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<beach> Good morning everyone!
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<pjb> Colleen: clhs 5.2
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<hirez> so I wrote an implementation of graham's scan in CL and it actually works :D
<hirez> its so elegant looking in cl, lol. If anyone has any feedback on how I can make this more...canonical lisp I'd appreciate it
<beach> (setf i (+ i 1)) is better expressed as (incf i)
<beach> There is no need for a newline after LET* when the body lines are not long.
<hirez> old habits from less refined languages die very hard
<hirez> haha
<hirez> okay cool
<hirez> thank you :D
<beach> Similarly, no need for a newline after a PROGN.
<hirez> I see yeah, paredit cleans up nicely when I remove it.
<beach> Instead of using PUSH and REVERSE, you can use COLLECT in LOOP.
<moon-child> hirez: I think it would be cleaner to avoid the pushes in the body, as in (let* ... (stack (list (pop sorted) min))
<hirez> Could I? I basically have to hold an element in `sorted` based on the `left` function. I will read up on collect.
<hirez> Im not sure how I could avoid the push because the algorithm is dependent on a stack. I'd be interested in hearing how to avoid it.
<beach> hirez: You would need an IF clause in the LOOP.
<hirez> I see, I'll crack open the hyperspec again.
<hirez> haha
<hirez> ooh I see what you mean moon-child
<hirez> sorry
<hirez> yes indeed I can remove those
<moon-child> (that's a matter of personal style, though; others would consider it more consistent to view the algorithm as a sequence of pushes onto an empty list)
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<dsk> hirez: It's best not to try to destructively modify a literal object. That has undefined consequences.
<dsk> You can cons up a fresh empty list with (list) instead of using '().
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<beach> dsk: That's not correct.
<moon-child> (list) doesn't cons anything, it returns NIL
<dsk> TIL :\
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<beach> dsk: '() is just the empty list, and nothing is destructively modified.
<moon-child> '() is a perfectly fine, well-understood, and self-documenting way of producing an empty list
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<beach> dsk: Even using PUSH after initializing to something like '(a b c) is fine.
<phoe> you can't really mutate '() in Common Lisp
<beach> PUSH does not modify the object.
<phoe> like, ever
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<phoe> the only thing I can imagine is modifying the SYMBOL-NAME of NIL, but that has nothing to do with lists
<dsk> I apologize, not sure where I got that idea.
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<dsk> It seems obvious that (push thing stack) is equivalent (setf stack (cons thing stack)) so that wouldn't be an issue. But is (setf (car '(foo)) 'bar) okay?
<phoe> very no
<phoe> '(foo) is a literal list and therefore mutating it is UB
<phoe> and mutating its CAR counts as mutating it
<dsk> Ah, okay, good. Not *completely* losing it.
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<phoe> it's just that '(), treated as a list, has no components to mutate
<phoe> so it can't be mutated
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<dsk> Right. Somehow my brain went on the fritz and told me that NIL is actually a cons, the CAR and CDR of which are both NIL.
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<dsk> But I understand that while the CAR and CDR of NIL are both NIL, it is not a cons, though it is a list, and there's only one of it.
<phoe> CAR and CDR of NIL are special cases
<phoe> NIL isn't a cons, correct
<moon-child> imagine if you could (setf (car nil) ...)
<dsk> I feel like that may have been possible in some historical Lisp.
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<dsk> XD
<phoe> oh no
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<Duuqnd> If I wanted to have a reader macro that works in one file or one package (whichever is easier) how would I go about doing that?
<beach> You put it in a specific readtable and you make sure that readtable is current in the file.
<phoe> Duuqnd: named-readtables
<Duuqnd> Thanks
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<jmercouris> a way to get the file modified time using osicat?
<jmercouris> or iolib
<jmercouris> or anything really other than sbcl specific funtions
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<beach> jmercouris: I don't have any plans to look at the code for Nyxt. I was just planning to use it.
<Bike> does cl:file-write-date not work? i haven't used it myself
<jmercouris> beach: perhaps a wise idea :-)
<jmercouris> Bike: perfect, I did not know of its existence
<jmercouris> thanks
<Bike> great
<phoe> TIL
<Josh_2> There is a uiop:safe-file-write-date as well
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<jmercouris> I see, it is a little wrapper to avoid file sys errors
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<Inline> why are some clx demos not rendering properly ?
<jmercouris> hard to say, there could be a million reasons
<Inline> some are pretty ok
<Inline> bounce does not render anything
<Inline> bouncing ball renders again
<Inline> weird
<Fade> I'm seeing a weird failure in Sly I haven't encountered before. When I press ',' to enter a REPL shortcut, the comma isn't captured and secondary shortcut entry doesn't pop up. I just get the raw comma in the REPL. have any of you encountered this?
<jmercouris> Fade: perhaps the cursor has included an extra space?
