wall count = 0 will help
<lf94>
with text sharpness
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<J23>
lf94 use clear coat (or black) to seal the gaps
<J23>
then fill the letter color
<InPhase>
lf94: well those are some terrible surface results.
<InPhase>
lf94: More flow rate?
<J23>
Ü
<J23>
lot of texts often causes bad surface as the small radii have overextrusion
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<mororocz>
hi
<mororocz>
I'm probably stupid, I would need to use textmetrics on the latest release, if I use --enable textmetrics, the command line returns a list of possible arguments where enable is not...
<mororocz>
What am I doing wrong? I have downloaded windows version 2021.01
<mororocz>
oh i had to have a snapshot, my mistake
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<guso78[m]>
I think the Syntax IS enabled=textmetrics
<guso78[m]>
= Sign instead of space
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<lf94>
InPhase: that surface is without the overfill
<lf94>
J23: if I use clear coat wont that fill the letter holes too
<J23>
depends .. if it is thin and after drying it shouldn't
<InPhase>
lf94: It will have a gap filling width size per coat.
<InPhase>
lf94: Your differential to exploit is the close spacing of the streaks compared to the letter line widths.
<lf94>
right.
<lf94>
let me try the overfill idea first
<lf94>
if I can avoid this spray step that'd be ideal...
<lf94>
I have 45~ cards to do
<lf94>
the white nail polish is super fast to apply
<lf94>
and dry too
<J23>
just use transparent/black nail polish and thin it a little
<lf94>
this is a great idea
<lf94>
it just means I gotta do two paints :D.
<lf94>
so first: overfill. if fail: transparent.
<J23>
doesn't need to cover all just the layer voids .. propanone is your friend here as capillarity works in your favor
<J23>
you also could print the cards and then a card holder with some adhesive tape.. so you can print the color inlay for all in one go
<J23>
at least you don't need to change filament 45×
<lf94>
yea
<lf94>
card holder is something ive thought of
<InPhase>
A superior result would certainly be obtained by just printing a card backing, using spray adhesive for a paper-printed image, and then polyurethane spray for waterproofing.
<lf94>
InPhase: the problem with that is getting proper card stock
<lf94>
oh
<lf94>
you mean put it on the 3D printed card ?
<lf94>
gotchya
<lf94>
yeah ok, rereading, makes more sense
<lf94>
maybe ill try that too LOL
<lf94>
"superior result" except it involves even more steps
<InPhase>
It's not like you have fewer steps with any of these. :)
<lf94>
the idea is, I get regulation dimension cards for no effort
<InPhase>
Is the goal to be selling these, or to make a set?
<lf94>
moving nail polish over the surface is a hella fast process
<InPhase>
The two spray steps are both fast, although you'd need drying space.
<InPhase>
The only careful step in what I suggested is arranging the paper-printed image over the card.
<lf94>
with your proposal I need to print 45 plastic cards, then about 7 sheets of paper, and then cut all paper, and then align everything, spray
<lf94>
regardless ill probably try it!
<lf94>
i should do a blog post or some shit after
<InPhase>
A speed up in the paper alignment is obtained by rough-cutting, adhering, and then just take an exacto-knife and run it around the edge of the printed card backing to slice off the paper that extends beyond this.
<InPhase>
If you use one of those strong spray adhesives I predict this should work well. But, you'd have to try it to be sure.
<lf94>
multicolor printer would open so many doors
<lf94>
even just two damn colors...
<lf94>
I might buy that cheap Geeetech one
<InPhase>
And we really need to work support for this into OpenSCAD. But that will require more developers of it to have them.
<InPhase>
It will require some non-trivial attention as it needs language changes and rendering process changes. Perhaps Manifold having library developer attention would open up this opportunity.
<lf94>
help
<lf94>
how do I say "just put a wall around the outside of this model" in cura
<lf94>
I set walls to 0 to improve the resolution of the inner text
<InPhase>
vase mode?
<lf94>
I still want infill
<lf94>
I just want the wall on the outside though
<lf94>
not on details in the middle
<InPhase>
Isn't "outer wall" listed separately in one of the detail settings?
<InPhase>
I rarely venture that deep into the settings tree.
<lf94>
should help with the text legibility but I need at least 1 wall for the card border
<lf94>
cant set brim height...
