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<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Could something like this work on OPI5?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> what... the everloving *fuck* is that? SATA to M.2 on a USB-C to M.2 adapter board?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I guess so
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> what... the everloving *fuck* is that? SATA to M.2 on a M.2 to USB-C adapter board?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> it *could*, depending on the controller it uses
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> https://a.aliexpress.com/_EvKMLH2
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> What im wondering is how can m2 work over usb, isnt that thunderbolt?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> M.2 has USB lanes depending on the keying, that board is a JM575 + JMS580, i'll look them up
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> right, JM575 *doesn't exist*, JMS580 is a Micron USB SATA adapter, supports UAS, *should work* on oPi5, though probably not particularly fast, i've been unable to get UAS to work over USB3 on oPi5
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Probably JMB574
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Probably JMB575
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Probably JMB575
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Probably JMB575*
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Probably JMB575*
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> right, JM575 *doesn't exist*, JMS580 is a JMicron USB SATA adapter, supports UAS, *should work* on oPi5, though probably not particularly fast, i've been unable to get UAS to work over USB3 on oPi5
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> probably, though that begs the question as to whether it's the 575 or the 580, because there's slightly different features between the two
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> So then this is "the best" way to get multiple sata ports on SBCs?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> ~~probably, though that begs the question as to whether it's the 575 or the 580, because there's slightly different features between the two~~
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> JM*B* is the port multiplier
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> oh god that's... garbage
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I mean, I was thinking of using a plain shorted ATX PSU with something that does USB > SATA
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> For 3,5"
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> there's a hard cap of 6Gb/s between all the drives there
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> For multiple 3,5"
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Theres no possibility to go faster anyway?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Also, imo thats more then enough as it is
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i assume there *are* faster USB-SATA chipsets, or rather, multi-channel ones, because port-multipliers are horrible
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Which ones?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I believe i was sleeping or braindead in the past years
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Are these old or new methods?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> it's all fairly old tech, SATA itself is 😅
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i do not know of any, i don't have any SATA in active service
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I ment from single USB port to multiple SATA 😛
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> there's plenty of fancy enclosures that do it, so the chipsets definitely exist, i just don't know what they are 😅
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> not particularly new, though not using a port multiplier is probably new-ish because USB 2 can't saturate SATA 3
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> You mean port multiplier for SATA or for USB, like usb hub?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Im reading now on reddit and found someone using plain old usb hub with multiple plain sata enclosures, what i was always thinking it was the only possible way
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Did not even know that "sata multipliers" exist
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Having multiple SATA 3,5" hdds is the major downside of SBCs and modern x86 motherboards. But now i guess not anymore
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I thought that exactly this was the only way 😄
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> having multiple SATA drives is antithetical to running an SBC imo
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> port multiplier for SATA, they literally divide the bandwidth between all the drives attached, and can cause issues with certain multi-drive configs like ZFS
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> how else do you imagine a NAS woudl be done?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> how else do you imagine a NAS wouldc be done?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> how else do you imagine a NAS would be done?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> hdd storage is cheap but for better performance and/or reliability you need to put them in an array
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> Yes NVMe ssds are an option but good ones are not cheap
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> on a platform that natively supports multiple SATA drives of course ;)
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i just hate port multipliers because they're always the first thing to go wrong
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> then it's about multiple drives on a sata port multiplier, on on an SBC.
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> Something like radxa penta hat eliminates that kind of bottleneck iirc
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> then it's about multiple drives on a sata port multiplier, on on an SBC.
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> Something like radxa penta hat eliminates that kind of bottleneck I think
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> (if the platform only supports one full sata port)
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> what chipset does the penta hat use? they don't appear to document it, is it not also a port multiplier?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> > It utilizes the high speed PCIe buses on ROCK Series
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> if it's the JMB585 it's... *fine*, i still don't like them though
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> Yeah I think it's JMB585
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> they're kinda daft for their intended use though, because they're supposed to be used on boards with GbE
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> and when there's Intel boxes with more native SATA *and* 2.5GbE around the same price, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Exactly what im thinking for years for a "cheap" DIY NAS made with a SBC
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> No ZFS and nothing extra. Just cheap 3.5" hdds
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> @menu , i just studied everything around USB controllers+multipliers and SATA controllers+multipliers and I also think that one from aliexpress should work
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I didnt know SATA multipliers existed 😄
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> it will *work*, it may cause issues down the line which is why i dislike them
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> So if I buy a SATA controller and connect upstream port onto an old intel motherboards sata port, and 5 hdds into multiplier, what will BIOS say? Instead of 6 sata ports suddenly it has 10 ports?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Understood. I kinda agree but I need to test it myself just for the fun of it
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> So if I buy a SATA multiplier* and connect upstream port onto an old intel motherboards sata port, and 5 hdds into multiplier, what will BIOS say? Instead of 6 sata ports suddenly it has 10 ports?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Also, theres also USB>PCIE chipsets (JMS586A). Would this and pure M2 PCIE SATA controllers like ASM1166 work ?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I have this C60M1-i that *could* finally go to trash
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I have this C60M1-i since it came out that *could* finally go to trash
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Nvm, cant even find an adapter like this
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> How to secure ASM1166 M2 onto the OPI5's M2 2242 slot ?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> a screw and standoff is the "correct" way
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Slot is 2242, card is 2280
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i use one of these cases, they have mounting spots for longer drives:
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> commonly available from various retailers, not always under the same brand name
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <johnthecoolingfan> Different board, same problem, 3d printed solution: <https://www.reddit.com/r/BIGTREETECH/comments/1d7790r/ive_put_a_2280_nvme_ssd_on_the_bigtreetech_pi_2/>
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Thats kinda the only way, besides that case from menu. I wonder why that is the only example on internet... Still should be somewhat wobbly
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Thats kinda the only way, besides that case from menu. I wonder why that is the only example on internet... Still should be somewhat wobbly but fine
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Official OPI5 case has an openning for longer M2 cards, but no securing mechanism
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> but my RK3568 is running 3x HDD‘s and 2x SATA SSD's over one of those JMB585 controllers 😂
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> just straight from the M.2 slot and the OS is on emmc.