<jmercouris> and it is not obvious?
<Fade> if there's a space it doesn't exist in any context that I can interact with it using the standard emacs machinery.
<jmercouris> it has happend to me other times in other buffers that use the LUI library
<jmercouris> or whatever it is called
<jmercouris> it is a library used by circe and others to show like a prompt and history, like in the REPL
<Fade> I'm not getting an error, I'm just not getting the command, so I'm not surehow to debug it.
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<blizzard> oh no :o
<blizzard> what happened to minion
<jackdaniel> blizzard: minion decided that he stays with freenode :)
<jackdaniel> (in fact: I don't know)
<beach> blizzard: Never joined. You have to make do with Colleen.
<beach> Colleen is not as witty as minion, but is pretty competent.
<jackdaniel> Colleen: tell us something about yourself.
<Colleen> us: Unknown command. Possible matches: 8, time, set, say, mop, roll, get, search, login, grant,
<beach> blizzard: Are you looking for some particular functionality of minion?
<blizzard> i was just curious beach :3
<blizzard> iirc minion gets its wit from eliza's responses, right?
<Bike> i think they're even more fixed than eliza.
<Fade> hum. it only seems to be happening with the one system I'm trying to work on. my other systems behave normally. sly behaves normally prior to any nonefault systems being loaded.
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<flip214> jackdaniel: PR to move to libera submitted.
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<flip214> *move lisp-bots
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<Fade> well, for posterity, the answer is loading the system :clog will do some violence to your Sly REPL
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<Josh_2> Hi, I have these classes https://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/2486#2486 but when I try to make an instance of one-hundred I get the condition "IPN-PAYMENT-SUCCESS is a forward referenced class .. IPN-PAYMENT-SUCCESS is a direct superclass" how do I fix this?
<beach> It means you haven't defined IPN-PAYMENT-SUCCESS.
<beach> You misspelled it.
<beach> SUCESS instead of SUCCESS.
<Josh_2> oops
<Josh_2> ofcoursee
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<Josh_2> Always best when its a silly error
<_death> forward-refernce-classes are pretty neat.. a nice example of change-class
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<Inline> ok, i found the problem with qix
<Inline> there is a xlib:display-force-output *display* when replaced with xlib:display-finish-output it works as expected
<Nilby> The face when DISPLAY is not set
<Nilby> :0
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<Inline> ok, the only difference between the two seems to be this: both force any buffered output to be sent to the X server, but finish-output is the only one waiting till all requests are received and processed by the X server
<Inline> hmmm
<Inline> ah it's the same error with petal
<Inline> there it uses force-output too
<Inline> so nothing gets drawn here over
<Inline> i get a white window but nothing happens
<Inline> will change that too
<Nilby> When I'm working with CLX interactively I often make it put an implicit display-finish-output after every repl comamnd.
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<Inline> oooh
<Inline> now i get the bouce example
<Inline> bounce*
<Inline> both shove-bounce and bounce are wrong
<Inline> tho they depend only on 1 definition
<Inline> wait
<Inline> i got both working now
<Inline> the windows themselves are supposed to be empty, but the windows themselves are the bouncing ones
<Inline> i.e. bounce bounces to the bottom then up then down decreasingly
<Inline> and shove does the same whilst heading to the right
<Inline> i'll post the corrected example
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<Inline> ok i think now i got all the demos working correctly
<Inline> the bounce and shove bounce demos are not about things jumping inside windows, they are about the windows itself jumping around in some manner
<Inline> mine head down to the bottom of my screen as if i have left a ball down on the floor
<Inline> and the shove bounce is similar it just has a velocity to the right too
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<Inline> if i knew who the maintainer of CLX was i'd just post the examples (the corrections as a diff file) maybe
<Nilby> for the version in quicklisp
<dieggsy> is there an easy way of calling some code inline at macro expansion time without another defmacro ?
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<Nilby> You can just call any function that's allready defined when the macro is being defined.
<Nilby> I'm not sure if that's what you mean? but something like: (defmacro foo (x) `(print ,(sqrt x)))
<dieggsy> Nilby: i think im basically asking for the macro-equivalent of a lambda. like an unnamed macro that i can call/expand inline
<dieggsy> i suppose you could just write... some macro that does this generically lol
<dieggsy> but if there was already a built-in way
<Nilby> macrolet ?
<dieggsy> still named, though local
<dieggsy> fair
<Josh_2> With ironclad a 'sha512 hmac' requires making a hmac-digest with my private key, then using hmac-digest with the octets I wish to digest?
<Josh_2> Can't for the life of me get the same output as the example :(
<Josh_2> ah frick
<Josh_2> Finally did it
<Josh_2> Another one of those silly mistakes
<flip214> Josh_2: I'm using (ironclad::hkdf-extract 'ironclad:sha256 secret string), what are you doing?