<lf94>
uuuugh
<lf94>
ah ha
<lf94>
inner line width
<lf94>
outer wall line width
<lf94>
ill set inner to0
<lf94>
"unable to slice"
<lf94>
AAAA
<lf94>
this sucks
<InPhase>
lf94: Uhm, I don't think removing the wall around the text will help readability.
<J23>
there is a reason why wall exist .. use at least 1 wall
<lf94>
even for text?
<lf94>
what if I want 1 wall for text but 2 for outside
<InPhase>
lf94: It's actually going to make your text spikey when you go to paint them.
<J23>
walls prevent stringing
<lf94>
it's a zigzag pattern
<lf94>
no stringing
<InPhase>
lf94: You will get capillary action into the lines.
<lf94>
fair
<lf94>
I still need 1 wall for text and 2 for outside
<InPhase>
Perhaps. Although if you can't achieve this, overfill might help you get away with 1 outer wall.
<lf94>
yeah the overfill should be ok...
<J23>
you are using the actual cura - as it will adapt line width .. so you can slice everything with 1 out and 1 inside wall .. the inside wall will be omitted if there is not enough space
<InPhase>
Also, if you had a dual extruder, and could simply set walls to be a different filament color, the cards would come out already done and would look great.
<lf94>
Yeah I know. I need damn dual extruder.
<InPhase>
You'd have white outlines for all the recessed letters, and a nice white border on all the cards.
<lf94>
J23: yeah, but unfortunately, it's not small enough to omit.
<J23>
not sure if you can set an extruder by line type .. for supports this works but not sure if the settings allow to set an extruder for outer wall only
<J23>
if it is not omitted - then there is enough space - why worry .. don't try to micromanage your slicer
<lf94>
yeah you're right.
<lf94>
aight, printing
<lf94>
1 wall, overfill 110%
<lf94>
intersection'd just a small piece for a fast 8 min print instead of 1 hour and 10 minutes
<J23>
you will always have small gaps in the surface .. the only way is one coat thin black
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<lf94>
that I know
<lf94>
It's the text I care about more
<lf94>
the overfill really helped with the surface lines, I'm actually quite happy
<lf94>
man some people are not helpful at all. in the 3d printing discord, one guy is just like "this look like complete ass, you gotta just do filament changes 100 times"
<lf94>
"it's not even close to being "ok""
<lf94>
printing zero wall
<lf94>
and upped retraction
<lf94>
(also I havent done the clear / black coat yet because I just want to see if text is legible at all, that's all im focusing on :)
<InPhase>
lf94: That's still a bit hard to read, but much better.
<InPhase>
lf94: Boosting your font size by 50% might help a huge amount.
<InPhase>
If you can fit it.
<lf94>
I dont wanna do that because most cards have WAY more text
<InPhase>
lf94: It looks like you're right on the threshold of what your printer can handle, and you're getting some letter features fusing closed.
<lf94>
yea exactly.
<lf94>
zero wall looks better in cura
<InPhase>
lf94: So either a modest increase in font size, or some sort of stability improvement.
<lf94>
im hoping the overfill creates a natural wall.
<InPhase>
Maybe an intermediate boost like 20% increase in font size?
<InPhase>
You're clearly scraping a threshold for text fusing, as most is not fused.
<lf94>
yeah. ill try it after I suppose
<lf94>
Im thinking also F the text, print a QR code to the card data
<lf94>
and just print large card titles
<InPhase>
Is your filament popping or spitting at all as you print?
<lf94>
nope
<lf94>
this pla is quite good
<InPhase>
Ok.
<lf94>
i have a dryer too i could use
<lf94>
just in case
<lf94>
but that'll be a 12 hour wait
<lf94>
f that
<lf94>
if this zero wall works ill go nuts
<InPhase>
I'm doubtful of it, but worth a try I suppose.
<InPhase>
That's more likely to fuse and spike I think.
<InPhase>
Is your nozzle surface clean?
<lf94>
looks fine to my naked eye
<lf94>
maybe i should try under extrusion
<InPhase>
One thing you can do, separate from this zero-wall test, is to put the walls back and choose a slower speed for wall printing.
<lf94>
lol. would just be a springy mess then i guess...
<lf94>
15m/s is not slow enough? :|
<InPhase>
Okay, that's pretty slow...