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> the 2 SSD's are a recent addition and I'm running them in a BTRFS Raid 1 and put my docker there since that was like >80% of the emmc
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> I'm thinking of replacing the RK3568 though as its single core performance is struggling at just around a gigabit when it isn’t a single ext4 drive
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> horrible
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> why it’s been working great for years now actually
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i'm honestly more surprised the eMMC hasn't failed first
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> it really is my only worry with the NanoPi R5S but it’s emmc is also only at its second stage of lifetime
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> now that I have moved docker onto a raid1 ssd array I don’t worry about it as much
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> *every* MMC based machine I've owned has killed the MMC fairly quickly :(
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> how's the networking performance on RK3582? looking at a Radxa E52C potentially as a router
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> My only ever mmc "death" was a software caused one on ubuntu-rockchip as there was a bug with emmc command queuing. Erasing and running it with armbian on my Rock5B has been stable
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> Maybe take a look at something like the OpenWRT one or similar BPI's (up to R3 should be stable)? HW accel on networking is pretty nice
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> better performance than 3582? ideally i'd be able to fully saturate a 2.3G link
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i'm still unsure whether i want arm or x86_64 for the router tbh
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <dams0869> Hello is it possible to have CONFIG_PSI enabled in the mainline kernel? it's for waydorid
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <dams0869> Hello is it possible to have CONFIG_PSI enabled in the mainline kernel? it's for waydoid
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <dams0869> Hello is it possible to have CONFIG_PSI enabled in the mainline kernel? it's for waydroid
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> I mean if power is cheap where you are
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> power is very expensive, but the newer Intel stuff (N100 etc.) is incredibly efficient, roughly the same TDP
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> Usually the arm stuff is still 50% less than the n100 in my testings
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> 2-5w on arm
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> while I've reading 7-12w on n100
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> anything under 20W is *fine*
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> because any router i get will pull 15-20W
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> Yeah then I wouldn’t even bother with anything else and just get one of those aliexpress n100's with DDR5 and like a bunch of 2.5GbE ports
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> considering you aren’t limited to openwrt then
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> it'll be running PVE, because it doesn't make sense to run anything else, not a clue what the router OS will be though
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I was thinking for a long time something similar:
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> 1) OPI5 with ASM1166 on the back
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> 2) OS on samsung pro endurance microsd (i had this 128GB microsd in HAOS on odroic2 for 3 years and it miracously !!DIDNT!! fail)
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> A simple NAS, nothing special. The only special thing is the SATA controller and how to connect the power and stuff.
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> What router?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> And also, do you need 2,5gbe?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <mecoblock> theres of course things you can do better / different but pico psu + a case that handles power input (in my case through two mooed ports) is a solid option.
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> yes, and it needs to be 2.5Gb *throughput*
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> when we relocate we'll likely be getting 2.3G XGS-PON, with a potential upgrade to 10G by 2026Q2
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Check glinet mt6000
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Its probably way less then 15W. My redmis ax6000 are only ~8W
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> For 10G sfp i would go for bpi-r4
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Im wondering, what are you now using?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Nice find! Is this yours? I thought I was crazy and now it turns out im living under a rock
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I got 2U 12bay case + pico psus/seasonic 400w platinum fanless. The only thing thats missing is ASM1166/JMB585
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> not fast enough
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> and i've no particular desire to combine wifi into the same device
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> But what im also really thinking, since this home assistant OPI5 is secured on a wall, is that USB sata from aliexpress that I linked, and HDD vertical "bay" (which is not really a bay) from an old fractal design ATX case, that would be screwed horizontally onto wall, next to OPI5 😛
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Kinda redneck visually, but imo its genius because everything is logical and solidly mounted
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Then BPI-R4 is ideal imo
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> You sure? Did you test?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> listed specs literally aren't quick enough
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> You need pppoe?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> unsure yet, we don't have the location so can't confirm which ISP/ONT combo we'll end up with
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> but i *do* need to be able to run wireguard at above-gigabit speeds ideally
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> So what are you now running, x86?
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> at the moment i'm still running standard GbE from my ISP-supplied crap, this is not going to be the case when we relocate
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i'm definitely eyeing up the bpi r4 though, the dual-SFP+ is very tempting, especially if i can persuade the ISP to give me an ONT with SFP+ for direct connect
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i do wish they'd stop hamstringing these devices by making *all* the other ports gigabit, but i digress
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> I have everything gigabit in my home and dont have a need to have more
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Main router is running LACP 2x1Gbe to the main switch though
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <menu> i still need to hunt down the elusive ThunderBolt 2 NIC
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> What im searching is a managed 48p switch that has the lowest possible power consumption
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> The current 48p drains 15W when all ports are disabled and 25W when all enabled
<DC-IRC> [Discord] <gospod13337> Should not be that much i guess but electricity is expensive