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<d1b2>
<esden> Do I see it right that GPIB could be implemented using Glasgow? ... According to the wikipedia article it requires 8 data lines and 8 control lines https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEEE-488 ... it is also TTL signalling so 3v3? | I wrote all the previous stuff before checking... | Ok... well there is already an issue for this https://github.com/GlasgowEmbedded/glasgow/issues/287 ... anyone interested to work on this? 😉
<d1b2>
<esden> (I was watching @tnt having fun with a $500 GPIB adapter today ... and that was just OOF)
<tpw_rules>
i am sure it would be 5v
<tpw_rules>
also $500 is a bargain for them.....
<tpw_rules>
a glasgow interface would be pretty cool, but software compatibility would reduce the value a bit in some cases. still i would use it
<tpw_rules>
if i can ever get a glasgow 😬
<tpw_rules>
a kilt or whatever they ended up being called would be useful too, the connector and cabling is standardized
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<d1b2>
<esden> Yeah, I agree, that the connector adapter would is needed here. I think the protocol implementation and compatibility is the bigger problem. That said, the adapter that tnt used did not even properly implement the TCP stack that it was forwarding GPIB to... which is just crazy in my opinion... he had to add some random delays so that the adapter did not get overwhelmed, and it still was stalling on the test sweeps.
<d1b2>
<esden> that is a bit of a shocker for an expensive adapter like this
<d1b2>
<esden> but not so shocking considering how terrible the interface adapters for labview are ... (this is something I had the "pleasure" to see in action)
<tpw_rules>
which one? i've used the NI USB ones. it was rock solid and plug and play
<tpw_rules>
but the physical gpib protocol is rather simple iirc. but if you want to connect it to manufacturer software then it gets more complicated
<d1b2>
<esden> those are $900 or more
<d1b2>
<esden> that is insane....
<tpw_rules>
at least it did work
<d1b2>
<esden> ... sorry but the price is nuts
<tpw_rules>
absolutely
<d1b2>
<esden> for $500 one would expect the TCP stack to be solid ... I get that the GPIB compatibility might be an issue on some devices ... which might require significant amount of additional effort and access to a lot of expensive test equipment to get right. But they should say that and not screw up on the part that they have 100% control over. 🙂
<tpw_rules>
iirc the adapter itself does relatively little on the protocol.
<d1b2>
<esden> Ok, that is what I remember when I dug into GPIB USB stuff on tektronix scopes... (just the linux driver was really a terrible hack that did not work right and I did not have time to fix it)
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> I have some serious pet peeves with gpib adapters. Like agilent not recognizing the USB version from in a virtual machine.
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> I haven't tested / built that adapter I just found it when I was looking a while ago.
<d1b2>
<esden> heh... yeah I found this project when I googled for open source GPIB stuff too... I am curious how well it works
<d1b2>
<Hardkrash> Was it the Prologix Ethernet adapter?
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> I was using the NI one. Which can be found for 'only' about 100$ on ebay sometimes
<d1b2>
<Hardkrash> Earlier in my career I would use the RS-232 to GPIB adapter as the USB and Ethernet were practically Windows only. I switched to the USB and Ethernet Prologix adapters.
<d1b2>
<Hardkrash> NI adapters that is
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> If agilent would just support their old spectrophotometer software a little better I wouldn't be salty, but as it stands some of that equipment locks you into windows XP / 7 not inside a virtual machine
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<d1b2>
<esden> Getting the GPIB stuff to work on linux was a double challenge... but on windows one had to use windows and in many cases even labview which is "fun"
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> Yeah... Had to install 4 labview runtimes on a coworkers new computer last night, because of course different internal utilities were built in different versions.
<d1b2>
<esden> Ugh... I wonder why I hate labview with a passion... 😉
<d1b2>
<esden> It is very interesting why it became such a popular solution with so little alternatives/competition.
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> Pretty easy to write relatively stable reliable utilities for non programmers
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> That's the main advantage I see, easy UI and some pre written stuff like drivers and their whole queue driven state machine structure
<d1b2>
<esden> I know... but long term support is a nightmare
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> I hate maintaining it with a passion
<d1b2>
<esden> and stability is questionable
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> Oh yeah
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<d1b2>
<esden> But yes, it is easy to slap together a compelling UI with very little prior know how
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<d1b2>
<TEM01*> We have a very very large complicated program that my predecessor lost the version that still compiled properly. I feel the pain on maintaining it.
<d1b2>
<Hardkrash> Throw it away and rewrite it... Seriously the technical debt sounds as crippling as some of the programs I've just done that and it is so much faster and less headache.
<d1b2>
<Hardkrash> even if you have to use labview still...
<d1b2>
<TEM01*> We are, and getting away from labview. Just taking a while and production must go on in the meantime.
<d1b2>
<tnt> @Hardkrash yeah it's the prologix gpib ethernet adapter.
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<d1b2>
<blackbit> i think a well-done, open GPIB interface would be useful. an article i've read a while ago says that the requirements are rather different if you only want to support being a controller or also a non-controller talker. the latter is required to react to ATN commands within 200ns and seize activity on the bus, which is a bit challenging with a uC and interrupts, hence an FPGA implementation would be good. i guess the question is how important
<d1b2>
it is being able to participate on the bus as something else than a controller. most of the time you want to exercise some instrument
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<electronic_eel>
@blackbit one usecase for not being the controller is emulating a gpib floppy or gpib printer. those are used by some older advanced test gear like spectrum analyzers or network analyzers to store data or print measurement results
<d1b2>
<tnt> @blackbit I think there are some OSS ones over USB but I really wanted a network one.
<d1b2>
<tnt> Well I have it now 😅 (And for a while. Don't remember how much I paid, but nowhere close to 500 eur. I think it was 150-200 or so. Not great but not as bonkers).
<d1b2>
<tnt> But interesting project. I'd just hope someone had made like an esp32 one or something and preferrably with a network connection compatible with the network module from agilent or such so that it's directly usable by apps.
<whitequark>
i'd have done a GPIB thing already if i had anything with GPIB
<whitequark>
but i dont think i do
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<d1b2>
<tnt> Didn't you have an older sampling scope for the serdes work ? I'd imagine that has gpib ?
<whitequark>
hah, in the end a friend did said serdes work without ever touching the scope, she just used a rigol to bring up 5 Gbps USB...
<whitequark>
but yeah it's still around and that thing is so heavy and annoying...
<whitequark>
I don't have any desk that fits it
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