<Nilby> dieggsy: If you have an example of what you want to do, it's likely someone here can come up with a nice way.
<dieggsy> Nilby: it would literally be like an inline (mexpand (format nil "~a~b" "foo" "bar")) becomes "foobar" in the compiled code. As opposed to having to (defmacro thing () (format nil "~a~b" "foo" "bar")) and calling (thing). I can of course just write that mexpand macro myself, was just wondering if there's some clever built-in i don't know about
<dieggsy> in fact, i'm fairly certain that's just as easy as (defmacro mexpand (exp) ',exp)
<dieggsy> er, backquote that is, not regular quote
<Josh_2> Well I can't seem to get it
<Josh_2> flip214: heres what I'm trying to do https://plaster.tymoon.eu/view/2487#2487
<Josh_2> I tried using babel:octets-to-string but that always fails :(
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<dieggsy> macro it is then
<dieggsy> i'm not against writing a macro, just would be nice if we had a built-in inline form that does the same. of course, when you can write that yourself, no point baking in every little thing into the language lol
<dieggsy> yay lisp heh
<Nilby> _death: That's cool! I kind of hope I don't have to use it.
<Nilby> I have used a gensym'd macrolet at least once though.
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<eta> dieggsy: are you thinking of #.
<_death> Nilby: I think making docstring mandatory in METALIST was a good idea
<Nilby> Indeed.
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<dieggsy> eta: Oh, neat. maybe i am
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<Josh_2> flip214: lul hkdf-extract works :P thanks
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<dieggsy> I'm doing something kind of weird and injecting a "git status" output into code as a string at macro expansion time
<dieggsy> it seems that this works even if i start lisp outside of that git directory
<dieggsy> is that just chance, or is it somehow guaranteed that files are somehow compiled within the context of where they are in the file ssytem
<dieggsy> oh, nevermind, i'm an idito
<dieggsy> i have a (with-current-directoy ...) going on. excellent. no magic here
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<dieggsy> it's quite weird that pathname-directory doesn't return a pathname - am I using the wrong function?
<Josh_2> wow
<Josh_2> finally figured it out, turns out in one place you use a private key, the other you have to use a different key
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<Inline> oook, but still this qix example is somehow wrong
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<MichaelRaskin> dieggsy: pathname-directory is «directory of pathname»
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<waleee> fe[nl]ix: around?
<waleee> is a lack of /etc/hosts on linux a known bug of iolib/sockets:lookup-hostname ?
<waleee> (that it fails if /etc/hosts doesn't exist)
<pjb> waleee: I don't think there's a hard requirements for most /etc/ files. There's a standard sysexit code for such an occurence: EX_OSFILE
<pjb> waleee: the question is how does it fail, and can you exit with that sysexits code?
<pjb> waleee: another consideration is that there's a configuration to specify what resource, and in what order, is used to perform various lookups, including DNS lookups.
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<waleee> pjb: thanks for the resources
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<waleee> pjb: it fails with "Failed to find the WRITE-DATE of /etc/hosts: No such file or directory"
<waleee> another person with another distro got a timeout instead
<waleee> but he connects via a homeserver that uses wireguard
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<pjb> Well, as mentionned, if it's a system with nss, the file may not exist.
<pjb> One should use the API.
<pjb> gethostbyname(3) etc.
<waleee> forgive my noobness, but is it a function in iolib/sockets ?
<pjb> gethostent() if you need to scan all the entries (for some value of "all", depending on the configuration, and what's available locally, I guess).
<pjb> waleee: no, it's a posix function. It should be used by iolib/sockets instead of reading /etc/hosts.
<waleee> doesn't seem to do that
<pjb> Report a bug.
<pjb> In the meantime, you can patch your copy of iolib.sockets.
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<waleee> wtf my email was registered on a ubuntu one-account (needed for launchpad bug-reports)
<waleee> oh, I had registered on launchpad about 15 years ago
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<waleee> of course the launchpad wasn't actively used
<jcowan> In exactly no lisps can you mutate (); it's an atomic object like 5.
<jcowan> (You can in Python)
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<pjb> jcowan: you could in some lisp.
<jcowan> Which?
<pjb> jcowan: (psetf nil t t nil) was a famous hack.
<pjb> jcowan: perhaps on lisp machine lisp?
<pjb> Nowadays, there are constant variables so such an occurence is detected.
<jcowan> That changes the definitions of the symbols t and nil, which is not the same as mutating either one (or any othr symbol)
<pjb> Oh, like changing their name?
<moon-child> sounds like smalltalk 'become'
<pjb> Well, it is possible that an implementation uses the string passed to intern or make-symbol as string name, and if you mutate this string you could thus change the symbol name.
<pjb> But again, modern CL implementations have protections to prevent that.