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<d_bot_>
<Boby> is there a way to put type in function declaration without using tuples ?
<d_bot_>
<Boby> for example let f a b = a + b could be let f (a, b : int * int) : int = a + b, but it use tuples right ?
<d_bot_>
<Boby> how can I put paramter types without using tuples ?
<d_bot_>
<NULL> `let f : int -> int -> int = fun a b -> a + b` or `let f (a: int) (b: int) : int = a + b`
<d_bot_>
<Boby> Yes thanks !
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<companion_cube>
hum, did statmemprof disappear??
<companion_cube>
I don't even see it in ocaml-variants :(
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<rgrinberg>
i don't think you need special compiler for statmemprof anymore
<companion_cube>
yeah, it seems not
<companion_cube>
that's quite cool
<companion_cube>
also, memtrace is nicer than expected (there's useful CLI tools alongside the core library)
<rgrinberg>
yeah, it's not too bad
<rgrinberg>
kind of a pain to install the viewer
<companion_cube>
that's the point: you don't really need the viewer
<companion_cube>
memtrace_hotspots and memtrace_flamegraph are already quite nice
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<d_bot_>
<Anurag> thanks to the cli tools I haven't needed to install the viewer in a long time.
<d_bot_>
<Anurag> I stopped using the viewer when I upgraded to ocaml 4.12 as the current version of the viewer on opam only works on ocaml 4.11.x
<d_bot_>
<Anurag> and I couldn't be bothered to maintain a separate 4.11 switch just to compile the viewer..
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<companion_cube>
well it's good to know that there's a lean solution now
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<d_bot_>
<undu> I'm just updating the ocaml used for xapi to 4.13 just for the profiler
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<d_bot_>
<myrkraverk> Thanks, I'll look into that.
<d_bot_>
<orbitz> 4.13 looks like it has a lot of goodies in it
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> I was gonna follow "White you a Scheme" in Haskell but reading through the intro it looks like they use a lib Parsec that does most of the work lmao. Anyone know of any decent tutorials which build a simple language implementation without delegating most of the work to a library?
<Armael>
I assume Parsec only handles parsing? There are many other interesting things to tackle to implement a scheme-like language
<d_bot_>
<octachron> Parsing is not really most of the work, and it is mostly tedious without a library or a parser generator. You can replace `parsec` by a hand-written recursive descent parser or write your own version of `parsec`.
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> why tf is a bot speaking to me
<Armael>
:| rude
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> I don't know haskell nearlyyy well enough to write my own lol. I just saw in the book it says
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> > The lexer and parser are contained in a single library, Parsec, which does most of the work for us
<d_bot_>
<NULL> Read the channel description and be more respectful please
<Armael>
"most of the work" for parsing
<d_bot_>
<octachron> in other words, you can let `parsec` handles the parsing if you are not particularly interested by this part.
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> I didn't know "Bridged to IRC" meant "IRC users will appear as bots." That should probably me made clearer, but thanks.
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> ahh ok
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> I'm interested in it, but I don't know haskell well enough to take that part of the book and handle it one my own.
<Armael>
I'd just follow the book then, you can still come back later and implement a hand-rolled parser if you want
<d_bot_>
<NULL> I'm pretty sure Discord does no bridging natively, so it's always a bot doing it (hence the tag)
<d_bot_>
<DepartureAM> Yeah makes sense, thanks for the suggestions 🙂
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<theblatte>
a
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<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> @DepartureAM you can always make learning parsing a separate project, but as others suggest it's not the most substantial part of making a language
<mbuf>
OCaml Mach IR refers to the Intermediate Representation format?
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<d_bot_>
<d4hines> Yesterday I mentioned I'm trying to use `Lwt_domain.detch` and `Lwt_process.pmap` together but it fails because you can't create a Unix fork after you've already created a domain. @octachron 's suggestion was to use `Unix.create_process` and friends instead. We tried doing that here: https://github.com/d4hines/multicore-with-lwt/tree/with-nodejs, but our external program fails with an `EAGAIN` error. Basically I think we're not
<sadiq>
that last comment seems like an argument for the PR.
<zozozo>
agreed
<Corbin>
Ugh, I recognize this mindset. It's the same POV that eventually leads to Elm's stagnation. "Things must stay; there must be no change."
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<companion_cube>
here it's the opposite, in a way, from Alain
<companion_cube>
"things might change, don't leak this obvious part of the implementation"
<Corbin>
Yep. Your reply is sometimes called Hbomberguy's argument; you are pointing out that a buffer of bytes more-or-less *must* have a sequence of bytes somewhere in its implementation.
<d_bot_>
<Et7f3> So now we will have CCBuffer ?
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<companion_cube>
Corbin: yes, because it does, and is used by people knowing that it does
<companion_cube>
if you want something different, go for it, just in a different module.
<companion_cube>
(you could also replace Map.Make with an association list, and it'd be breaking as well)
<olle>
My new colleague is advocating for TypeScript for the static typing.
