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<ark> hello
<ark> what is the difference between uImage, zImage and Image?
<ark> with regards to the final compiled linux kernel image
<zmatt> is google down? :P
<ark> no, lol, but I wanted to ask here
<ark> idk why
<zmatt> anyway, zImage is what you normally use
<zmatt> it's the compressed kernel as self-extracting executable
<zmatt> uImage is some uboot-specific thing that I think is legacy, I've only ever used zImage with u-boot
<ark> last time I compiled I used Image
<ark> instead of zImage
<zmatt> Image is normally never used, it's an intermediate build product
<zmatt> (from which the zImage is produced)
<ark> ooh
<ark> I will try zImage then
<ark> btw, how is the extraction done? is there program running for that?
<zmatt> like I said, it's a self-extracting executable
<ark> like an egg?
<zmatt> so the bootloader doesn't know or care it's a compressed kernel, it just executes it
<ark> oh
<zmatt> every linux distro I know of uses zImage, typically installed as /boot/vmlinuz-VERSION
<ark> does it has anything to do with xz?
<zmatt> the compression used is selectable in the kernel config
<zmatt> the kernel on my laptop (debian sid, kernel 5.14.0-2-amd64) uses xz, the standard beaglebone kernels use lzo... at least 4.14-ti though 5.4-ti do, it seems 5.10-ti uses xz for some reason
<zmatt> (xz has better compression ratio, but lzo decompresses much faster)
<zmatt> there's a performance trade-off: the slower disk i/o is compared to cpu performance, the more worthwhile it is to compress better at the expense of slower decompression
<zmatt> since total time to load the kernel is the time to load the compressed kernel + time to decompress it
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<zmatt> rcn-ee_: was the switch from CONFIG_KERNEL_LZO=y in 5.4-ti to CONFIG_KERNEL_XZ=y in 5.10-ti a deliberate choice or an accident?
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<rcn-ee_> i think an accident..
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<dkaiser> Any experience getting Xfce to work on BeagleBone Black?
<zmatt> I'd assume the same as any other debian system?
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<dkaiser> zmatt, It is not working for me "out of the box". I've installed Xfce many times on Debian/Ubuntu Intel boxes/VM's--no problem. I am looking for information relevant to debugging it.
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<zmatt> the only peculiarity I can think of is that you may need to force 16-bit color depth
<dkaiser> zmatt, How do I affect that?
<zmatt> no idea, it's been aaaages since I've done anything with X11 on a bbb
<dkaiser> apparently, Xfce may no longer be X-based.
<dkaiser> (based on a limited perusal of the documentation)
<zmatt> interesting, the bbb ships with an xorg.conf file, but the "DefaultDepth 16" line is commented out
<zmatt> so maybe that's not needed anymore
<zmatt> (x11 _ought_ to be able to autodetect supported pixel formats)
<dkaiser> Any pointers to documentation for starting to investigate how this Xfce system is architected and fits into the rest of Debian?
<zmatt> I don't know anything about xfce
<dkaiser> I could start with investigating what the "systemctl set-default" call does in Debian...
<zmatt> the same thing it does on any other systemd-based linux system... makes a symlink to
<zmatt> ( is normally either a symlink to or
<dkaiser> That part is clear. Now, what does the linux system do with this link? I figure that this might be a good starting place for understanding where the failure is.
<zmatt> it's ... the default target
<zmatt> the target that's started at boot
<zmatt> i.e. it determines which services are started at boot
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<dkaiser> zmatt, thanks for the feedback. I have much to learn...
<zmatt> see for descriptions of various targets and for an overview of startup flow
<rcn-ee_> dkaiser, what did you use for xorg.conf?
<dkaiser> zmatt, thanks again. Very helpful links to get started!
<dkaiser> rcn-ee: I have not done anything to create/modify xorg.conf.
<rcn-ee_> dkaiser, the 'modesetting' driver has been broken forever on the am335x...
<rcn-ee_> dkaiser, go here and scroll down to "hdmi" install the 3 apt pacakages and setup the xorg.conf:
<rcn-ee_> zmatt, oh the old 16bit setting that was for the omap3_beagle... trying to get any 2d performance out of it! ;)
<zmatt> I mean, you really do want a 16-bit framebuffer on the bbb
<zmatt> given that it only has a 16-bit output, and also it doesn't support a normal 32-bit pixel format
<rcn-ee_> yeah, for the hdmi.. but i think xorg figures that out correctly..
<rcn-ee_> (aka from the device tree bit setting..) the xorg.conf force 16bit was more for the pre-device tree era when all we had was the omap3 beagle's..
<zmatt> yeah presumably it's like "XBGR8888 ? what? nope, ok then RGB565 it is"
<rcn-ee_> the omap also had it's own xorg 'omap' driver.. vs the fbdev/modesetting driver we use for am335x now days..
<zmatt> I'd presume force 16-bit was also necessary back then lcdc still claimed it supported XRGB8888
<zmatt> I've never used an omap-based beagleboard, I'm definitely talking about the bbb
<rcn-ee_> i was looking thru the xorg.conf generation code, the "DefaultDepth 16" line depended on saying it was an omap3_beagle:
<zmatt> maybe my memory is just wrong but I'm pretty sure 16-bit was forced *somewhere*...
<rcn-ee_> dkaiser, i stumbled on a nice guide for a small xfce about a week ago:
<zmatt> when was the "blue-and-red-wiring" DT property introduced? prior to that forcing the depth to 16-bit would have been mandatory if you wanted correct colors
<dkaiser> rcn-ee: Once I get Xfce up and running (via your link to Digikey url, etc), do you expect I will run into issues getting xRDP up and running?
<rcn-ee_> dkaiser, xRDP? maybe... i just used that minimal xfce + novnc guide:
<rcn-ee_> they used tigervnc-standlone-server
<rcn-ee_> i did a few port forwards to get the desktop live over the interent.. (do open XCTU and configure some XBee's..)
<dkaiser> rcn-ee: I will try RDP first, and go to VNC if that fails. I have many years of (whisper voice->) Windows centric experience, including RDP to many different machines and VM's.
<rcn-ee_> no worries, i just like the 'novnc' experience, you just need a web browser... no local client required..
<dkaiser> zmatt and rcn-ee: Thanks again for all of your help. Now, to get busy with study and configuration...
<rcn-ee_> zmatt, did you notice anything else off full in v5.10.x, i'm rolling in a ble fix for the gateway, right now along with back to lzo..
<zmatt> I haven't really done much with 5.x yet
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