<lf94>
Too slow was actually causing problems
<lf94>
I upped everything to 50m/s
<lf94>
except the first layer
<lf94>
because it's a glass bed
<InPhase>
You can see from comparing one print to the other that the problems around the letters are not some consistent property of the print structure, but instead an instability in line placement.
<lf94>
maybe I need to go slower again for the last layer
<lf94>
30m/s maybe
<InPhase>
So it is something to do with variability in how the filament comes out. But on reflection, that's probably not a speed issue, because that would be more consistent in where the errors occur.
<InPhase>
So it means things like filament inconsistencies or other such things.
<InPhase>
There's not enough dust around for that to be a filament filter type problem, but small width variabilities or moisture differences or maybe even thermal fluctuations of some sort.
<InPhase>
You could maybe try lowering the temperature just a notch.
<lf94>
190C atm
<InPhase>
High temperatures are for strong fusing. Lower temperatures are for better precision.
<lf94>
but at this size I heard lower is better
<lf94>
like 180C
<lf94>
So
<lf94>
zero wall just finished
<lf94>
:)
<lf94>
this looks GREAT
<InPhase>
These numbers are not absolute anyway, because there is variability in the thermistors.
<lf94>
gonna let it cool before taking it off the bed
<lf94>
I can read it without any paint even
<lf94>
in this dim lit room
<lf94>
AND, the outside contour? it made its own wall somehow
<lf94>
it just merged into a wall
<lf94>
one corner looks a bit bad
<InPhase>
Overfill I guess. :)
<lf94>
I cant wait to show you
<InPhase>
I have not actually tested zero wall with overfill.
<lf94>
I think it's like 15 minutes to cool down (from what Ive seen in Octoprint)
<lf94>
I think the "stability" of zigzag infill makes this possible
<lf94>
Oh yeah one thing I wanted to say: why the heck arent people sharing their slicing profiles when sharing STLs
<lf94>
huge deficiency in the 3d printing community
<lf94>
Im gonna try another at 180C, maybe even 170C
<lf94>
The text looks too good to go back to walls
<lf94>
the last thing to finish this all off then will be a smooth top layer!
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<InPhase>
lf94: thingiverse encouraged sharing print settings, although most people don't. And thingiverse barely exists now.
<lf94>
I find thingiverse is as popular as it was last year
<lf94>
what are people using these days? printables?
<lf94>
that's the only other site I visit
<lf94>
and sometimes thangs
<lf94>
very rarely.
<InPhase>
I still grab things off of thingiverse, but with no adequate customizer I see no point adding things anymore. Most of my popular designs were customizer designs, and only the ones restricted to old language features work right there.
<InPhase>
Also just the interface got less comfortable to work with in many aspects.
<lf94>
I take it back
<lf94>
this isnt any better
<lf94>
it appeared better
<lf94>
but when applying the paint, it's clear it's not better
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<lf94>
I gotta increase the size like you said
<lf94>
also go slower
<lf94>
for the top layer
<lf94>
ironing, top slower, two layers instead for text
<lf94>
25 minutes...
<lf94>
ironing really adds to the time
<J23>
when you save the 3mf from a slicer it will contain model and slice settings
<J23>
but sharing slice settings only works if both have the same printer nozzle filament etc
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<lf94>
180C is helping tremendously with layer quality
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<linext>
i like ironing my decorative prints
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<linext>
you can even lower the tip of the nozzle slightly below the surface by 0.05mm and it will plane the surface
<linext>
makes a nice satin texture like denim
<lf94>
so uh yeah. im almost 100% convinced now that without dual extrusion, this is an absolute terrible idea.
<lf94>
The sizes are just too small, and the trade offs too terrible
<lf94>
I'm better off buying the 0.3mm thick paper and just printing like mentioned
<lf94>
At the very least I cut 3d print a cutting guide
<lf94>
and use an exacto to cut them out
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<lf94>
yep, this is the end of the line
<lf94>
was a fun experiment though
<lf94>
I really think dual extrusion wouldve saved this
<lf94>
also 0.1mm nozzle was fun but time to jump back to 0.6
<lf94>
this card idea would be ok for like some halloween thing
<lf94>
where it's hard to read on purpose
<lf94>
"yo...u wi..ll d.i..e in 7 da..y.s"
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