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<teepee>
yes, it's dead
<JordanBrown>
Does that mean "it could be given to them because it's dead" or "it could not be given to them because it's dead"?
<JordanBrown>
Or maybe "it's dead, but we wouldn't want to give it away as a separate forum because maybe sometime it can be resurrected linked to the mailing list".
<teepee>
it makes no sense to point people to a system that is not maintained, by the owners / developers of nabble
<JordanBrown>
I get the impression that Nabble is still in the forum business... just not in the "forum linked to e-mail list" business.
<JordanBrown>
Give the forum to the forum-lovers, *not* linked to the mailinst list. They can have the forum they want. They'd have to find somebody to administer it, of course.
<JordanBrown>
The only thing that's "magic" about the mailing list is that it's attached to openscad.org and so is in some sense "official". If somebody was willing to set up and administer a forum, it might be appropriate to let them have the name forum.openscad.org and give them a mention in the Community page
<JordanBrown>
on openscad.org.
<JordanBrown>
But if you and Michael don't want to administer a forum I wouldn't blame you. I don't want to either. Somebody who wants a forum should administer it.
<JordanBrown>
Of course, they might find that they would have a very small population, and that the Cool Kids weren't hanging out there. C'est la vie. If you want to hang out with the Cool Kids, you have to hang out in the places that the Cool Kids like.
<teepee>
I would not mind using a discourse hosting, but their official rates are slightly insane in my perspective
<teepee>
also I *really* hate that kind of multi-variable rate limiting where you have no idea which one you hit eventually and then you pay even more insane prices
<JordanBrown>
I haven't looked at it, but much more than zero seems too expensive.
<JordanBrown>
I don't know how much budget OpenSCAD has, but I assume that it's not a lot - and I'd much rather that it was spent on build infrastructure and the openscad.org web site.
<teepee>
something like $20 would be fine, some storage and backups are needed
<teepee>
but they start at $100/month next $300/month and next "enterprise"
<JordanBrown>
That's ridiculous.
<teepee>
as for the name shown in empathy posts, see my mail
<teepee>
it's taking it out of the From: "Display Name" <email.address.com>
<JordanBrown>
No surprise.
<teepee>
I changed the value in my thunderbird account setup and that shows up in empathy, so it's not the profile there
<teepee>
which sort of makes sense, it's a mailing list
<JordanBrown>
What's surprising is that it doesn't use the user's configured name when you post from Empathy.
<teepee>
I believe you can run just via mailing list with no account on empathy
<JordanBrown>
Yes, you can.
<JordanBrown>
(Well, I think you can.)
<teepee>
yeah, not sure what it takes then, I have not tried that
<JordanBrown>
But you can also have an Empathy account and read and post there, but for some reason it doesn't use your configured name.
<JordanBrown>
Perhaps we could have mailing lists 3dprinting@openscad.org and doing-openscad-like-things-in-a-different-language@openscad.org, and people who want those things could join them. Also can-we-have-a-forum-instead@openscad.org. But doing that would undoubtedly be more admin load.
<JordanBrown>
Generic 3d printing and programmatic CAD in another language are not part of the OpenSCAD mission, of course. But it would be good-citizen-like to support them, if the cost is minimal.
<teepee>
I really don't see the point of that. By now pretty much *every* discord server I've seen has a 3d-printing channel.
<JordanBrown>
Yeah, but eww.
<JordanBrown>
Chat systems are fine for realtime comms, but lousy for non-real-time.
<teepee>
yes, having only IRC would be a bad idea
<JordanBrown>
I do wonder about Slack instead of IRC.
<teepee>
nope, never ever
<JordanBrown>
Why not?
<teepee>
they invented the user lock-in in a very bad way
<teepee>
unless they dramatically changed their pricing strategy it's a horrible solution
<JordanBrown>
They do have a free variation.
<JordanBrown>
Without having used it, it doesn't look awful.
<teepee>
yes, a horrible one
<teepee>
now my info is not recent, but I've seen that crash life some time ago with the Boldport club
<teepee>
if you have 10 people it might be fine, if you have > 500 it's unusable
<JordanBrown>
Amusingly... one of the features that you get by paying is history. The free variation only has 90 days of history. At work, where we have 140K people using Slack, they deliberately have 1:1 messages expire after about two weeks.