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<olle>
"Can you tell you about my friend, ReactML/ReScript/OCaml??"
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<companion_cube>
Corbin: why "hbomberguy's argument" btw? to which video does it refer to?
<Corbin>
companion_cube: It refers to a viral moment from https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLqXkYrdmjY in which it is pointed out that, definitionally, an occupied house must have occupants, as an argument against paying lip-service to an unchanging facade. They're talking about a beach, you're talking about an API, but it's definitely an instance.
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<companion_cube>
ok
<companion_cube>
but here we do have some constraints
<companion_cube>
the API can change, but only in non breaking ways, for example
<companion_cube>
that's no up to discussion
<Corbin>
Is there a process for introducing new facades on an existing API? Or is it only done on an ad-hoc basis, in times of emergency?
<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> ah design pattern, my favourite topic in uni
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<Corbin>
"One frequently constructs a facade to put a congenial 'pretty face' on the unpleasantness that is swept under the rug. Once these messy chunks of code have been quarantined, you can expose their functionality using intention-revealing selectors."
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<Corbin>
Yeah, it sucks to deal with this stuff, but it's obligatory for managing decades-long software projects. APIs have to be introduced and removed somehow. It can get worse: Some large corporations have New Product Introduction APIs, and you call an API to declare that you're creating a new API.
<d_bot_>
<VPhantom> @companion_cube This is how I ended up with my own `Buffer`-like personal buffer module, so I could have better reading operations on extensible buffers. (Under the hood, I implemented it wrapped around Bigstring, Buffer and Bytes to accommodate various needs.)
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<companion_cube>
Corbin: that sounds like GoF gloubiboulga indeed
<companion_cube>
here we're talking about a freaking byte buffer
<companion_cube>
something where it's important that some functions take literally a few instructions
<companion_cube>
(like `add_char` in the happy path)
<companion_cube>
there's no facading that shit
<Corbin>
companion_cube: I've worked on and seen runtimes where even byte buffers might have underlying optimized representations. Short buffers, uninitialized buffers, buffers with just a few bytes repeated over and over in a pattern, etc.
<Corbin>
I agree that, in this case, there's no such excuse. Too much is already promised in the docs.
<companion_cube>
I could imagine a `Buffer.create` that doesn't initialize the content
<companion_cube>
in the docs, and in 23 years of code using the thing and observing its behavior, too.
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<d_bot_>
<blub> -"Can we have a List.take/drop in stdlib?"
<d_bot_>
<blub> - "What are the usecases for such functions?"
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<d_bot_>
<hcarty> Asking for use cases makes sense - if a function isn't general purpose it probably shouldn't be added to the standard library. The buffer issue is more nuanced since it's not possible to match on a buffer's representation
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<companion_cube>
yeah, List.drop is doable (and done) in an external library
<d_bot_>
<blub> Vector to stdlib proposal anyone?
<companion_cube>
there's one already
<companion_cube>
I mean there's an issue.
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<companion_cube>
I think I'd explode if I tried to propose a PR on that one
<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> : D
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<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> though if a good implementation of things is in containers etc, does it matter too much?
<d_bot_>
<blub> Yeah, I'm talking about that one
<companion_cube>
I'm fine with using my vector, although it's a pity there isn't one to serve as a common vocabulary
<d_bot_>
<blub> I kinda like the approach of ocaml wrt that language/stdlib changes should be properly reviewed thought out, but
<d_bot_>
<blub> Is there a list.map that doesn't stack overflow?
<d_bot_>
<blub> - what would be your usecase for that?
<GreaseMonkey>
i confess i'm quite new to OCaml and also only somewhat experienced with the functional programming stuff, but i'm actually quite curious as to why List.take/drop aren't in the stdlib
<d_bot_>
<blub> But then again it's finally solved
<d_bot_>
<blub> What are your usecases for that?
<d_bot_>
<Et7f3> list.rev_map |> list.rev
<d_bot_>
<undu> take and drop are actually useful, I don't understand the resistance to add them
<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> ill say those happen more often in seq
<d_bot_>
<Et7f3> maybe exception handling
<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> which Seq does not contain : D
<d_bot_>
<Et7f3> because drop/take is pattern matching
<d_bot_>
<Et7f3> so do you want to call a function for a if ?
<d_bot_>
<darrenldl> idk about matching 70 things : D
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<d_bot_>
<blub> traversing the list twice
<GreaseMonkey>
...i'm now wondering how many use cases would be of the form `take e (drop b l)` and how many would be of the form `((take n l), (drop n l))`
<d_bot_>
<blub> But yeah it's not hard to write the function yourself
<d_bot_>
<blub> Or just use containers/base
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<companion_cube>
oh right, I'll have to optimize it to use TRMC :D
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<d_bot_>
<Et7f3> You asked that doesn't stack overflow. With new ocaml naive list.map and TRMC attribute it won't stack overflow. IIRC it is not activated by default
<companion_cube>
yep
<companion_cube>
but it can help implementing a stack safe version
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