03:37 <josHua[m]> hm interesting that did not make it over to IRC this time. I will xpost there

03:37 <joshua_> hm, would any Glasgow folks be willing to chat with me (either in public or in private) about the hardware sales / economics side of it? in particular, I am looking at spinning up a program to manufacture and sell some of the X1Plus Expansion Board, and it has a lot of the same characteristics as Glasgow does I think \

03:37 <joshua_> (open source hardware; a handful of contributors, but roughly one maintainer; has both a hardware and a software component; some number of people probably want to buy it, enough that distributing it myself is a bad play), and I'd like to see if I could pattern some from Glasgow to see what to expect

03:39 <joshua_> some vague questions I haev include, like: "how did you decide on pricing?"; "who took on the risk and who takes on the reward?" (answer to that, I presume, is 'absolutely everyone involved took a bath'); "what was your experience like working with CrowdSupply?"; "is this 10 times as bad of an idea as I think it is, or is it actually 20 times as bad?"

08:29 <theorbtwo[m]> I'm not sure Glasgow is necessarily a great case to draw conclusions from, because COVID and great chip shortage hit it hard and hopefully won't be repeated.

08:45 <whitequark[cis]> <joshua_> "some vague questions I haev..." <- i do not get any commission from sales nor has there ever been an agreement that i will

08:46 <whitequark[cis]> (from my perspective, materially, every unit sold is a support cost)

08:48 <theorbtwo[m]> Are you expecting Glasgow to give you exposure and lead to more / better commercial gigs, or are you just really nice to us?

09:37 <joshua_> I feared this would be the case and I feared I would stir up sleeping dragons :) broadly every installed unit for me is also a support cost right now and I imagine that would continue to be the case, and if I was astonishignly lucky, I would make up for my time spent on the manufacturing logistics, but not the engineering

09:38 <joshua_> theorbtwo[m], those specific events hit Glasgow and those particular events happened to be pretty rough as The Glitch For This Mission, but that said, I don't know of a crowdfunding campaign that isn't at least a *little* bit of a clusterfuck

09:39 <joshua_> (but I also sort of anticipated that the every-unit-sold-is-a-support-cost would be part of my hypothesized 'absolutely everybody involved took a bath')

13:53 <whitequark[cis]> <theorbtwo[m]> "Are you expecting Glasgow to..." <- latter

13:54 <whitequark[cis]> glasgow is essentially like a second job i have

13:55 <whitequark[cis]> it is only bearable at all given my extensive disability and very little support i get because there is significant overlap (amaranth stuff) between my FTE and this project

13:57 <galibert[m]> Glasgow is nice as a public use case for amaranth

13:59 <whitequark[cis]> it's kinda the og use case

13:59 <whitequark[cis]> but also nearly everything my employer wants from amaranth is or will be OSS

14:00 <galibert[m]> Sure, but (most of) your employer’s clients used cases are not going to be public

14:01 <galibert[m]> Glasgow gives public examples of real use

14:02 <whitequark[cis]> I feel like the Glasgow *toplevel* is weird and special enough that that doesn't do much for most projects

14:03 <whitequark[cis]> it isn't a SoC

20:46 <hysiact[m]> My Glasgow arrived today! Hurray!

20:48 <whitequark[cis]> niiiiice

20:54 <joshua_> yeah, I understand this. my X1Plus work is largely associated with somewhere between 'I don't know how to not have a hobby project' and 'also I feel a little guilty that I started this thing and if I walked away from it I would be abandoning a lot of users' (the latter is a bad situation for at least brains shaped like mine to be in)

20:55 <whitequark[cis]> ouch

20:55 <whitequark[cis]> what's X1Plus?

20:57 <joshua_> custom firmware modification for Bambu Lab X1 Carbon as overlay for stock firmware; somewhat cursed https://github.com/x1plus/x1plus/?tab=readme-ov-file#how-does-x1plus-work-from-the-printers-perspective

20:57 <whitequark[cis]> oh

20:58 <whitequark[cis]> wow that's a massive amount of work

20:59 <joshua_> this is sort of why it reminds me of Glasgow and I hope to learn from Glasgow. it is a lot of engineering effort; the innards are extremely fiddly, so the outside of it is possible to contribute to but the innards really are difficult to have transferable maintainability; and there is a hardware component

20:59 <joshua_> well, there is now a hardware component, at least

21:32 <Attie[m]> installing kexec into an unwilling environment with a crowbar... uh, good job!(?)

21:40 <sigstoat[m]> got any big plans for it?

22:10 <ebb> ...they gave a printer the same name as a laptop?

22:10 <ebb> (for a second I thought it was some kind of aftermarket customs thinkpad)