<teepee>
(again, unless that changed, it's been a couple of years)
<teepee>
oof, it's even worse now I think
<JordanBrown>
The primary Slack channel that I live in at work is ~230 people, and it's OK. I mean, there's a lot of traffic, but I'm not sure that there's more than there is here.
<JordanBrown>
The "general" channel - which I think only covers my chunk of the org - has ~13K people. I don't hang out there, because they don't talk about things I'm interested in.
<teepee>
if it's a free account, you *only* have a general channel
<JordanBrown>
The company-wide "general" channel has ~150K people, but has restricted posting.
<JordanBrown>
No, the free plan lets you have multiple channels.
<JordanBrown>
But joining a workspace requires either an invitation or that your email address is from an approved-by-the-workspace-owner domain.
<JordanBrown>
Neither seem very friendly to public use.
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<peepsalot>
have we considered using gitter? iirc its kind of slack-like
<JordanBrown>
Don't know anything about it. But mostly I was just curious; nobody seems to be pushing to get off of IRC.
<peepsalot>
i've just seen a few projects using it here and there. they actually also offer an irc bridge apparently
<teepee>
I've seen it used some time ago, but that one was abandoned, I'm still getting a mail every 3 month when someone posts a message there :)
<teepee>
who owns that now, I seem to remember some changes in that regard
<JordanBrown>
Or we could use Twitter :-)
<teepee>
part of matrix now?
<teepee>
but then, it would be more an IRC replacement, not a forum/mailing-list replacement
<JordanBrown>
Right. And like I said, nobody seems to be calling for an IRC replacement.
<teepee>
nah, I do read twitter regularily but posting is mostly limited to retweeting for the openscad account
<JordanBrown>
I mean, if Slack could trivially substitute, I'd support it - I'm pretty happy with Slack at work - but it can't and so I'm not pushing for it.
<JordanBrown>
I have no opinion on gitter, and not enough interest in replacing IRC to spend the effort to investigate it.
<peepsalot>
i would think of it more as a supplement to IRC (for users more comfortable with web interface, not regulaer IRC'ers). but yeah its still not really a forum alternative
<peepsalot>
that is assuming we set it up to be bridged
<JordanBrown>
I haven't been happy with any IRC client that I've tried, and I really like that Slack (a) shows me stuff that happened while I didn't have a client running and (b) lets me edit my messages.
<JordanBrown>
But that unhappiness with IRC is not strong enough for me to do anything about it.
<teepee>
we already have the matrix bridge and the official mobile client for gitter seems to be element, so I guess there's not much point there
<peepsalot>
ok, i have to admit I still know nothing about matrix
<JordanBrown>
Same here.
<peepsalot>
teepee: is there a web page interface like that gitter link i pasted? for our channel?
<teepee>
that one ^ give a lot of options, including the "element" -> "open in browser"
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<jordanbrown0[m]>
Hello from Matrix / Element
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<HansLoeblich[m]>
hello?
<teepee>
hmm, slight drawback, you need an account
<teepee>
but I guess that's not such a huge deal
<peepsalot>
hmm, the element web client doesn't load history
<peepsalot>
i logged in with github
<JordanBrown>
It says it doesn't load history *from before you joined*.
<teepee>
no, I think you only see history once you joined, and the matrix brigde will kick idle matrix accounts after a while
<jordanbrown0[m]>
but it does seem to let me see stuff that came in while I didn't have a browser page on it.
<teepee>
that works for me
<teepee>
clicking the "jump to last read" went to Aug 29th
<teepee>
which was probably me just randomly clicking that tab in the browser
<peepsalot>
oh yes i see it says I "don't have permission" to view before I joined. that makes it sound like there is maybe a setting that can be changed by administrator?
<peepsalot>
or is there a reason to keep it that way?
<teepee>
that's likely on the matrix or bridge side, so I don't think we can change that
<teepee>
if there's a channel setting, I don't see a problem with allowing that, we are shouting "logged channel" anyway
<teepee>
also note that this matrix account is a not-logged-in-irc-account
<teepee>
which can be changed, but I never bothered to look at the details
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<teepee>
uh, logged in via stockholm, cool
<teepee>
there's maybe where the bridge is sitting
<JordanBrown[m]>
So what happens if I say something in italics?
<JordanBrown>
It comes through in IRC in italics. Cool.
<teepee>
indeed, probably annoying for vision impaired people though