01:24 <d1b2> <gatin00b> I've been reading more on the Array class and my understanding is that I could reduce the mux size by first slicing the array to a portion of what would be indexable by a Value. Same if I have an offset, riht?

01:25 <d1b2> <gatin00b> Otherwise, Amaranth assumes worst case scenario with the full size of the Array.

01:36 <d1b2> <gatin00b> Ok, it needs to be "typecasted" back into an array first, but that seems to work.

01:36 <d1b2> <gatin00b> It reduces the size of the proxy which should reduce the size of the mux (if I understand correctly)

01:42 <bentomo> Is there a way to to adjust the style of the amaranth.back.verilog.convert function? I see that it calls yosys under the covers but when it converts back from rtlil there are a lot of \$num stand-ins and I'm wondering if it's possible to omit these.

01:44 <tpw_rules> you can reduce them by naming more of your signals iir

01:44 <tpw_rules> c

01:47 <bentomo> Ah, -norename is right there in the yosys documentation

01:58 <_whitenotifier> [YoWASP/yosys] whitequark pushed 1 commit to develop [+0/-0/±1] https://github.com/YoWASP/yosys/compare/8b1bc9b30bed...ffe8ccfaacc6

01:58 <_whitenotifier> [YoWASP/yosys] whitequark ffe8ccf - Update dependencies.

04:20 <bentomo> So what's the best way to comply with the second clause of the amaranth BSD? How do I get the generated binary to reproduce the copyright license if I'm just using it to generate verilog? Do I need to include a BRAM somewhere that the license can be read out of? How do I comply with that, other than documentation?

04:24 <whitequark> I don't think anything Amaranth does results in "redistribution in binary form"

04:25 <whitequark> though I'm also not a lawyer

04:26 <whitequark> in any case, what you are distributing is e.g. a bitstream, or a product, or something like that, right?

04:27 <whitequark> in that case, you could put LICENSE.txt next to the bitstream file, or in a (probably rather long) list of licenses you ship with the product, or the like

08:55 <RobertJrdens[m]> I think the intention would be that analogously to [other compilers](https://www.gnu.org/licenses/gpl-faq.en.html#CanIUseGPLToolsForNF) the amaranth ("compiler") license doesn't cover the code you write. Using the amaranth library (e.g. its `SyncFIFO`) however does produce things that would be covered by its license. But it's sufficient to include the license with the "distribution", i.e. distribute the license text file

08:55 <RobertJrdens[m]> together with the binary file as Catherine says. It doesn't need to be embedded into the binary. (IANAL)

14:23 <bentomo> Ok thanks! I wanted to make sure there wasn't an extra technical baggage component just because of obscure licensing. Real legal stuff I'd reach out to a lawyer for.

14:24 <tpw_rules> i think this is actually language lawyering :)

14:25 <tpw_rules> IANAL either, but it's saying the redistribution must reproduce the notices in the documentation, not that the binary must somehow autonomously reproduce it

14:26 <tpw_rules> https://opensource.stackexchange.com/questions/7278/clarification-of-bsds-second-clause-binary-must-reproduce-copyright-notice

14:27 <tpw_rules> lots of software does the latter these days but you can simply include the license with the bitstream or other product documentation like whitequark said

14:36 <bentomo> Right that makes sense. It's just a lot harder to include the license if I build a really simple module that uses amaranth, but was required to include a bram and a bus since there was no FW included to print it out. Trying to explain open source to old hardware codgers is difficult... it's not hard to be compliant

15:38 <tpw_rules> i guess i'm not sure why you would ever need to include a system to print out the license from the bitstream. you just need to make sure that instead of putting the bitstream up for download or whatever, you instead put a zip file of the bitstream and the license

15:49 <d1b2> <dragonmux> or, iwrc, clearly display the license to get to the download, if you prefer

17:55 <d1b2> <bob_twinkles> Just don't make people "accept" the BSD license like it's a ToS 🙂

22:58 <d1b2> <j4cbo> so i'm learning Amaranth and working on a small design that will need to use DDR I/O (not like DDR SDRAM, just setting an ice40 SB_IO in DDR mode)... it looks like the stdlib Pin object will do this for me, I don't need to instantiate an SB_IO by hand, but I can't find any examples of doing so

23:00 <d1b2> <j4cbo> relatedly, I want to get a better understanding of the relationship between Resource, Record, Pin, Pins, etc., and what exactly platform.request returns, but the docs are sparse there 😦

23:00 <adamgreig[m]> something like: pin = platform.request("my_pin", xdr=2); m.d.comb += pin.o_clk.eq(ClockSignal()), pin.o0.eq(1), pin.o1.eq(0)

23:01 <adamgreig[m]> if you request something with sub-signals, you can use xdr={"sub": 2} instead, and if it's an input there's i_clk and i0 and i1, or all six and also oe for bidi pins