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<hackinghorn>
hi
<hackinghorn>
it looks like I can't compare string: if "a"="b" then "c" else "d", the if always expects an int?
<rgrinberg>
hackinghorn if you're using base, you should write if String.equal "a" "b" then ...
<hackinghorn>
ahh thankss rgrinberg
<hackinghorn>
how do I negate String.equal
<hackinghorn>
is it !(String equal ..)
<hackinghorn>
or not (String.equal .. )
<rgrinberg>
the latter
<hackinghorn>
ahh thankss
<rgrinberg>
Or String.(<>)
<hackinghorn>
wow thats weird
<rgrinberg>
Yes, it is a bit unconventional.
<rgrinberg>
Still, I'm pretty sure other languages like basic or pascal have the same convention. So it's not unheard of
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<hackinghorn>
wait a minute, -1 is not of type int
<hackinghorn>
thats weird
<vsiles>
why do you say this ?
<d_bot>
<Splingush> If you are using it like `float -1`, you either need parenthesis `float (-1)` or use the unary symbol `float ~-1` due to confusion with the binary operator `-`
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<hackinghorn>
yeah, I try to use it in functions: f str -1 and it should be f str (-1)
<hackinghorn>
I tried f str -1 and the error message is "f str is of type ... , expected int" then I don't know what is happening, making me do like 3 hours debugging
<d_bot>
<NULL> Well in the base case, - is a binary operator expecting 2 ints, and you are giving it `f str` and `1` as arguments, so it complains that `f str` is not an int. What was the problem with `f str (-1)`
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<hackinghorn>
the only problem is I spent 3 hours to figure this out
<hackinghorn>
maybe 4
<hackinghorn>
otherwise okayy
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<d_bot>
<andreypopp> What would be the reference for typing rules of OCaml's module language and its interaction with core language typing?
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<companion_cube>
probably the manual for the basics
<companion_cube>
and papers for the details
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<d_bot>
<andreypopp> yeah... I hoped there is THE paper for that
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<d_bot>
<mbacarella> does anyone successfully use fftw3 in an async/lwt/threaded app? I get segfaults in the ocaml heap when i try
<d_bot>
<froyo> i think it's a good no-frills low-key introduction to fp
<d_bot>
<froyo> or well, there are some frills, but they're just sitting there without being made a big deal
<d_bot>
<froyo> get beginners hooked on the stuff then watch them wanting to exit the browser and looking for an actual ML
<d_bot>
<froyo> likely OCaml :P
<companion_cube>
not sure beginners want to exit the browser, these days
<Corbin>
I live near a university which uses Haskell for first-year computer-science students. I don't think that it's a serious barrier.
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<d_bot>
<froyo> it probably isn't a serious barrier if they use the component-writing style in their assignments... write a function and have it pass all tests.. If they do hackerrank-style assignments where they receive their values via IO and print their results out, or if they use Haskell in writing conventional imperative algorithms, they have to deal with the IO monad and IORef stuff right off the bad, which is a thick topic for an absolute b
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<d_bot>
<salt rock lamp> i think there's some merit to it, if they're an absolute beginner, they're just following patterns blindly anyway
<d_bot>
<salt rock lamp> by the time they know any better, they won't be a beginner anymore
<d_bot>
<salt rock lamp> it's like how babies can learn arbitrarily complicated languages, but for adults some languages can be harder to learn than others
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<oriba>
is there well known way to use sml code as libraries to be used by Ocaml programs?
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<d_bot>
<froyo> > if they're an absolute beginner, they're just following patterns blindly anyway
<d_bot>
<froyo> > it's like how babies can learn arbitrarily complicated languages, but for adults some languages can be harder to learn than others
<d_bot>
<froyo> that's a super interesting way to look at it actually 👀
<olle>
Baby brains are special :)
<d_bot>
<froyo> tru
<d_bot>
<froyo> i wonder if we keep some of our baby-brain abilities for completely foreign skills
<companion_cube>
oriba: not that I know of
<olle>
froyo, baby brains lose a shitload of neurons at a certain age, some kind of cunning
<companion_cube>
a lot of synapses, I think? not full neurons?
<olle>
wrong word (cunning)
<olle>
companion_cube: oh, idk
<olle>
maybe you're right
<companion_cube>
"synaptic pruning"
<olle>
right
<olle>
anyway - changeability predictors!
<olle>
you want em, I got em :)
<olle>
Or not!
<olle>
"Our results suggest that there is little
<olle>
evidence on the effectiveness of software
<olle>
maintainability prediction techniques and models."
<olle>
I can't write a blog post on that :(
<olle>
Negative results gather no moss, nor Facebook likes
<companion_cube>
blog posts is exactly where it's fine to publish negative results though?
<Armael>
pretty sure that doing research is not the most efficient way of getting facebook likes
<companion_cube>
unless your tenure track forces you to have a high p-index
<d_bot>
<RegularSpatula> not sure if c-cube knew that or not tho 🙂
<d_bot>
<RegularSpatula> h-index is "supposed" to measure scholarly output/impact
<olle>
aha
<olle>
you get grant money for h-index, then?
<Armael>
it really depends on the institutions, but sometimes it is used to evaluate grant applications yes
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<d_bot>
<RegularSpatula> dang i haven't heard of h-index making or breaking a grant for people i know luckily
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<olle>
It seems impossible for me to find evidence-based maintainbaility metrics -.-
<olle>
maintainability*
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<olle>
Why isn't that common knowledge??
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<d_bot>
<salt rock lamp> perhaps you meant "culling"
<olle>
Perhaps
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<olle>
Ooooh, a study from my home town :D
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<olle>
0.4 correlation between metrics and mean-time-to-repair
<olle>
Bah
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<d_bot>
<geoff> Getting reliable evidence that one pattern is better than another is pretty difficult in SEng since there are so many factors that can't adequately be controlled for
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<d_bot>
<geoff> Getting enough of data that would be fair to compare/group without confounds would be pretty hard for most questions
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<olle>
Maybe
<olle>
There is research, but seems there's more on fault prediction than on maintainability prediction
<d_bot>
<monk> pyret looks nice but we just had a similar conversation the other day in #beginners over Lisp and besides my (dated) suggestion of Touretzky's *Common Lisp: A Gentle Introduction to Symbolic Computation*, someone else mentioned How To Design Programs (https://htdp.org/2018-01-06/Book/) which has it's own custom PL derived from racket
<d_bot>
<monk> and builtin support via Dr. Racket as a comprehensive pedagogical oriented language to learn with
<d_bot>
<monk> oh wow, pyret is implemented with JS? that's interesting
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<hackinghorn>
hi, I'm using OCaml, if I print a Value as string (string_of_llvalue), it has debug location !20, but if I print Module as a string, the debug location is !29, did I do something wrong or what happened?
<hackinghorn>
*the debug location of that particular Value (instruction) in the Module*